Tuesday, June 18, 2013
Good morning:
We now have a pool of 33 prospective jurors (PJs) passed for cause on the issues of pretrial publicity and hardship. Judge Nelson wants to enlarge the pool to 40 and then switch to group voir dire on other subjects.
There is a slight chance that will happen today, but it is more likely to happen tomorrow, possibly during the morning session.
Here is the updated list of 33 PJs for your scorecard:
1. B-12 F 40s-50s White
2. B-29 F 40s Black
3. B-76 F 50s-60s White
4. B-7 M 40s-50s White
5. B-35 M 40s-50s Black
6. B-37 F 50s White
7. B-51 F 60s-70s White
8. B-55 F 20s E. Indian
9. B-86 F 50s White
10.E-6 F 20s-30s White
11.E-40 F 50s-60s White
12.E-54 M 60s-70s White
13.E-73 F 60s White
14.M-75 F 30s Black
15.B-61 F 20s White
16.B-72 M 20s White/Bi-racial
17.E-22 F 50-60 Black
18.E-13 F 20s White
19.E-28 F 50s-60s White
20.K-80 F 40s-50s White
21.K-95 F 40s-50s White
22.P-67 M 40s-50 Hispanic
23.G-14 F 40s-50s White
24.G-29 F 30s Black
25.G-47 M 20s White
26.G-63 M 20s Mixed
27.G-66 F 50s White
28.G-81 M 30s-40s Black
29.H-6 M 30s-40s White
30.H-7 M
31.H18 M
32.H29 M
33.H35 F
As I have previously described the likely process:
When she gets to 40, she will gather that group together seating the PJs in the jury box, and subsequently the benches, in the order in which they were called and likely instruct them to raise their hands indicating an affirmative answer as she asks a series of questions, pausing to record each PJ’s affirmative answer to each question.
For example, she might ask for a show of hands by each PJ who has been a victim of a crime and write down each PJs number who raises their hand.
After she completes her list of questions, the lawyers, starting with Bernie de la Rionda, will question the first PJ on the list (B12) regarding each question she answered affirmatively. After both lawyers have finished with B12, they will pass or challenge her for cause. If she is excused, she will be replaced in the box by PJ B51 (she is 7th in the order).
This process will be repeated with B51 until she is passed or excused for cause. If she is excused, her seat will be taken by B55. If she is passed, the lawyers will question B29, the PJ in the second seat in the box.
This procedure likely will be followed until 30 PJs have been passed for cause.
Then the lawyers will exercise their peremptory challenges, which is usually done secretly with the lawyers passing back and forth a sheet of paper alternately listing a PJ number until one or both sides exhaust their allotment of peremptory challenges.
If one side accepts the jury of 6 before exhausting their peremptories, they retain the right to use a peremptory challenge to excuse the PJ who replaces a member of the jury struck by their opponent after they accepted the jury.
We have a little less than an hour before court resumes.
Here’s a little video that brought back a lot of memories about what it’s like to be a criminal defense attorney.
Warning: Remove liquids or be prepared to sacrifice your laptop.
Note: The Frye hearing will resume tomorrow at 4 pm with the prosecution’s rebuttal.
Here’s the link to the livestream coverage.
http://wildabouttrial.com/george-zimmerman-live-stream.html
Court resumes at 9 am EDT.
See you in court.
New post up:
Welcome to Day 8 Liveblogging Jury Selection in Zimmerman Trial
New post up:
Zimmerman: Day 7 of Jury Selection Completed
I just voted “No”
http://www.hlntv.com/poll/2013/06/18/george-zimmerman-good-neighbor
58% have No. Too bad they didn’t have “Hell NO!” vote.
how come no one finds adam sandler in his red hooded sweatshirt threatening?
http://vimeo.com/56602082
inquiring minds want to know
LOL – cuz it’s not up?? Cuz it’s red?
Adam sandler isn’t brandishing skittles.
“how come no one finds adam sandler in his red hooded sweatshirt threatening?”
Maybe they’ve never seen one of his movies? 🙂
How is it possible that they made it to 40? How many jurors did they interview today? They had 33 last night. So they took everyone who was interviewed.
Only 1 was excused.
I don’t think that bodes well for the prosecution.
John Phillips (attorney for Jordan Davis’ family) says that a fair jury cannot be found with these 40 people.
I’m afraid I think the same. Too many blatant bigots were passed through to the 2nd round.
All they need is 6. And the prosecution has 10 strikes to weed out the worst. I woulnd’t put too much stock into his pessisim.
Yep, I agree. I think there is a jury in that pool for a guilty verdict. I think it will be a lot harder for the defense to get an acquittal.
@ Cielo62
I concur.
Especially if at least two are as naive about details and facts as they claim. Once the State starts its rat-a-tat-tat of evidence in response to MOM’s hokem-schmokem, a just verdict should be forthcoming.
If there are 16 decent jurors to be had (an open question) then the defense could knock out ten and still leave six. But there has to be six in a row after prosecution exercised its ten peremptories.
@cielo62
I agree, and I don’t care how many times that arse-hole keeps looking at me!
Guess what? I’m looking right back at ’em! Cuz I ain’t afraid of no ghost! 🙂
Sleuth~ OH yeah! You got that right! Gz is getting to be as white as a ghost realizing his fate! Everything about him is just plain creepy; his beady little eyes and his whispery pedo voice.
Posting on the internet is frustrating because you can’t detect tone and it’s hard to have a real discussion. I wasn’t blasting anyone. Xena chastised me for attributing words to Mr. Phillips. I decided to go to twitter and give her the exact wording that he used. The “expecting” comment was in response to Xena.
Tzar made a comment saying people laughing at a 911 parody were wrong. I simply said I noticed something similar here.
I had no idea that my usage of the word murder would cause a ruckus. I hope it’s all clear now. I have his exact wording and I am not here to change how this community relates to one another. Mr. Leathermen and his wife use colorful language and they probably have no problem with the humor, I have seen Crane use it. I only mentioned the humor because of the laughs from the PJ.
I am just happy that the trial is near, no more trying the case in the media from M’OM.
Have a nice evening.
@Shari.
If I wrote anything that you deem chastizing, that happened after I turned a negative into a positive and you then said that the word “murder” that you attributed to John Philip may have been your word.
Whether you used the word “murder” and Philip did or didn’t has the same result IMO; i.e., GZ is credible when testifying about “murder.” He certainly is not credible when it comes to his statements about “self-defense.”
What do you find wrong with that?
That’s not true. You told me to see the comment on Twitter. I Googled for his Twitter and the return was more than 10 pages with the name “John Philip” with various handles.
Your use of the word “murder” caused no ruckus. Rather, I think you took exception that I agreed with the word “murder” as opposed to “self-defense.” Remember, it is you who said you may have used the wrong word.
Please post it.
It’s posted in the thread. I’m not computer savvy so instead of a screen shot of the tweet I typed it out for you.
I’m glad it’s all cleared up. Nice lesson I learned today. Words are powerful. Use them wisely.
@Shari.
I just did a screen search for your name, reading your comments, and did not find where you typed out/posted the tweet. Also, I receive comments via email, but did not receive any comment that you made that contained the tweet.
Could you have posted it on another page in the blog rather than replying to my comment?
I share your fears, but I am determined to remain hopeful. Sitting in a jury box is not the same as sitting in your normal space. In a jury box you see yourself as doing one of the most serious jobs you could be doing on a moral level, and there is an intense desire to do the right thing. At least that was my experience as a juror. In this case the RIGHT thing is justice for the child that was murdered.
True. But we’ve seen juries (especially in the South) do the wrong thing for many years.
@Concerned, I don’t hold out to much hope that they will find one either. that thought has been on my mind for a long time. it’s real shameful, that some in this country can see fit to treat this kid and his family in such a harsh manner. but, when something like this happens to one of their own, THEY LOOK FOR SYMPATHY FROM THE MASSES AND, THEY BELIEVE THEY ARE ENTITLED TO SUCH.
Phillips also thinks that Fogen will be his own best witness. He said Fogen in his view was very credible in his telling of the murder.
Shari~ Then Phillips is an absolute idiot or living with his head in the sand. CREDIBLE? With at leat 5 different stories ALL RECORDED? Which one does he think is “credible?” Do yourself a favor; ditch Phillips and all his crap.
Credible in telling of the murder
I agree. Not credible at all in the telling of killing in self-defense. 😉
I don’t want to put words in his mouth. I used the word murder. You can look up his tweets. He is John Phillips attorney for the mother of the black child who was killed for playing loud music by the drunk wedding attendee.
@Shari. I don’t have a Twitter account and when I Googled John Phillips and Twitter, more than 10 pages returned with various handles along with the name.
If you paraphrased what he said, you should have said so. You might want to go back to your source in order to quote him verbatim so that there’s no misunderstanding.
Xena~ John M. Phillips. I looked up under Dunn Murder. OR, have more fun and google John Phillip Souza!
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@cielo62. Yeah — Google tried defaulting to John Phillip Souza.
I know of attorney Philip who is representing Jordan Davis’ parents. He contributes to a blog and I’ve kept up with his postings. Dunn’s trial is scheduled to begin in October. But I still don’t have a Twitter account and don’t see why we should be expected to verify a statement purportedly stated by anyone when it’s “quoted” here.
You seem very offended by my error. I’m not sure what you want me to say. I clarified it for you. I am not a reporter and I don’t think my blog comment was slanderous. I don’t expect anything from you. Maybe you all have been investigating and you expect a different class of commenter here? I’m just venting and learning about the case.
I was just venting about something I read on twitter a few days? ago. I was going to go look up the tweet but I am making dinner for my children. It looks like you are finding the info.
@Shari.
All I did was respond to what you wrote, emphasizing that the word “murder” does apply to GZ’s credibility, but “self-defense” does not. You then said that the person you quoted may not have used the word “murder.”
Did I say you were slanderous? No. Only thing is, if you’re going to give attribution to someone for saying something, especially something that you disagree with, it is important to get whatever they wrote correct.
Just the opposite — when I tried using your suggestion, there were too many returns in the search result. I have no need to prove you right or wrong — just wanted to help you out since you said that he might not have used the word “murder.”
Here you go fellow justice warrior:
John M. Phillips, practices in Florida, Georgia, and Alabama
“Listening to these interviews, I just keep wishing George never got out of his car. He has a case, but his team hasn’t done him any favors.”
“He has a consistent defense-like it or not. Credibility aside, he is a pretty compelling witness in some of these early meetings.” (So I got the credible part wrong)
Shari~ Chill out! I didn’t say I couldn’t find it. I found it just fine. I just think that whatever HE says is rather irrelevant to this and is probably nothing more than a talking head for ratings. HENCE he’s ratings-baiting and can be discounted as being any real credible source. BTW, I’m not sure who you are blasting here. Me or Xena? OBVIOUSLY you expect SOMETHING or you wouldn’t be posting. And venting is fine. We do it all the time. But not by criticizing fellow posters. And scolding us for our humor is not nice, either. Have a nice supper! See you tomorrow at 9am EST.
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Oh, right. And who is Phllips? Some kind of talk show host or commentator? Would he be taking a position (no matter what he personally thinks) to build audience share?
Trained Observer~ “a talking head.”
he did? that’s crazy. Hollywood could not write a better piece of fantasy as Zimmerman’s story.
The kid is a thief casing houses, then a taunter walking around the car, and.finally he’s an unarmed Steven Seagal trying to take a guy out.
.
Now there’s a funny one, obviously this man has listen to none of the tapes and/or followed any of the analysis. Foggen can’t be the best witness for himself, because he impeaches himself constantly, nor can he explain why the evidence doesn’t match his story.
Mr. Phillips should have a talk with O’Mara and see if O’Mara thinks that putting gz on the stand is going to make this case an easy win. The mere fact that after almost a year of harping on how the immunity hearing was going to set gz free, they came into court under pressure to decide the issue, and waived the immunity hearing. That should tell everyone that gz has no preponderance of evidence on his side. The bail hearing tapes should tell them that gz hasn’t the credibility to put his side across. Then look at the reenactment and see how gz struggles to change the story he previously told.
But hey, don’t let the facts stop anyone from thinking whatever they want. Sure, go ahead and put gz on the stand, persist in thinking that’s he best hope. It is to laugh! It’s like saying that Torquemada would make a good replacement for Mother Teresa. A joke, a complete joke and nothing but a joke!
Professor,
So that finally chose 40 pj’s. How long do you feel this next phase will take?
Depends on who asks the questions ! If its west….. Forever.
Thanks Willis.
Good point about The Wiester.
2 days
Professor thanks, and they can’t come soon enough.
Finally made it to 40!
Well, everybody have a Blessed rest of the evening… or a good evening… lol
Make sure you watch them Hatch Twins… some good looking men… mmmm hmmm wished I was younger.. lmao..
do they know these cameras are still on…
Hopefully well under 10
Hopefully none that will make it on the jury! *fingers crossed*
How many of those 40 were foul bigots? I remember about 5 or so being very blatant about it.
And we got 10 strikes to ferret them out.
Waiting to see how short his chair is set, or his his bum slipping under distortion of the chair seat.
Camera angle rises with them, doesn’t show chair backs.
B12, B29, B76, B7, B35, B37, B51, B85, E6, E40, E54, E73, M75, B61, B72, E22, E13, E28, K80, P67, G14, G29, G47, G63, G66, G81, H6, H7, H18, H29, H35, H81, H69, H86, I5, I19, I24, I33, and I44 General Voir Dire in the am
K95
When Fogen leaned back in the chair just now I was hoping it would snap and he would fall on floor. Is that mean?
Yes, but so what? LOL
LOL, you’ve been listening to a few too many pj’s!!!
Not unless he breaks his neck and becomes a quadriplegic.
Fogen leaned back in his chair
Listening to Voir Dire
It snaps an pops in mid air
Hitting the floor he cried out in a gasp
Oww that hurt my fat azz
Yes, but take comfort in the fact that you aren’t alone in your meanness.
WEll, he would move fast. He’s been holding a position with nads crossed and forward stare, motionless with head perch except for eye blinks.
Until he gets a distraction. Chair fall would maybe help him pass a few moments thinking about that.
lol, nads crossed…. will leave that to your imagination!! (hands too)
Well with all those replies I am the one on the floor lmao!
There are things I prefer not to imagine. This is one.
@disappointed, LMAO and, buddy what a sight that would be. who is the handkerchief head AA sitting behind the defense team and, why haven’t we seen her before now?
Well played, mams and sirs here.
Nap time now. Pleasant everything to you all.
http://www.9news.com/news/article/341183/71/Tornado-warning-issued-near-DIA
Hope it’s a miss! Do you have a basement? I spent many a long hour in ours during storms in the midwest as a child.
Holy moly – Denver! That’s kind of unusual, isn’t it?
not lately… like we have something goin on like once every other year… or two years in Denver…
wow, I didn’t know that. But then Denver has mountains on one side and plains on the other.
The Top 40:
1. B-12
2. B-29
3. B-76
4. B-7
5. B-35
6. B-37
7. B-51
8. B-86
9. E-6
10. E-40
11. E–54
12. E-73
13. M-75
14. B-61
15. B-72
16. E-22
17. E13
18. E-28
19. K-80
20.K-95
21. P-67
22. G-14
23. G-29
24. G-47
25.. G-63
26. G-66
27. G-81
28. H-6
29. H-7
30. H-18
31. H-29
32. H-35
33. H-81
34. H-69
35. H-86
36. I-5
37. I-19
38. I-24
39. I-33
40. I-44
Scratch B55 (young Indian lady)from your list, Professor
Thank you.
You’re welcome.
List of 40 posted on WFTW blog:
B12, B29, B76, B7, B35, B37, B51, B85, E6, E40, E54, E73, M75, B61, B72, E22, E13, E28, K80, P67, G14, G29, G47, G63, G66, G81, H6, H7, H18, H29, H35, H81, H69, H86, I5, I19, I24, I33, and I44
Wonder if B51 will bomb. We’ll have to see what develops with E6. 🙂
It occurs to me that the lady lawyer may be participating in sidebars now either because she’s good at jury selection issues or because West is kinda off.
She might have to step in and replace him.
Thanks. I wondered if you’d think that too!
JN lists 4 pm Frye tomorrow, regular tomorrow 9 am of 30 in the box, break about 3:45 before Frye, and if needed, continue with jury selection the next day.
Defense wants an approach to discuss something about the plans for the week.
fogen’s weight added to his face, makes his nose much smaller than appear in older photos, even moreso with the phone distorted fish eye views.
I see that too, and was thinking that the girth of his head makes his eyes look closer together and his pinched little lips, well littler and more pinched.
Sorry to say, but his weight gain has added to a more feral and guilty “look”. Just my own stupid small opinion.
I’m no lip reader, but it looked as if West asked fogen if he’s doing alright… fogen nodded.
This might be a pressure moment for him to put on his best.
if I were him I would be shaking my head NO, fast and quick. But that is just me.
Yeah me too. A milestone moment.
Yes, a milestone moment. Six of the 40 are going to put him away for good, and deep down (despite being a dummy), he knows it.
judge nelson seems incredibly kind and decent towards potential and now excused jurors – i like seeing it.
Fogen your day is fast approaching. If I were you I would be scared, very scared.
He’s focussing on looking smaller, shorter, and has confidence all around him. When Hirshorn leaves, he might feel the empty space.
Is he turning a little green around the gills?
@disappointed
yup, i suspect it must be quite a shock for him to gaze upon the people who will JUDGE him.
The pj’s are coming in now. (JN did not go to them)
We are at 40, wow. I was wrong in my AM prediction. She is listing them now.
-She read it pretty fast, Fred has missed 3. We will have to find a source here.
I tried to get an app up to record it, but didn’t make it in time.
he has them now.
Bill Sheaffer (whose name I’ve been mis-spelling, sorry) just posted that h81, the lawyer with the cases before JN, is actually in.
Bill Sheaffer: h 81 got in. he was the one we thought was out. he was the man with the 2 civil cases before the judge
It was H81, he wasn’t really dismissed
didn’t we hate him?
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Um. I didn’ t hate him but he was maddeningly non-committal. Probably reliable since he’s a lawyer.
I liked him. He introduced the word “Talking Heads” to Bernie, and Bernie liked it enough to use it in a later interview. That is a Daily Kos, MSNBC kind of phrase. I may be wrong, but I have no problem with him. He is to analytical to buy in to GZ’s rediculous stories.
Woo -hoo! Will it take 7 working days to cull those to 10?
Oh, we just got the judge on mike.
Pj is acceptable.
They have 40, when the media said 39. Could H13 possibly still be in? I wonder. Who did we miss in the count?
They have their 40, JN is about to list them:
list ok with state, but ok with defense and defendant only with caveat by defense at bench.
JN goes to dismiss the pjs
Hot mic!
He is moving on, oops mic left on?
His referral to a Higher Power makes me wonder if he is in the program (12 step).
Or could have been New-Agey. That would go along with the no-news negativity.
Okay, thanks, I only know the reference from my own involvement, which would be Bill Wilson (AA).
Crane~ good catch.
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I-44 moves on to the next round.
mic is on…. jn asks any objection re cause from either side, both say no
Oh darn, that was an interesting sidebar!
Guy is a sports nut … Fogen give a little oinky smile … and I reach for trash can. Let this day be over soon.
Or maybe he’s not a sports nut. Fogen, however, is still a pig.
Jacket barely buttons around the tum-tum.
He sees a commonality with this guy, re place for the wives, under the male master image.
sounds like a decent guy.
how about control freak?
i didn’t get that impression so much.
I don’t like this guy. don’t want him in my neighborhood. small minded.
Doesn’t like sports either.
There is more to life than football.
I always knew you were Un-American, Prof. Fred, but Dayum!
🙂
well, in all fairness — baseball is not sport, it is religion 🙂
Yeah! There’s also baseball, basketball and sumo wrestling!
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That’s exactly correct. There’s soccer.
I don’t trust people who don’t see the issues in this case and just brush it away. Ha-ha, but karma brought it to him anyway! 😀
We are a blended family, wants to keep negativity of media feeding, chooses “NOT TO ALLOW IT IN HOME”.
10, 12, youngest under 1 yr old. (ounds like blend includes wife’s two kids, or one of his, one of hers, he can leave her with all three without a problem)
“I do check CNN”…. “computer generated scenario, animation”
He seems to make all the decisions in HIS house, always “I’ decide, never ‘we’.
He wants on the case. Hssn’t mentioned hardship on the mother of his 1 year old, and the other two children and their needs.
“What does that matter to me” …. re pressures of how it would affect him….”Always taught MY children”,,,
I didn’t like that. Makes no mention of the other half. Surely she has some say.
Yep, he wants to be on the jury. Therefore, I don’t believe that him that he really doesn’t care about the case. I think he is stealth one way or the other.
Father of 3, blended family.
Doesn’t allow news in the house because the news is all negative.
Saw the beginning of an animation and turned it off because he doesn’t believe the media.
He sounds intelligent to me…
Yeah. Doesn’t seem that concerned as a parent except to keep negativity from filtering into his house. Keeps his kids from the news. If he’s white, probably doesn’t think this can happen to his kids.
Hispanic, in his 40s, according to Belich.
Why doesn’t BDLR tell the PJs that because MOM cannot keep his mouth and mug away from the camera they will be sequestered?
Media typcally from internet, doesn’t find much credibility of TV.
Few– CNN, MSNBC…
Opinions they give– doesn’t take much value in that
Media has a slant? Says of course, yes
Excactly he will keep it outside the courtroom, doens’t find credibility unless from courtroom, witness says vs outside, says ‘yes’.
Prior– discussion wthe the family or friends– yes but more ‘how long is media going to go on about this.
He doesn’t discuss at work, he’s a store owner.
Heard of the parties, calls from jail, story sensationallized about the “Skittle company”, Trayvon had Skittles then the Skittles company wanted to capitolize, he said “shameless consumerism”.
Hoodie, raining that night…. turned himself in… says he can disregard if something does not come out in trial.
Radio recording– they slowed it down, they put music to it to make it comical, laughter…. how much fun ‘THEY’ seemed to get out of it, he laughed but not consider it credible.
Heard snippets of 911 call– banter between Mr. Z and 911 operator, (fogen writes again) recalls only ‘we are on the way’
Any other aspect? “Lives in Lake Mary, aware of traffic jams, didn’t pay attention to protests…. we have the right…. but…. drastically elongated my time to get home to family…” Won’t hold it against one side or other.
ASsuming he were NOT on jury, what would you tell freind who didn’t know anything, he’d fill in on… shooting, essentially hearing to find out what happened…. ‘needle in haystack’.
What in media about facts…. about the shooting… what led up or circumstances…. rainy, hoodie…
Hardship Q– says “Not ideal, but far from insurmountable”
Is GZ writing this down for the opening line of his book?
It was a dark and rainy night….
probably already penned the book waiting to release it.
He’s got the benefit of being celebrity defendant. Auto-publication with very little editing / filtering! *shudder*
Barfilicious.
Two Sides~ He’s waiting to put in the last chapter: “Today, I Get Sent To Prison.”
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Another poor guy stuck in traffic thanks to the rallies
Has no problem with the protests.
Oh! So it was the jail calls the radio made fun of.
That’s entirely understandable!
Thanks for clearing that up, cause I thought it to be distasteful.
ditto
http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/f2e8ea5c68/george-zimmerman-s-other-911-calls
Was it this? Sorry for posting if it offends anyone.
I do remember the Funny or Die, but I could not tell exactly what the PJ was referring to.
I think it may not have been the Funny or Die, because the PJ said there was music and laughter on what he listened to.
I smell hipster snob.
He just mentioned his family. I was hearing a little Valley Girl in his voice. Your know? Like the voice goes up at the end of the senTENCE?
Oh, and I was agreeing with you.
Yeah I caught that too.
gz’s voice does that, too. When he’s not using a script.
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It’s been my impression in the past that it’s a sign of a lower self esteem? OkAY? Like, I’m right, okAY?
I’m more likely to tolerate that from a young girl, but not so much from a grown man.
Call me biased.
Yes It’s a confidence issue I think. Also for some women who like to feign ignorance or lack of intelligence.
Radio station making a joke of one of the 911 calls?
stay classy
Sometimes I don’t know what is offensive. I’m not calling anyone out and I don’t want to start anything but the same thing has happened in threads here. Some people here have used: He’s on drugs or somepin, He’s coming to check me out, He looks suspicious, as a way to make jokes with other thread posters. I never found it funny but I know how things can be on an online forum. You post with someone for a year and you become familiar, it’s not my place to intrude or rebuke.
Shari~ it’s also a way to stay focused on the absolutely STUPID lies and profiling that gz did when he decided to stalk Trayvon. I still think they’re funny, because all of that crap means NOTHING because NONE of it was a crime! Those very words will nail gz. Those very words will show profiling.
that’s the NEN call
big difference
Okay the NEN didn’t have Trayvon screaming for his life and the fatal gunshot. That’s fine. I just think it would be nice if there was consistency. If this isn’t a joking matter, then lets stop all the jokes. I’m going to be honest, yes I did laugh at the funny or die clip. I couldn’t help it, it was nice to laugh for a second. I prefer humor to anger/sadness about the murder. Everything GZ said Trayvon did, he did. So Trayvon heard GZ say, “I’m going to f’ing kill you.” I put myself in the terrified child’s shoes and can’t help but grieve. So when I listened to the funny or die clip it numbed some sadness.
Maybe ALL of the humor is in poor taste. I don’t know. I find it hard to censor anyone when I have laughed.
haven’t seen the clip you speak of
I can categorically say that there is nothing funny about the 911 call
when people make fun of the NEN, they are making fun of fogen and nothing else and he deserves it every opportunity we get.
Tzar~ thank you.
Shari~ and maybe NONE of the humor is in poor taste. “Gallows humor” is well known, and permits people to deal with very serious issues without going into total despair. Maybe I just don’t understand. NOBODY here has made a joke of, or made light of the fact that Trayvon was stalked, terrorized and murdered. Never. But we make fun of the impossible lies that gz has said and has been recorded as saying. If we didn’t, I doubt we’d have the emotional stamina to see this case through to the very end.
You might say that some of us have become all too familiar with the case. We’ve been over the maps and the various time studies and again and again gz’s claims look ever more ridiculous, thus we’ve come to where we subject them to the ridicule they appear to richly deserve. So, it’s not so much about making jokes as it is about removing the credibility these statements once held for us.
Consumerism.
LOL The jail calls. Liar liar liar, George and Shellie.
I-44, a man, gets information from internet, CNN, MSNBC, finds news sources lack credibility.
I44 is next.
He gets his news over the internet, CNN and MSNBC.
hispanic male in 40’s
Must be tired, I was hearing a much older voice.
I33 did not provide a reason to be disqualified for cause.
I’m guessing that thirty bucks and three square meals a day sounds mighty good to this guy.
I-44, a ‘sir’
tornado warning in my area… bbl…
stay safe!
ditto! basement if you have one. windowless inner room if not. keep your cell phone. texting will work when direct calling won’t STAY SAFE!
________________________________
Lay low. Stay safe.
good luck!
stay safe!
OMG, be careful, a warning, yikes.
We were cleared… it was over DIA… still there…
Sounds like the air traffic in Denver will be delayed. Glad you are safe. (I am phobic of tornadoes, since childhood. Full blown panic)
if I had gas in my car… I would’ve drove that way… I want so be to be a storm chaser..
Wow. Since coming to Kentucky I have progressed to where if I could see one going away and in the distance, I would be okay, ie, at least I would know where it was. But, I could never chase.
You are like my son!
well i’d be a granny storm chaser… lol
A granny kicks ass and takes names, that’s what I’m talkin about! Yes. Well, but don’t get too close, for real!
Defense must like him – pretty short yak.
I’m seeing in my little mind’s eye, someone that Clint Eastwood could play onscreen.
Given his foggy speech at the Republican National Convention he’s a perfect fit for West.
WEST: Do you agree that this chair is guilty?
A: Yes.
WEST: Well there’s nobody IN this chair; this CHAIR is where Trayvon Martin would be sitting if he weren’t so GUILTY!
A: Yes.
WEST: Can’t hear you!
A: Sir Yes SIR Darn Tootin Yes your client is INNOCENT.
WEST: Your Honor this juror is not prejudiced. Please give him a chair.
I’m disgusted with some of these jurors. Some are so blatantly biased.
I’m still smarting over H13 being excused yesterday. That was bogus.
Is judge Nelson trying to even the odds with yesterday’s opinion, help the defense after state got one in for them?
The defense has gotten several bigots past the 1st round.
Me too. To dismiss her was so wrong. IMO.
I agree. She seemed like the perfect juror inquisitive and had not made up her mind yet. Of course the defense doesn’t want any intelligent/fair people on the jury.
She was smart and the defense knew she was going to follow the evidence. I’m still ticked at her being dismissed.
“I live in the middle on nowhere… ” But he said he heard lots walking down the streets.”
“I haven’t had enough facts… to form an opinion…. probably….”
Hedging….. getting thicket stuck in his butt as he sits up there.
Sides with the prosecution or sides with self defense? WTH is that? Did Fogen change his name to self defense?
He has obviously an opinion that the defense is about ‘self-defense’ and bringing that with him.
LMFAO!!
mr. self defense…
sure he likes it better than mr. guilty af. then mr.#654901289 lifetime guest of florida state prison!
Might be, effort to figure out who was screaming, but does this guy forget that he reads OS and there was a big effort on their part to hire experts and publicise their result done on behalf of OS?
Dun… did he have head injury in the car wreck?
Police had to vacate his job, “that’s all really know about it”… “haven’t really formed an opinion… don’t know why he really lost his job exactly.”
Failure of OS to print anything about this in the paper– duh! on this guy.
Come on, Don.
Bounce around a little. We love it when you bounce around.
Boingy, boingy, boingy….
a regular ol’ tigger, isn’t he?
He is close to Disney, lol
See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil – know nothing.
Oh my gosh come on West. They should type him a list of the questions so he does not get lost so often.
The PJ was injured in a car wreck, and has experienced a difficult recoverry
I have direct tv like he does and I pay to get my local stations on sattelite, so West is wrong to assume
I have Direct TV and do not pay extra to get locals…..am in the central Florida area.
“Have seen where people gettting interviewed on tv, best I can remember I was doin’ something else…”
Nothing that he can think of that really stuck with him.
Fox News maybe not the local.
Shocker.
He answers like Fogen. When the answer is obvious but he doesn’t want to say it, he says “probably” or “I think so” or “maybe” so he believes he’s not lying. Bad sign. Kick his a55 out.
Fox35 is one of the locals. If you have cable add on 13 to the list.
Oh, for God’s sake!
West and this guy: Who’s on first?
Pass the freakin’ popcorn
West feeds him it’s default as cable, but one past PJ said gets brighthouse on digital antenna. WEST has just concluded he doesn’t get channel 13…. ASS… umption.
Subscribes OS, most days is part of his routine.
THen he knows plenty about the case! And has an opinion too, I bet.
“Oh I heard some” commentary on the case, walking down the street he says, it was everywhere. He thinks that commentary was ‘both ways’.
B asks “did you ever express an opinion on that?”
PJ “I don’t think so”
PJ “I have discussed ….” the reaction in the community.
PJ: doesn’t remember any opinion though, about this he might have stated.
PJ about community reaction went both ways… heavy talk in both directions.
B asks if he believes basic right of free speech? PJ says “yes”
Do you think it’s improper in any way? PJ “the rules are the rules, free speech is free speech” “No” to influence.
FB challenged he says. Small family and none of them do that.
“Currently not working”, Questionnaire he said
(missed end of B’s part)
Currently unemployed, small family who never speaks about the case… He wants on this jury.
I will listen to the rest of his questioning, but at this stage, my instincts tell me he needs to go.
Give him the hook.
Probably the hook! Let’s see if West likes him.
and attach a sinker… mixing metaphors I know, but better to be sure he isn’t a wild sheep escape artist.
Longtime OS Subscriber in Florida Discusses Most Publicized Case With Family and Decides “Probably it Happened.”
I was distracted during much of his testimoney and missed the decleration as an OS reader… He is throughly infected with contagious lies… he needs to go home and watch the trial like he has watched all the hearings leading up to this trial.
Crane/Prof. Please remove the mess of a post above. Thank you. ^^^^
You have to understand that if you live in/near Orlando then the OS is really the only paper. When you get on the outer fringes of Central Florida ie Space Coast–Florida Today or Northern Central Florida–News Journal then you have another choice of more of a local paper. But close to Orlando and it’s the OS.
I was distracted during much of his testimony and missed the declaration as an OS reader… He is thoroughly infected with contagious lies… he needs to go home and watch the trial like he has watched all the hearings leading up to this trial.
As it went along, I got the impression that he lives sort of a secluded life, and was impacted by the injury from a car accident, but I didn’t think he read all the OS articles related to the case.
At any rate, he did get through. I was more thinking hardship due to physical limitations from sitting, but he didn’t bring it up.
He doesn’t remember details of court proceedings from the beginning but knows about them.
“I will tell you if yu get a June 10th summons that it might be about this case.”
Recalls there was a 911 tape with some screaming on it, but he hasn’t listened to it.
He has no opinion about who is screaming and has no opinion about GZ’s guilt or innocence.
But corrected himself because Bernie caught him saying he remembered ‘screaming’ on the tape, then said he did listen to it.
B asks about gist of 911 tape, but his memory is jogged, and corrects that he DID hear the 911 tape, screams.
I think this one is lying already. He saw pictures but don’t know whats going on! He sounds like an NRA gun carrying activist!
why NRA and gun activist?
I mean, what clues is he giving?
B asks about circumstances leading up to Death of Mr. Martin.
“they got in a fight”… “at night”… “oh I’ve seen photographs…. Mr. Martin and Mr. Zimmerman….”yes, picture I saw was of Mr. Martin in the most publicized way, in a hooded sweatshirt standing….”
Q about Z. “… I remember seeing just his face…. one time getting out of the police car at whatever police station he was at…. I did see a picture of him recently as compared to when it all began, just a regular picture…”
He says formed no opinions re photos.
B any other photos that you recall? (I wonder what photos OS published in paper copy that he must have seen if he got the paper daily and looked at them).
Saw a photo of TM in a hooded sweatshirt.
Saw a photo of GZ at the police station and a more recent photo of him taken a month or so ago.
regarding bernie’s questioning approach … although i have stated my wish that he listened better and made more time for PJs to speak, i do believe there is significant team work between he and Guy. guy is the designated listener, bernie focuses on establishing a friendly rapport, but guy listens. bernie always goes back to guy to see what he may have over looked in questioning or areas to probe further.
Subscribes to the Orlando Sentinel.
Felt compassion for both “entities.”
That’s it, I’m pushing the red button.
the trapdoor with a slide to the everglades? 😉
faux mccoy~ don’t forget the hungry gators underneath!
________________________________
yup
seriously if you don’t know what side to jump on when an unarmed minor is killed after running away
something is wrong with your moral compass
Some of these PJ’s are trying to minimize the gravity of what happened. They are also trying to make others believe that this was two MEN involved. There is an ADULT murderer and a CHILD victim. They find it very easy to see Fogen, the ADULT WITH A CRIMINAL HISTORY as some kind of young kid who made an ooppsie.
“the more I heard the less I wanted to hear” “epathy for both parties”
Back in session I-33, a man. TV + newspaper “a little of both”
Subscribes to the OS.
*reaching for buzzer*
Yeah, sounds like maybe a native, hmmm.
Kathi Belich, WFTV@KBelichWFTVAnd we’re back. Potential juror I-33 is a white male, who appears to be in his 60s.
I33 is next up in the box
I-33 is a guy.
Male, pj I-33.
Sounds older, and cues from Bernie, ‘old fashioned’ OS paper copy question, tells he’s older, maybe retired.
Recess.
Because I can, Princess Bride, Battle of Wits:
Damned assumptions…. he assumes the poison is a poison, and he choises to assume the powder was in either cup….. suspense,,,,,,, he drinks….. but does the masked man?
Aww, doesnt’ matter, the fool lost.
exactly, what this pj was giving off….. what I am is not what I am but I am smarter than you…..
That’s the first time I’ve heard such an obvious pro-Z spinner. Admittedly I took a break for a day or two, but wow.
I think the little old lady partnered with a retired policeman (E 81?) beat her by many miles !
I must’ve missed that.
Oh, E81 was off the chain….she never wanted to be on the jury….just wanted get her views broadcasted.
Must kin to the guy yesterday, (H-27) who gave $20 to the confessed murderer’s defense fund. He also has a sister who’s a cop. He challenged Bernie. Told him, “I’m just being truthful, go ahead, kick me off the jury”, something like that.
I think his goal was the same as E81.
Thnx for info, I missed yesterday except for the Frye hearing bit. Did anyone see if GZ’s face lit up when he told he had donated $20 !
I really do not like this woman and would use a peremptory to get rid of her, if I couldn’t get her excused in the group voir dire.
Of course, she’s so far down the line that she probably will not make it into the box.
I think she would follow jury instructions. SHe embraces the paradoxes inherent in life. Actually fairly rare in someone her age.
Seh has heard (very likely) Sean Hannity show with the fake studio backgrounds and disappearing plants and furniture and unreal cast lighting from lamps, and odd disappearing lawyer beside fogen in real video creating time, tricks of chroma key imagine backrounds.
They could have made fogen appear in jail, on the Green Mils scene, had they wanted to.
Juror 1 24- A young man lost his life and another man is fighting for his life. There are no winners.
********************
Pro Zimmerman spin —> another man is fighting for his life. Plain as the nose on your face.
No way Zimmerman will lose his life because of this judicial process, he will live on regardless of this case outcome.
He’ll be alive, but his life will never be normal, even if he walks.
Bill S. thinks I24 breaks for the Defense.
Agree.
I do too.
I disagree. He is fighting for a normal life. But isn’t likely to get one.
I don’t think he will have a normal life.. unless he leaves the state and changes his name… but there are some peeps that will never forget his face… cuz we know it looks like when it is thin and chubby… Who is going to hire him… McDonald’s maybe…
smokeegyrl~ no, McDonalds is “beneath” him…
________________________________
Karma will never let him be, doesn’t matter – another state, another country, plastic surgery – he’s gonna deal.
15 minute recess.
I think I-24 made it into the pool.
I agree
I24 is talking out of both sides of her mouth… She thinks she sounds informed.
Obsessed with the news… loves it, then says in the next breath… the media and news does a disservice… Get rid of her, undercover, Fox new advocate, Sean Hannity #1 fan.
Much easier to watch FOX for entertainment background value, than to pay attention to more serious news, current events, discussions.
Yes, no way can she still be neutral if she is as informed as she claims to be.
Don’t trust her. Evasive.
________________________________
THat’s not necessarily a conflict. I like news, but I see the bias and over-dramatization as well.
The media has been indicted.
Why are these pj’s afraid to call out SPD?
They are the one’s who listed the confessed murderer’s race as W/M, which gave the impression a white man murderered an AA teenager.
But many want to blame that on the media too.
How many tiems you heard news of this case? “NONE” in detail, total (very few….missed this but low single digit I think.)
“One young man lost his life, another is fighting for his life and no one is a winner in this case.”
I know some people don’t like that quote, but that’s a good nutshell judgement, IMHO. This case is just sad to the core. Most criminal cases are, really.
Two Sides~ except that gz had EVERY CHANCE to NOT murder Trayvon! It was CHOICE and not an “event” “incident” or “accident”. Other wise I would agree.
________________________________
Let’s never forget that.
The worst in my view is that phone call between him and Shellie when he got that windfall and thought he’d have a good life.
Not a thought about that boy lying in his grave or the ache his family had to live with the rest of their lives.
parrot, don’t forget his jokes about wearing a hoodie out of the jail when he was released. Totally without feeling for others.
GZ may be a ‘young man’ but in her quote, she doesn’t not differentiate between a ‘child’ by any legal definition (Lester said, Trayvon was the ONLY one whose youth is an issue in this case… period). She lumps both as ‘young man but not one is adult, and the other a ‘child’ whose brain is not fully developed into adult at the time he was followed and killed.
She will default to the only living witness’s version. I think, and rely on what she has heard to entertain her mind.
That’s because O’Dirty tried to give the “gullible” public the impression that this is a case about 2 men.
He’s been quoted many times this past year referring to the case as such. He kind of slow down in using it after they p.o. Judge Lester.
Once new judge was assigned, he started up again. It was a part of his strategy which seems to be working,……for now.
One young man lost his life and the other still has his life and is fighting (I hope unsuccessfully) for his freedom. There may be no real winner but it’s damned obvious who the biggest loser was.
She leaves a big hole for the ‘TEEN-ager (her emphasis) being in the wrong, doing what typical teens do, that cuased this or played a role in his own death.
If Trayvon was fighting for his life, he was the only one whose life was at risk that night. NW authority is no authority at all to do what he did, on patrol NOR as a private citizen.
A “tweener” I think.
with a bias
cannot detect bias between fox and msnbc? ummm, either is lying or totally oblivious to not even subtle nuance. not suitable, either way for jury service.
Seriously does MSNBC even pretend to be neutral? I know Fox does but anyone paying attention knows better.
@ryan — i don’t perceive msnbc even hiding their bias — think of their self promoting ads with the theme ‘lean forward’… how can that be perceived as anything but progressive in nature?
fox does a good job at fooling their flock with the ‘fair and balanced’ meme, but anyone outside the flock can see right through it.
Depends upon what parts you watch.
I agree, lying or not listening to what is being reported.
She got tired of listening to the news because it kept changing.
They have a tendency to report stuff before authenticating what they say.
That can hurt someone fighting for his life.
At first it sounded like TM was the victim, but then they started reporting about his problems in school.
First, GZ wasn’t injured but later on he was.
Those changes seem to have led her to think GZ is innocent and “fighting for his life,” or she would not have mentioned them.
She doesn’t see a bias on Fox or MSNBC? Oh my god. I watch MSNBC and I’ll admit a liberal bias there.
On things that may have happened with TM in school:
“He’s a teenager. he is a 17 year old kid. No kid is perfect.”
Without saying it, she may be calling O’Mara a straight-up pathological liar.
‘In the beginning he had no injuries, and then a week later he did. What do you believe?’
BAM!
Without saying it, she may be calling O’Mara a straight-up pathological liar.
Ha, one can hope!
So far the only good thing coming out of this is we all agree the media sucks
Keep going O’Mara. You’re drawing out her bias better than BDLR did.
I can’t take O’mara acting like he is blameless. The media is reporting based on what he included in motions regarding Trayvon. The media didn’t extract info from TM’s phone, O’mara and other asshole company did that crap!
Bullshit!
Yup.
I totally concur.
He lies, distorts and misrepresents with a straighter face than his client. A master liar and shameless hypocrite.
Glad to know I am not crazy ladies.
Well, we didn’t say That.
Kidding honey, but a little crazy is a very good thing.
LOL…I only meant on this singular issue. My husband and family could tell you just how crazy I am. I proudly admit that I am the one that you call when you need a pitbull on your side. The stories they could tell LOL! So absolutely, a little crazy is necessary and fabulous!
Hmmmm! 🙂
She wants to be on the jury, enjoys news, no hardship, kids flown the coop.
MOM uses ‘patrolling’– not sure I heard her say that word. She thinks media fails because they don’t take the time to research and report ‘the facts’. She doesn’t say the media does not have all the ‘facts’, nor anything about spin.
“…Disservice for someone ‘fighting for their lives”. Oh, that’s the GZ spin mantra, early media reports did diservice, now reports come out that he’s a teenager, not the innocent that was portrayed early on.
Media agenda, but she doesn’t say it’s also used by defense.
Frist GZ ” ..had no injuries, then week or so later, he did”
All these examples by her, is first spin against defendant in media then later opposite, as more bad info comes out abyt teenager.
“listening is “something to occupy my mind.”
Default, one of them is FOX, “Oh yes … as well as ABC, CNN, …. MSNBC…”
No child is perfect! Testify Lady! She must know my sons.
AMEN
“Some of the things he did in school.” You just ensured that you won’t make it.
“he wasn’t the innocent young man he was portrayed”
ugggg, don’t want her
But GZ justified his profiling of Trayvon based on his NW knowledge and NW patrolling. O’Mara is right in a way — GZ wasn’t patrolling; he was stalking.
Sure was!
@SoulSistaWoo. Yep. According to GZ, he wasn’t pursuing, just banging on his flashlight trying to get it to work so he could look down the dog path where he saw Trayvon run.
He didn’t have a problem — just went for his cell phone to call 911 to tell them to have a good day.
He started yelling for help the moment he fell and Trayvon straddled him, before anything physical happened beyond that; not because he feared for life, but to restrain Trayvon.
We don’t need a media lecture, PJ. Yes or no.
Someone best be marking this lady as being in stealth mode..jmho…know too many of these kind 😦
I think it is fascinating that nobody has asked about the Sean Hannity Show.
I noticed they don’t ask about any specific programs. I.e. they don’t ask the HLN viewers about Nancy Grace either. Perhaps they are prohibited from such questions.
Could be objectionable, I suppose.
yes, and MOM’s website. because they want on the Jury.
She sounds like she has a bit of a attitude with MOM. Probably nothing since I think he just has that kind of personality.
The giggling in response to questions bugs me.
Looks like Shelly has Frank Taafe to be security guard… Isn’t he a witness… and why is he allowed during this procedure?
What he is going to do to potential attacker? Throw beers at them?
lol
@disappointed.
All Taaffe needs to do is breathe on them. 🙂
For real? Frank Taaffe is present
yup that would be him… sitting next to Shelly.
@smokeegyrl
Remember now, this here is the good ole boy network. Taafee, and a few of the witnesses have all gone before Judge Lester.
Whose gonna be next? Osterman? Wonder if they talk anymore since the book.
Mark does his friendly salesman pitch with his chit chat and compliments and consideration.
No hardship serving or being sequestered.
That’s hard for me to believe, so I suspect the person might be stealth…. I hope I am wrong.
is that Michael Skolnik in the back… in the pink shirt?
I think he said in a column yesterday that he would be there today.
Also, Sundance Cracker hinted there would be a Treeper in the public seats today.
Well I know CG and SP said they were putting their request in from that Treepers room on FB..
She enjoys listening to the news.
Bill Sheaffer: we are at 36 potential jurors. this would be number 37. there are five more jurors ready for today. btw, i-24 is in 40’s or 50s
She enjoys the news. Never heard that.
At least not amongst these pj’s before now.
Finally someone who understands the parents.
She can empathize with the defendant’s mother too and might not want to increase her pain either.
Finally, someone who says they couldn’t imagine losing their child!
Fogen is blinking hard, trying to shut that out.
Great minds think alike or in this case hear alike.
Is she confused about the questions? Remembers nw, but then didn’t know who, then says defendant was involved in NW. (is what fogen has, contageious??)
ay2z~ stupidity or lying?
________________________________
Sorry to steer off topic but why in the world did the prosecution agree not to use the word “profile” in opening statements? Clearly Trayvon WAS profiled….. I don’t get it
They can say it a dozen other ways, why argue? (I believe this ban on “profile” is only during jury selection, not during trial testimony.)
Here is part of what I read (I’ll post the link too)-
SANFORD — Quietly and with hardly anyone noticing, George Zimmerman’s attorneys persuaded a judge to ban prosecutors from using the word “profiled” in their opening statement.
That means the theory that was the backbone of the state’s case — that 17-year-old Trayvon Martin was profiled — is now something prosecutors cannot mention as they launch into their case against the former Neighborhood Watch volunteer.
It is a major pretrial victory for the 29-year-old Zimmerman, who in the days and weeks immediately after Trayvon’s death was denounced as a racist, made into a social pariah and became the subject of a federal civil-rights investigation.
more here: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-geo-zimmerman-trial-profile-20130617,0,1761292.story
@chi1224. IIRC, it was during the first hearing on jury selection, or at the end of the first hearing on the Frye motion, that Judge Nelson said she was not hearing the defense’s motion in liminie and that the parties stipulated that the prosecution would not use the word “profiling” during jury selection.
That’s a lot of “film” to go through, but if I have time I will look for it and put the clip in a video.
Again it’s important to note that article I wrong/ the judge didnt rule on the motion – instead BDLR agreed at the bench to assure the defense he would t use the word in opening statement.
There’s a real but subtle difference there
So, wait a minute: The judge did not RULE on it but the parties AGREED not to use the word “profiled” but West used it and Bernie did not? HUH?
@chi1224.
The prosecution only agreed not to use that word during jury selection. Judge Nelson has not ruled on the defense’s motion in liminie yet. IMO, she will deny, because “profiling” is part of the charging affidavit and the State has to prove that. Forbidding them from using that word would tie their hands in proving their case.
It’s an O’Mara attempt to blind-side.
So is the Orlando Sent. wrong? It wouldn’t surprise me because they seem pro-fogen to me, but they report the prosecution can’t use the word profile in the opening statements, which is when the state lays out the story of their case to the sitting jury.
Unfortunately I’m still confused about this issue 😛
@chi1224.
The reporter probably doesn’t know “opening statements” from “voir doir” just like Zidiots don’t know the difference between a subpoena and a summons –and O’Mara’s staff didn’t know there are separate Rules for Civil subpoenas from Rules for Criminal subpoenas.
If I find that “clip” and post it, maybe the Professor will address it.
Xena~ Hit that nail on the head! They have NO CLUE what they are reporting because they don’t know the legal language.
________________________________
@cielo62.
Absolutely! Looks like the Orlando Sentinel has “crime reporters” doubling as reporters for “courts and the law.” They are two different animals. Crime reporters report what LE tells them. Reporters in courts and the law really do need some understanding of judicial procedure and terminology.
In a controversial case like this, not understanding the orders of the court can be very misleading, especially to people such as Zidiots who depend on what is reported rather than having knowledge or a blogger like Frederick Leatherman to explain things to them.
Rene has now corrected her story to include jury selection only.
@Lynn.
I hope she corrected it to say that the agreement is “limited” to jury selection. I don’t read her, so don’t know. Thanks for the info.
Since you don’t read her, you’ll be glad to know that she’s finally gotten rid of that awful handlebar mustache. ;-D
@chi1224. I found the clip but want to wait until the hearing is over before converting to present here.
@chi1224.
Here ’tis.
Xena, thank you so much!! I missed this earlier as it got buried in all the comments (I just figured out how to check the response tab by my log in)… many many thanks to you for finding and posting the video, it clears up the confusion!
@chi1224. No problem. Glad it helped. 🙂
That sounds like pro-Z spin.
Get rid of her.
Fox News vieewer wasn’t a big clue?
Agree.
I’m very concerned about stealth jurors in this case.
She’s sympathetic about a parent losing a child, with emphasis. But she could as well empathize with the parents who might lose their son to jail. Might be for a one parent’s loss is enough theory to side with defendant.
Bernie is digging beneath the surface I hope.
are we close to the magic 40 yet? Just tubing back in here.
36 or 37.
Toxic
MOM has to be loving this PJ.
“one man lost his life and anotherman is fighting for his life.” Come on now!
She has got to go.
@hinkster4ever keeping it on the real for us, with pretty much real time updates. Folks can scroll through the thread for these, to get the progression.
I-24 now.
whoa!! she would tell her good friend when she IS on the jury scenario???
Passed for cause today on hardship and pretrial publicity: H69, H86, I-5 and I-19.
GZ is having a time or reckoning — he really does not have that many supporters.
He has relied on the support from his wife, father, family, and I imagine he might have received letters…from folks who bought his bs hook, line and sinker. And, you know there are girls who might want to be friends, ’cause ya know, he’s famous and stuff and maybe they could be famous too.
Of course, none of those folks are being questioned as PJs. So, yah, and yesterday after a break someone said he looked like he’d been crying. He’s getting a Clue.
@Deborah Moore.
Your comment gave a light-bulb moment. Maybe GZ was of the impression that all 500 people called for jury duty were in support of him so anyone chosen for the 6 would have already decided in his favor.
Xena~ I’d like to see gz “crying.” Honestly, I don’t believe it.
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@cielo62. If GZ was crying, it was because he couldn’t finish his lunch in time. Ya know — all those starving kids in Africa and he leaves food on his plate.
Xena~ LOL! I’m wondering if the reality is FINALLY taking shape inside that blockhead of his? There is a very real possibility that NOT ONLY will he NOT make a bazillion dollars from suing everybody from God on down to the janitor, but that he will ALSO be going to prison for the very minimum of 35 years! 30+35= very old man once he’s released. Sweating? You bet! Anxiety attacks? Certainly! But CRYING? I need to see that.
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@Deborah Moore
I think I said that on yesterday. His legal team were seated, kinda surrounding him…..he didn’t look too happy.
It was almost as if they could’ve been saying, “Dude, don’t do it”, or “You have no choice”.
What I was seeing on his face was a response to what the legal team was saying.
The jury consultant was not a part of that particular conversation, he sat waaay off, behind them.
Sleuth~ he’s either contemplating suicide or planning to run. Well, he hasn’t got the guts for suicide and he’s too fat and well recognized to run. So, NO, he has NO CHOICE! 🙂
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@cielo62
Or the type of redness in the eye when a person is very upset and angry, or after crying.
From the looks of it, the conversation looked very intense. And yeah, I thought it could be for the same reasons you mentioned.
Something definitely upset the apple cart.
I reckon his time of reckoning will last for decades in the pen, but, yes, let it begin to sink in for him now.
(He’s been isolated for so long, he’s likely been inclined to believe nonsense he reads on line, combined with what his ace legal team comes up with to keep him pacified.
Only the good die young.
(Shaking my head here.)
Ruh roh. In her thirties and giggling on the stand?
Doesn’t bode well as a first impression.
Fox news viewer. I don’t want her on the jury.
I swear, I recognize a fox voice the moment they open their mouth. I don’t know what it is, but I do.
amsterdam~ maybe it’s the stupid crap that they spew that tips you off?
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You recognize the talking points, I can spot an MSNBC watcher as well. You recognize it because you know the stories they choose to cover. If I remember correctly FOX was pretty much ignoring this story until Obama said, “If I had a son..”
It is before they utter a full sentence. There is something in their tone of voice. Maybe it is judgement or the fox outrage I hear.
amsterdam~ probably the non verbal cues, like you said. Already defensive and ready to challenge.
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I heard judgement.
It has a different quality in younger voices than in older ones. Older people have a certain indignation, but also a pretention of niceness, but no matter what they say, you are just waiting for them to start complaining about those ………
I feel insulted by talking points from anyone. Please ask intelligent questions which seek to find facts for me. It’s is difficult to find a media outlet who will do this. I’m going to try BBC or some other International source.
@shari
Yes, you recognize the talking points and the choice of words.
Bernie missed another opportunity when she said ” the media was making up stories again”.
Bill Sheaffer: looks like i-19 is through. that takes us to 36 out of 40
That was my impression. West looked disgusted after the discussion at the bench. He wanted her excused.
Oh, and way late, I see the journalist in the white top. The white pops, makes her more visible.
Deborah,
That sounds like the same thing one of the witnesses in this case stated to the investigators.
I hadn’t heard that.
(But, you’re the Sleuth, and I’m the watcher.) Thanks.
@Deborah Moore,
Wow!……how weird is that?
I thought your initial comments about the journalist was just a joke, or a play on words regarding witness #3 statements made to investigators, but now I know otherwise.
Witness #3 was the young lady who said “…the guy on top had on a white t-shirt.”…….and… “I’m pretty sure because that was the only color that popped”
The confessed murderer has looked me directly in the eyes……..he has starred at me 3x. Really weird phenomenon.
Has this happened to anybody else here?
he waved to me…
LOL! I’m serious Tzar. Maybe I’m on Trial Watch overload.
ha ha ha
what did you put in your coffee this morning?
Yes. And it feels creepy. I don’t like that gaze.
I know…….reminds me of the mug shot of him in the gray prison jumpsuit when he was arrested the first time in April 2012.
Sleuth~ Yep, right through the TV and internet. He’s watching YOU. 😉
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@cielo62
I kinda know he can’t really see me (or can he?) but it’s really strange and beyond creepy.
Think I’m just going to go back to just listening for now. Won’t be watching actual live stream.
Sleuth~ Just messin whicha. He has weird eyes; too close together. His stare IS strange. I’ve seen it an all of his pictures. “Beady little eyes” made much worse now that he’s so morbidly obese.
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sittin in a chair too small compacted creepy.
defense symphaty move phhht
Yes, really creepy, dead eyes.
towerflower~ http://youtu.be/VUuH4TEmgLo
Kathi Belich, WFTV @KBelichWFTV
I 24 is up. She is a white woman who appears to be in her 30’s.
I bet George is writing and taking notes so he can write a book like him papa..
Lord have mercy.
Good. The Royalties (if any) will go to Tracy and Sybrina.
According to Florida law, he can’t make one brown penny off it if he’s found guilty.
that’s good to know.
From day one, according to buddy the Marks man on tv interview, “he took a lot of notes” while watching reports.
Either writing notes for his book or pretending to participate in his defense. I wonder if he’ll go Arias and start to doodle and sell the artwork on Ebay.
@towerflower
I think he’s pretending to be participating. They seem to ignore him after they exchange morning pleasantries.
lol did judge say follow Jarvis out of court room, I did not hear
Yes.
The bailiff.
Isn’t Jarvis the bailiff?
As GBS said Youth is wasted on the young.
That’s for sure!
and i’m reminded of my father’s corollary on aging
‘the more i learn, the less i know for sure”
he was a very wise man
Who/what is GBS ?
George Bernard Shaw.
A better George, by George.
Thnx DM. I’m a Brit, studied some of his plays and writings at school and read more in later life but I had never heard of him referred to as “GBS” ! Nor heard of his contemporary compatriot as OFOWW! 😉
Wow. George Bernard Shaw got it, at least for me he did. My issue now is getting past the regret and the wanting so much to have my experience now, with my physical strength and youth of then.
you and me both, sister.
I 14 was dismissed due to a post by his mother and Yet B81 can get on the stand and spout all type of bitter, hate filled lies w/a confirmed made up mind and she gets a pass… sounds about right…
First thing I thought also Soul Sis!
Did I hear her say she didn’t care.
Yep, sure did.
Yes.
What is wrong with our younger generation that doesn’t care about loss of life?
Many feel impervious to harm and at the same time don’t like to think about how fragile life is.
i tend to think it is because (barring serious, life threatening personal events), they feel themselves to be immortal. not excusing it, but youth has its advantages and pitfalls.
I think the internet and social media encourage anti social self centered characteristics. People spend a lot of time playing with their phones instead of taking in life. People also are more concerned with their own interests and lives than strangers.
and again, west shows no ability to identify with anyone dependent on hourly wages at shit companies. how the hell did he get through school? i worked 30 hours a week throwing produce and carrying 20+ units. uggggg, what an out of touch douchenozzle.
Is it worse to be a nozzle than a bag?
This is a more compelling question than what West asks!
yes! i was using doucebag as an insult back in the 80s and dating/marrying someone 10 years younger than me in the 90s. i like to stay ahead of the curve.
lol
Question for the state to inquire, about the way a person can more likely be chosen, more chances (she mentioned this as knowledge given to her by someone), so did she try this as well?)
the attorney with cases pending before this judge was dismissed and then the last young man so we are still at 35
it’s 2:30 now, wonder if they stay until this is done today if there’s a chance of getting 5 more on the roster?
H81 and I14?
When they keep asking about the bloody picture… it brings to my mind… when my head was bashed in several times on a wooden floor… suffering two broken noses… I’ve had two concussions one mile and one severe… I suffer with headaches to this day… the swelling on noises lasted up from 5 to 7 days… so when they wiped his blood away… did they wipe the swelling too? just asking..
Uh Oh don’t say you had two broken noses — the Treepers might read it and Fogen will up his ante and claim that Trayvon broke BOTH his noses and three of his ears! ❗ Then there won’t be a jury in the world that will convict him!
at two different times..
I was dealing with some youngsters today. One took a kickball to the face and got a bloody nose. A little ice, some cotton, and he looked as good as new…….gee just like Z did shortly after that photo was taken.
I’m sorry. I just responded to someone. I got caught up and realized that I hadn’t introduced myself. Apologies for butting in. I have been following and enjoying the thread. It has been very informative in catching up to the actual happenings in court for those who are unable to watch continuously. I promise, I’ll do more reading than replying. Anyway, back to stealth mode.
Do we know who was excused this morning?
just want to say how much i detest low rent companies who don’t pay employees while on jury duty. it effectively keeps poor folks, dependent on hourly wages off juries. that was one of the first changes i made in company policy when i was promoted to general manager of my local food co-op.
I salute you.
There’s more reason of inconvenience to themselves personally and business, than wages. Civic duty vs convenience and costs to make up wage over and above 30 dollar daily stipend.
vs civic duty, they probably want to suggest to employees, that they wont’ help, even if in the end they will.
@Fauxmccoy Bravo!
I was agreeing too, it’s a selfish business decision and worked to their advantage.
@fauxmccoy. (Applause)
faux mccoy~ PREACH IT, SISTER! And this lady would be MORE a “peer” to gz than many others. Struggling financially.
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I read somewhere, according to State law, most employer’s don’t have to pay their employee’s; or they are required to pay them the difference, i.e. employee makes $50 per day, jury duty $30 per day. Employer then only has to pay employe $20 for each day served on jury.
In Florida, you get your regular salaried paycheck from employer during civil or criminal jury service.Then you turn check, that eventually show up from the clerk of courts, for jury service over to your employer.
Trained Observer~ But that doesn’t apply to hourly employees. I think we’ll see more of this as we progress. Not too many salaried people around anymore.
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@trained
that would be fairly normal for salaried workers, hourly workers are a different classification. again, it effectively keeps the poor from actively participating in the process. salaried workers are paid the same, whether they are at work or not. hourly workers only paid for time they have worked.
Last time (at least 10 yrs ago) I had a jury summons, I signed the check over to my employer and got a regular paycheck. It wasn’t cash the jury check and them making up the difference. That was with a Federal agency.
The gubmint, ie We should pay for it
it’s for the proper civic maintenance of society
tzar says
agreed. sadly, each state gets to determine labor law standards and that leave unscrupulous companies to do their worst, as they will. 😦
She is a hardship case. Dump her and move on.
my cube mate said tell her to ask West if he will cover her bills
Is she aware that jurors are paid $30 a day?
West forgot to ask that, maybe he’ll bring it up when he remembers, if he is actually being ‘helpful’ for her to participate. 😉
If she’s sequestered that should come out to $800 for a month plus meals.
These young folks are not going to be stuck up in a hotel and miss out on the Kardashians, Beyonce, or Taylor Swift.
Dave~ That’s still less than half of what she would make, even at minimum wage.
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True, but taxes would not be deducted and she would have essentially no expenses for the month beyond her regular bills (rent, utilities, car payment etc.)
Dave~ UNLESS she’s part of the income with which to support her mother. That leaves mom with no income support at home.
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Anyway, I think she’ll be going home now.
I think I19 is lying like many others. They know about this case.
Girl wants hardship.
THAT STARE… OMGosh that stare…. is so scary…
He’s intense today. Feeling more desperate, probably.
As I said upthread, I think he’s just realizing how F’d he is. That certainly not everyone thinks he was legally justified in doing what he did.
And, I’m thinking the same thing that others of your are wondering. Holy Cow. What will he be like when the prosecution puts on their case?
Two Sides~ Maybe they’ve cut back on his meds, since he keeps falling asleep.
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Or he and West got their baggies mixed up.
Could happen?
(Hey, this plug tastes different.)
I think each time one of those proFogen Preachers was up answering questions like: “A man has a right to defend himself from a thug-druggie-MMA-criminal” Fogen began to feel all thrilled and imagined he was gonna win and then sue the hell out of everybody for maliciously persecutin’ him, but then as they got removed for cause one after the other, he began to get this really bad sinking feeling in his gut …
Malisha~ and with a gut that large, he sank a great deal.
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@Malisha — Yeah, an that’s quite a gut to sink.
West is trying to get her to cooperate in helping her get a hardship dismissal.
She’s playing along.
This is I-19.
She has no interest at all in the news.
West and O’Mara’s attempts at appearing folksy is irritating as fuck
Plays into her poor pj, needs to work and can’t be paid….
He’s trying to find out what her motives might be and what she’s already done towards arranging pay and time off from work, an emphasis.
financial problems critical, but she’s not paying rent, no children to support apparently, no parents to care for, no dependants otherwise. Retired grandparents might help her, but West draws out the hankerchief … figuratively.
tzar says
we’re talking 3 dollar bill material!
West: “let me take a deep breath”
mind you he was just sitting for 20 minutes while BDLR examined the witness
*barf*
tzar says
maybe he’s beginning to grasp the importance of good oxygen supply to his brain ??
I don’t think BDLR quite understood this young lady’s situation. It’s not that her employer won’t make an “accommodation” for her. But like she says, she’s a low-wage hourly worker and needs all the hours she can get, and her employer isn’t going to pay her for time she’s not there.
@RobertSF.
Have labor laws changed or are they different by State? In Illinois when a juror is paid, they bring their juror check to the employer, and the employer pays the employee the difference between their juror pay and regular wages.
Xena~ Does NOT happen in Texas. You don’t work, you don’t get paid NO MATTER WHY. If for jury duty, all that you get is to keep your job. FORGET about getting paid. That is for hourly workers. I suppose its different for contract workers. I don’t get docked from the school district when I report for jury duty.
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I doubt Florida has such a progressive law. Even California doesn’t. Connecticut has a limited pay (5 days only and only for permanent, full-time workers) http://www5.cbia.com/hr/if-your-employee-is-called-to-jury-duty-2/
@RobertSF.
That’s sad. It’s not as if people volunteer for jury duty.
Xena I looked it up. and if the employer doesn’t pay for jury duty. the state pays about $3o per day
According to Florida Statutes, during the first three days of jury duty, payment by the State is as follows:
•
If your employer does NOT continue to pay your regular wages or you are NOT employed, or self-employed, then you are entitled to receive payment from the State in the amount of $15.00 per day for the first three days and $30.00 per day thereafter. When you report for jury duty, be sure to fill out a Request for Compensation form so that you will be mailed a check at the end of each week that you are in attendance either in a continued selection or on a trial. A Request for Compensation Form is not necessary if your employer is paying your regular wages while you are on jury duty.
•
If jury service lasts four days or more, all jurors automatically receive $30 per day for the fourth day of service and each day thereafter, regardless of employment status.
•
One check is mailed for each week of jury service and each check is mailed approximately four weeks after the week served.
Attendance Certificates
@Shannon.
HEY!!! THANKS! Great research and helps put my mind at rest. I would hate to see any state not compensate jurors.
@RobertSF
That was also my take on what she was saying.
Exactly … Across America, employers have taken to “hiring” part-timers, offering no benefits and keeping the worker-bee well under 40 hours to avoid full time status and related obligations.
This isn’ t news … but it’s amazing how many older folks ( comfortably employed and salaried for decades) simply don’t get it. Hopefully BDLR is smarter than that, or someone in his office clues him.
Hardship. Simple. She won’t get FIRED, but she will NOT get paid, either. Considering jury duty pays, what? $6 a day here in Houston. Can’t get even a lunch for that.
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In Florida, after the first few days (three as I recall are free),, the daily pay goes up to about $30. But it’s supposed to be turned over to the employer. So she might be caught in a situation where she’s getting no hours, but is still required to turn over her check. Don’t know legalities of that.
I got from the posts that she was afraid to vote guilty and her boss getting pissed and worried about her job from that. Florida is a right to work state and they don’t need a reason to get rid of you if they want to……..after the jury duty of course.
towerflower~ same in Texas. More like “Right to get fired for any reason your employer wants” state.
West getting the low down from jury consultant before questioning this pj.
He needs to pry into mother and friend’s opinions.
My recommended shutdown response: “I never pay any attention to what my mom and her loony-tune friends think about anything.”
Trained obersever~ Which would be the correct response from ANY teen/early 20-something person to say.
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-nobody ever watches the news, knows the news, or cares about the news.
-no one ever talks about anything.
-everyone walks away from any conversation where people are talking about anything
-people seems to know people who talk about things, it’s just not them
-and no one voted for the governor.
#Florida
(satire)
I don’t buy any of these people who play clueless.
@Ryan(@kswheels)
Neither do I. They are so transparent.
Satire??? Blazing Saddles Govenor scenes come to mind……..
Crane~ It’s safer to talk about the weather.
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Just think of your secretary.
I-19 wants on baaaaddddd…….trying to be stealth.
I-19 doesn’t watch the news, gets all of her news from her mother.
Her boss thinks the case if very interesting and always talks about the case.
I find her comments interesting. How do you NOT discuss this case with your boss if they are always discussing it?
I’d want to know her boss’s take on the case. She could lose her job if her boss had a strong opinion of “innocence” and she was on the jury that convicted — uh effin oh!
I agree. I would also be interested in he boss’s position. Maybe The Wiester will dig it out of her.
This young lady has already missed 3 days from work. Think she’s going to try and get out of it due to hardship. That way she’ll be okay with her boss.
F’rinstance I heard about workers who were fired after Obama was elected because their bosses said that Obama was gonna drive their businesses into the ground, so they had to get rid of their lowest-paid (most easily replaced) workers. It was punishment because the bosses had told people to vote for that other guy — Ramrod? I forget his name.
Malisha~ It was Romney. Ramrod Johnson will be gz new cellmate.
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My eyes. Owie.
Is this what we default to when we’re bored to tears with this parade of young (potentially giggly) young young women?
Right on. Well played. 😉
There was one Doctor in Central Florida who would ask his patients who they voted for, if they said Obama, he told them to find another doctor and that he would no longer treat them.
He even put a sign up on the front of his business about it.
towerflower~ LOL! Karma would be if he lost LOTS of business!
Especially if her most important concern is her job. Could be she wants to please her boss.
Bill Sheaffer: I 14 is gone. just walked out by a deputy
Let’s not jump to conclusions either about Judge Nelson or about BDLR. I think the fact that Corey SHOWED UP for the cameras in the first days of jury selection was a sign that she is not going to let this case lose. I’m gonna be a long-distance runner with this one.
sounds bad, walked out by law enforcement official. We know that happens every time a pj leaves the courtroom, doens’t mean anything, but some reading twitter may not know that.
BS’s remark about the deputy is redundant.
“gone” can be interpreted different ways, one negatively about the pj to those not aware it’s normal to be ‘gone’ when finished.
BS can see the juror’s being led to their auto’s, they are parked right behind him….so he reports who is led to their car. I do not assume anything :). Have watched BS thru out the Anthony trial, he reports facts and his opinion on the law and court room tactics 🙂
Kathi Belich, WFTV @KBelichWFTV
Defense team found something on line and showed it to the judge and she sent I-14 out of court for now. Defense had asked 1/2
Kathi Belich, WFTV @KBelichWFTV
Or at least in #Zimmerman ‘s direction.
possibly his mom’s signing a petition online
Judge Nelson needs to be more decisive. Looking like, he who speaks last, wins.
Not good.
Worrisome, there was a need to get rid of Judge Lester for a reason, and it was not about bias, it was ability and experience and his ability to be fair with better repuation to handle cases (?).
The good judges are not the toughest ones, unfortunately.
I believe, however, that she is equal to the task of running this trial the right way.
Does a judge have resources to get unbiased case handling advice when in a position never before experienced? Or is the judge flying on their own completely?
Resources of administration of course, research and legal opinions yes, but what about the role of the chief judge for the county, is that a resource?
is watching the Hodge Twins on youtube… wont’ post it on here… these guys are crazy… they talking about Fogen’s daddy.
Fogen’s Daddy, what a guy!
Poke that ganster in the EYE!
Tell the truth and make him cry!
Don’t let him DENY DENY!
My mother said to pick the very worst book and
HIS * IS * IT! 🙄
Most excellent, dear. I like your style and wit.
HAHAHAHAHhaaaaaa.
he sounds like my youngest son, very quiet. But aware enough to know the basics of right and wrong.
Anybody notice Zimmerman is not smirking today
O’Mara is knocking himself out trying to persuade JN to excuse this guy.
He seems like the first pj who sees the full gravity of this case.
He sounds like a pothead. We need him.
Dave! We need him for having a BRAIN in his head, not for having a pot on his head!
LOL, Dave!
He doesn’t sound like a pothead to me. He sounds like an intelligent, thoughtful kid who is intimidated by the adult professionals and by the gravity of the situation.
He sounds to me like an intelligent, thoughtful pothead with a sound understanding of the situation.
I agree with Dave! Pothead kids aren’t unintelligent!
He certainly isn’t going to believe that Trayvon was an aggressive thug because he had traces of pot in his system.
Dave~ LOL! “Sounds like a pothead. We need him” that just busted me up! Yep, we need him!
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That’s what I thought.
He was a junior at the time of the killing, so he has just graduated from HS this month. He is probably only 18. He sounds fine to me. I find it hard to believe that his mother didn’t have a strong opinion about the case, given that she had a son the same age as Trayvon. Either she was horrified, or she thought that Trayvon somehow contributed to the situation. In either case, she would have talked to her son about avoiding dangerous situations and conflict.
noticing the difference between O’Mara and West… O’Mara takes the objections okay… well West… goes Bezerk… lmaoooo ….
This young person is still young… and still probably lives with his mom… is wondering what he thinks about wearing a hoody and walking in a community being followed.
He seems like a follower
The redundancy drives me crazy. I swear like half of the questions have already been answered.
Objection, Your Honor, asked and answered… and answered… and answered… and answered… and answered… and answered… and …
OBJECTION, Your Honor. I thought we agreed no more objections, I OBJECT!
and… answered… and… answered… ➡
YES.
Mr Zimmerman’s safety? LMAO he still had a gun, he was plenty safe. He showed he is not afraid to use it.
He was trained and mentored by a professional in his selection, choice, use, practice, permitting qualifications (including SYG, self-defense and all that according to his pro mentor himself who was on scene and involved soon after the killing took place) and this was from the perspective of a someone trained and qualified through in law enforecement agencies where they had authority to follow, stop, question and kill).
“stopping power” was a prime consideration for a dog threat situation vs other options, and hollow points are designed to break apart and cause as much pain and destruction as possible, and not exit cleanly. Fogen knew all this, and knew he had to be ‘on’ his mark especially if he did not have hollow points that would go through a window or wall into his neighbor’s child’s crib or through their door.
No one should ever have to do neighborhood watch function or not, with hollow points ever for burglary. Hollow points loaded in Shellie’s gun that killed Trayvon, might have been useful if one of these non-white bad people, would attack her alone at home and be on top of her in an assault..
sorry to be late, but it was lovely to sleep in. did i miss anything good?
Oh, nothing.
Except GZ strangled West to death.
After the judge gave him a …, oops, never mind.
(I’ll be good, Fred. I promise.)
Hi, pretend mccoy.
oh happy day! but now i will have to rely on trents videos of him for excellent sleep … but trent interferes with the process. 😀
Life’s tough some days. (Smirk.)
Youth day – well, this afternoon.
I think he’s a reliable juror.
Riots? Oh come on!
That nen call is going to be their biggest problem. If GZ doesn’t take the stand it will be GZ following Trayvon and next the screams.
From the very FIRST time I heard the NEN call, way long before I heard the 911 Scream Call, I knew that Fogen had murdered Trayvon Martin. He SAYS IT: “These assholes, they ALways get aWAY…” He wasn’t having it; he was gonna prevent this particular asshole from “getting away.” This was his prey.
Agreed, but apparently that wasn’t enough to got a premeditated charge.
PS, I should say I do have a slight bias against big fat arrogant pigs.
I am trying to think back. I thought GZ was morally guilty from the very beginning, but after the nen call I knew he was guilty.
Fred, do you agree with BS on this point?:
Bill Sheaffer: if you watch the defense/state watch closely for ‘non’ race issues. i believe they each have a specific juror in mind. state=young/relate. defense=gun rights/older. this is basic but might help as you watch/listen
Yet there are certainly youth invested in gun rights and older people invested in civil rights.
There are also people of all ages invested in civil rights AND gun rights. There are also old white geezers who can relate to Trayvon.
Older — white as often as black — people who value life, civil rights, and have learned there’s no percentage to running off half-cocked despite whatever alleged rationale, are not gravitating to the Fogen camp.
Their consensus: See something you didn’t like? Call the cops and stay in your damn shruck until further notice.
Younger — white as often as black — people who support both civil and gun rights likely have been quicker to spot Fogen for what he is … a chronic loser who needs to belly up to a gun to feel like a somebody,
Their consensus: Same as above.
me: for the state but I’m older and believe in gun rights but don’t believe Z acted appropriately or used common sense as a gun owner.
I tend to agree with Sheaffer.
I’m seeing the same thing.
He heard the NEN call and heard the dispatcher tell GZ not to follow TM, but GZ followed.
Nor will the jurors have only the prosecutions word for it, that gz continued to follow. Since the given times and locations will show that, gz is claiming that he was attacked at a time when, both him and Trayvon would still have been on their phones. The defense can provide no other alternative solution for this, without impeaching their client.
Damn, I’m afraid he’ll be dismissed for cause.
NEN operator: Are you following him? GZ yes. That will be part of trial. No need to forget it just yet.
gz will have to take the stand to explain why that should not have caused the kid to fear him. He’d better not resort to “skipping” or “moving quickly away”, Because the jurors will not be able to accept that as reason to believe gz’s characterization of the child’s mindset at that time.
When ask if Fogen actions were improper, PJ I4 answered with a firm YES.
I4 = I 14
GZ’s body language speaks volumes when he hears the truth about his actions, such as “following.” If he’s that way now, what on earth is he going to do at trial?
I have been noticing it as well.
Yes.
This young pj sounds so sad………:-(
He’s very thoughtful.
Dave, you’re right. That’s it……..Pensive.
That’s the word!
Why didn’t you post the correct word?
My bad……..Please disregard my last comment. I thought you said, “That’s NOT the correct word”.
His mother’s opinion was TM was unarmed and GZ killed him.
he sounds like a skateboarder or snowboarder… oops.. did I just profile… muh bad… a computer geek maybe…
Snow, what snow?
oh yeah… lol huh… I’m in Colorado… got dat snow still in the Rockies… hahaha… ok okay… water surfing…
Since this case there have been many snow jobs in Florida, Professor. And two days before the State of Florida executed Martin Grossman for an unintended murder showing much less “depraved mind and ill will” than this case, there was snow in Florida. I can remember it.
Snowboarders are in a pot culture. That’s a given, yep. At least there’s been a lot of info on that via more recent winter olympics, drug tests, medals withdrawn issues, apologies by atheletes, etc, and media about the ‘culture’ of boarders.
Summers no snow, therefore boarding takes on wheels.
People can apply assumptions and faulty logic to this.
I14 has a very clear memory of the fact that TM did not have a weapon. I think he can relate to TM… Youth, Sweatshirt, Possible Tall.
sounds like he wears hair long and tied in the back right now… lol…
You can tell that from his voice.
Dang, I’m just starting to eat a grilled cheese sandwich I made, but maybe I should ingest something better.
Sorry, I meant the first sentence as a question, not a statement.
First info he got at school from friends was TM was innocent.
Subsequent news reports weren’t as generous toward TM.
Later heard TM was scared and punched GZ in the nose, breaking it.
Probably a follower but he could easily identify with Trayvon.
Fogen’s got the narrow eyes.
Am I being harsh or unreasonable? It just seems so many PJs are the dumbest cows in the herd. This guy doesn’t know what Neighborhood Watch is. He speaks in a duh kind of voice and can’t speak three words without saying uhm. Can’t they speak in loud, clear voices and full sentences?
I think you’re being harsh. He’s an intelligent kid. Soft-spoken. Careful.
All right. Fair enough! 🙂
Neighborhood Watch is something you learn about when you’re parents. I learned about it because I lived in several dangerous cities and had heard of (and met associates of) Curtis Sliwa in NY — who, by the way, would not only convict Fogen but who would enjoy HANGING HIM. Anyway, NW is not something a younger person would know about, neither would he necessarily learn about HOA. You don’t have them in apartment buildings or dorms.
The pool of 500 has been eliminated of any people smart enough to get out of jury duty, physicians and other professionals for example. But yes, sure seems that people don’t care about the world around them. Students may have a reason not to listen to news if they are preoccupied with studies, exams, social events at year end, etc.
I am allowing for this kid being fresh out of high school and not too interested in anything but his raging hormones 🙂
@hinkster4ever. Right! And how many beers he can drink before jumping on the back of a shark-whale. 🙂
He’s young and probably a bit intimidated by the situation. I think he’s OK. Give him a break.
Alrighty! 🙂
Hey, he’s young. Do you know anyone this age?
One of the opportunities we have here is to see Other People.
And, no they don’t all live under a rock. Younger people have different priorites than older retired folks. Right?
Yeah, maybe I was born old. I remember my Dad saying to me sharply, “Shut up!” when I answered his questions with, “Uh, um, er, I, well, you know, um.” “Form the sentence in your mind and THEN speak it!”
I will wager that if you had grabbed up Trayvon Martin right before 2/26/2012 and thrown him on a “mock jury” in civics class and asked him all about current events in Miami, he would not have much knowledge of them. He knew from DeeDee, his buddies, the kids he hung with, and his own world. He wouldn’t even necessarily have read about recent murders in Miami at the time!
I have to do that with my son from time to time, but he’s Asperger’s – on the spectrum – so I guess it’s a little more understandable.
Sound’s like your dad was Old too.
Sorry about that. Have you considered taking up a Young hobby? Surfing or Rock and Roll guitar. We can always learn a New Attitude.
THe defense will try to shed this kid.
Each time (not constantly watching) GZ hears someone say ‘he followed’, he gets his pen to notepaper.
Even without his sleazy smiling at PJ’s who seem to already think he’s innocent, does anyone think GZ is surprised that so many folks seem to believe he’s guilty? Is this part of the trial bringing a reality home to him that hasn’t existed in his tiny world?
Hannity knows Fogen followed. Remember his question, “Do you regret that you got out of your truck…to follow Trayvon Martin that night?”
A: Nossir. (self-righteous “smack-me-now-HARD” look)
gz lacks the ability to effectively parse the inputs he is receiving. Everything he sees and is able to deal with is the “shell of life” that appear on the surface of his observations. He cannot look into the intricacies that give rise to the facade being presented.
Very many times, if you listen to people with opposing ideas very carefully, you will come to understand that their differences arise from certain basics that they both accept. Thus, to get them to work together is usually no more complex than, simply asking them to peel back the layers of their opposition, and join in working on those basics that they agree on. Then bring everyone forward together, to the places where the divides begin to appear.
When everyone sees the divisions appear, and understand the validity of them, the opponents usually find themselves working on their opponents hypotheticals. The upshot is the parties no longer see themselves as opponents but as colleges again.
When a humorous moment reveals, gz takes great pains to try and join in, in hopes of humanizing himself for the jurors. Of course his attorney and the juror expert, realize it doesn’t help him to be seen laughing, because later on, when the deluge of evidence overwhelms them, that laughter is going to count very heavily against him. So they race to stop him.
But he clearly sees a need to try and humanize himself, meaning he knows that he is a monster.
Lonnie~ The ONLY “humanizing” thing he could do is be remorseful. BUT we know he isn’t so there goes that out the window!
________________________________
Right you are, a capacity for remorse would have manifest in the immediate aftermath of the crime, most especially when he had learned from Serino that the kid was not a thug or criminal, but just trying to walk home from the store with some snacks.
But, even if he felt secure that Trayvon was a criminal, because he had others who called him to the scene, thus he could feel that his opinion was in line with theirs, he still should have been able to do an about face on the issue, once he learned the true facts. The true facts meant nothing at all to him, and he persists in his beliefs, way past their own credibility. Refuses to accept that he was wrong, because… Either way he decided to take the fatal shot, not just on his own, but without any provocation at all. He simply decided that killing this kid is what he wanted to do. That is the exact definition of a monster in my book.
Lonnie~ You are So right! A monster that has never held accountable in his life… until now.
________________________________
Gee, I wonder why? Isn’t that exactly what he himself contemporaneously admitted to?
This fellow is I-14, White/late teens or early 20s.
I’m sure this guy’s knowledge of HLN makes the defense wary. But he’s careful to not commit to either side.
But MOM has been on HLN, Taaffe lots of times, Joe Oliver too, and they have had lots of the photos that will not come into evidence but will work on juror’s impression in favor of self-defense, even if the smoke is not weed, even if the pot plants and red liquid, were not Trayvon’s personal property, or even photos he took, but may have been sent to him by others, impression will stick in their minds as ‘true’ as to truth in what you see.
It does seem like the media is on trial here.
Does anyone else think that?
Definitely!
Not just on trial. Judged and found guilty.
Agreed.
Scrutiny for it’s affect on lady justice’s blindfold.
Scrutiny can happen, but the owner(s) of media stations are going to have their Bias displayed on the screen.
(But, don’t show Lady Justice’s Nips.)
Sorry we are late, returning after lunch recess, we are back.
Is it me or does RS always wears a white top?
Who’s RS? Sorry, still catching up on some of the details.
Is there a problem with wearing white? Maybe I should wait to see who RS is.
Rene Stutzman, reporter.
Rene Stuzman of the OS, Orlando Sentinel.
Rene Stutzman, reporter for Orlando Seninel. She’s a slim, short haired white woman, wears glasses and sits on the aisle on the Defense side of the room. She usually wears a white top, sometimes a black jacket. She eats pens.
she probably eats more then pens… where is RZj btw.. lmao… “Did I say thattttttttt?” bad smoke bad bad…
haven’t paid attention, but it’s a stand out without being colo*rful.
I still don’t understand. But, I guess I don’t have to.
colo*rful?
Sorry, maybe I should eat some lunch.
Kathi Belich, WFTV@KBelichWFTVBack in session. I-14 is up. He is a white man who appears to be twenty-something.
In school. Possibly young 20s.
AOL news, heard Trayvon attacked and didn’t have a weapon on him, NW Mr. Zimmerman “called police while following him”, source talked about it at school, says where he originally heard about the case, does FB, HLN a source, he thought this case had ended before he was called, no opinion formed he says, ‘sometimes’ media doesn’t get it right, doesn’t remember any news conference related to case, has not kept up with it, got summons and before came to court, got posts from family and friends, had a few people you might be on the z case, that’s all they posted, he says, no additional info except June 10 jury selection, he responded to them but didn’t elaborate to them.
@hinkster4ever you are a Godsend. Thank you so much.
you are blessed my dear, I’ve read every word you’ve written I can find and feel as if I know you 🙂
Biased headlining by WFTV has to be purposeful, maybe not intending one side, but emphasizing bias in the cell phone photos with added header ‘graphic images’, so even if you don’t know what’s there, you have a warning about Trayvon’s collection of images to suggest negative connotations.
Second article headlined with today’s headline under the trial section, is ‘bloody photos.’ of the defendant.
Bias of this news station, intended or not for anything other than sensationalism and hype and ratings, is undeniable.
I’m personally not using them as a source for video, from this point onward. Including their legal analyst discussions.
good decision
I noticed that too. They also leave the live chat remarks biased against Trayvon up for view longer than remarks that are neutral or for Trayvon. It’s subliminal because you’re looking at the lies O’mara has put out there while trying to watch the jury selection. I won’t be watching them anymore.
Back in session.
Man, Judge Nelson jumps right in, barely sits down when she reopens court.
I missed most of West’s questioning of this PJ. While I was listening, I didn’t hear anything that could justify eliminating him. I’m not sure whether he would be a good juror or not. On one hand, he is clearly intelligent and rational. On the other, he seems very invested in denying the existence of racism, and he seems to have bought the line that GZ was defending himself. It’s hard to imagine an AA person being so incurious about the killing of an AA teenager in his home county. You’d think that, even if he wanted to take GZ’s side, he would have informed himself of the facts so that he could make a good case for him.
He seems to have a responsible job, so he may have bought into the worldview that we live in a meritocracy. Did anyone catch whether or not he has children? If so, they are grown because he said a few times that he lives only with his wife. He did say that he has family all over the world. If any of these people are his grown children, then we can assume that they are high-achieving. He may have raised them to do their best and not complain about discrimination.
I think that he would be very reluctant to vote “guilty” in this case, but he is smart enough that he might not be able to go against the facts.
Clarence Thomas comes to mind. I was furious during his confirmation hearings when he disparaged his sister, who was on welfare. He seems not to understand that his comparatively privileged background (he was sent away to a good school while she did not have the same educational opportunities) might have contributed to the differences in their lives.
I didn’t quite see him as a Clarence Thomas type (he’s a real piece of work), but what you said about not complaining about working hard and not complaining about discrimination rings a bell. Some AA don’t like to sound like victims even as they experience discrimination. I don’t think he’d have a problem convicting Z based on his answers about self-defense being complicated. He didn’t trot out the Treestump-style answer for that.
You’re right, Two sides, that the Thomas comparison is unfair. I am expecting the evidence against GZ to be very strong, and I can’t see this man voting against strong evidence. He would probably be good for our side. I imagine the defense will want to get rid of him. It’s going to be hard for them to come up with a good reason, unless there’s something I missed.
Thomas! My main objection to him was that he was stupid and proudly so! A journalist asked him what his response was to the papers filed by Anita Hill (something like 60 pages– LONG) and he said, “I never read that stuff — I was not interested in reading a pack of lies.” Well how are you supposed to be a Supreme Court Justice if you CHOOSE not to read something that is filed in a case and that someone has placed on the record! I would have said: Didn’t read? OFF THE BENCH!
I think the prosecution can show him the way to a guilty verdict
I’m going to go with your opinion. I have a few friends who are conservative but still caring. I have one friend of color who is conservative, yet fair minded about common decency, but is a person who accepts No Excuses. He say’s Tryin’ is Lyin’. He’s harsher than I am, but I have loved him so long that I can accept that that’s the way he views life.
You wouldn’t want to have to sit through me being in the pj’s position.
I’d have to lie if I wanted on the jury. Did I ever read opinions online about this case.
Well, yes. I’ve read Fred Leatherman’s blogs, but, well, I don’t really Recall exactly what he said. Just spelled out how the system works.
(All y’all believe that one, right?)
Media individuals on camera may have been learning from Big Willie’s fashionista comment about ‘block’ colour use. We have Kathy Belich wearing a bright lime green block of colour, and a couple rows behind her, another reporter wearing a block of bright hot colour from another part of the color wheel. (trying to be equal on the spelling of colo*r)
By beginning of trial proper, we might have the media section littered with bright almost fluorescent blocks to make this look like a drive down the big box strip of competing bright and large ‘blockbusting’ signage.
THis Man isnt right!! Dont trust Him
If this one makes it 35 of 40 is the count now per BS. All have made it thru except the one attorney who was excused.
Lunchbreak means I can run out to the store.
Thanks for good comments. See ya all in a bit.
xxx
Recess until 1:10 pm EDT.
What’s your feeling on the last PJ, Prof?
THis Man isnt right!! Dont trust Him
This guy is being very stealth.
Still can’t tell who for. He could be a good juror – or . . . ! I’m confused on this one.
I don’t think so. Given his comments about not liking the demos and thinking that GZ was defending himself, I’m guessing he considers himself “post-racial.” So I think he was answering truthfully, and not guilefully. He might be a fair and impartial juror. It seemed to me West was trying to get him bumped, perhaps due to a nod from Hirshhorn, but he (West) may have alienated the PJ in the process.
I do not believe he’s a leader. In fact if he were on a majority-white jury he would definitely be a follower. JMO.
He’s really tiptoeing it over SPD, but it might be because of the juror who was outed publicly.
What does he mean by “WE” haven’t proved that” in reference to this being racially motivated?
He said that if they marched its because they feel they have been wronged, but doesn’t think it “appropriate” to march because of high emotions.
Huh???
There’s a current of thought among blacks that says “you shouldn’t stir things up.” It’s based on fear, shame, denial, etc. It’s the black counterpart to the white, “We all got along together just fine until those damn Yankees came stirring things up.”
Yes, there’s a segment that just wants to get along and don’t want to appear radical.
My question is when is it “appropriate” to march? Did he think the marches during the Civil Rights era was “appropriate”?
Many people are afraid of consequences and repercussions. He probably feared hightened racial tensions after the demonstrations, but DAMN! Those demonstrations were multi-ethnic! MANY people regardless of race hate injustice and murder!
In my best southern drawl…SG2 is “fixin” to take y’all to church with Dr. King’s quote “The Right to Protest for Right”. Let the church say Amen!
I agree. Does he realize his dumb behind would probably be hanging from a tree (since he is an education seeking man–and good ole boys don’t like that!) had no one marched. Unbelievable.
Somebody send this guy a link to Sr.s book!
Fogen either thinks he can blast this guy with his eyes or he’s nodding out.
He is a civil rights era person, remembers the marches.
cant help chuckle listening to this witnesses voice…he reminds me of the young man from 30 rock…especially when he just referenced Casey Anthony case and how he couldn’t believe that was a trial.
Recalls Martin Family lawyers appearing at a press conference kinda sorta maybe about getting ready to go to court. Not sure.
Denies talking about this case with his wife although he admits discussing the Casey Anthony case with her.
‘Cept he called it Tracy Anthony case
I heard it too. lol
x3 I’m surprised someone didn’t ask him about that slip! Does he know Tracy Martin’s name?
I caught that too… that’s why I said I’m confused… like Confucius says.. When it is obvious that the goals cannot be reached, don’t adjust the goals, adjust the action steps.
I like him. Would like him as a neighbor. Don’t have an opinion of him for the jury.
THis guy reminds me of an old AA friend of mine. He’s truly quite liberal but to look and listen to him, he comes off as quite conservative. I could be deceived here though.
West apologizing for bouncing around . . . again.
It’s West.
Incoming!
😛 :}~~
gawd…
Don’t any of these PJs have any curiosity?
THey’re trying to get on the jury and think they can’t be!
They’re all lying! I find it astounding that they’ve all been in , around and have tuned in to TV/radio/Internet conversations about this case, but still know absolutely nothing, can’t remember anything, and aren’t the least bit curious. And they’ve formed NO opinions. Yeah right!
Kind of a now-that-we-know-they’re-a-pack-of-liars-where-do-we-go-from-here situation.
They’re curious what kind of media deals they can make IF they manage to get on the jury!
@cielo62 BINGO!! That should be illegal!
I don’t think either side likes him! I could be wrong.
He seems to accept the defense position that Trayvon had some responsibility for his death. He also seems suspiciously incurious.
The two young female interns are behaving themselves today. Someone must have told them that whispering and giggling at the defense table was inappropriate!
The only thing O’Mara correctly did in this case is in choosing those palatable ladies (who should be allowed to giggle as much as they want. Freedom for ladies 🙂 ). O’Mara failed in all other aspects.
I am all for pretty women giggling
sue me 🙂
Tzar~ you are silly! But I concur…
Even as an oldish lady, I choose that over ancient ones crying.
“Hates” HLN.
Denies having an opinion about guilt or innocence or an opinion about any other issue in this case.
Wow, this is interesting. GZ is not smiling. In fact, he is more scowling at this PJ.
Yeah, intense.
As we know, he is not very good at self-control.
That’s an understatement!
Is MOM on his laptop reading the outhouse?
LOL – probably
This PJ is confusing me and I’m getting goose bumps on my body from his speech… or my fan is making me cold…
Zowie, Fogen’s gaze is locked on this guy.
You all noticed that all of CNN’s audience seems to live in Seminole county?
Outside of Sanford. Yeah, seems that way.
CNN’s ratings has been in the tank for a long time. My impression is that people who want to appear neutral, will claim they watch CNN.
I’ll watch CNN over Fox. I also live in the Central Florida area.
Bernie’s working hard to “get” this guy.
Do you mean that Bernie wants him on the jury or wants him excused?
Neither, just that he’s trying to see which way this guy really leans.
Thinks the protests stirred up feelings that were not helpful.
Believes the black community should have allowed the process to work.
Did not believe it was necessary and it got the community riled up.
Of course, the process wasn’t working, but he does not mention that.
Bingo!
Hmmm. Interesting. You know there ARE people who still believe that things “come out all right” if you leave them alone.
Is he religious?
There is nothing “religious” about allowing injustice to happen. That’s called “denial.”
I am getting the impression he thinks had it been 1 year it would have been ok, but 1 month not so much?
Born in the 50s, and is questioning the necessity of the black leaders coming to town because it “causes problems”
he states an opinion here, that he thought it was inappropriate.
Wow! Thought marches for justice for Trayvon were not necessary. I thought I’d misheard the first time, but he repeated it. Thought it was unnecessary for Sharpton, etc., to come to Sanford. Got the community riled up.
I think he is saying this to get into the jury.
Oh, don’t stir the pot and everyone will be ok…my aunt is like that (she’s 81 years old) it comes from fear fortunately there are people who do stir the pot if not it would still be 1865 for AA’s. He most likely will never accept challenging the status quo when the status quo is clearly wrong.
Witness is it I 5 The AA.I feel sorry for this PJ.. people where he works know he got a summons so god knows what was said to him..It is sad to say but this gentleman might feel he needs to be careful about what he says.
ok, I just got back to my pc… so I was going to ask the question if this PJ is black American… Just read the comments… so need to ask… lol This is interesting on the things he is saying… mmmm…
no need to ask is what I mean.
Hmm, very conservative about the protests even though he’s lived through Jim Crow.
He sounds like the archetype of the older Southern black man who out of fear rails against other black people who “cause trouble.”
I am pretty sure this guy is a stealth and he will not let MOM/WEST find cause
hell he is busy insulating himself, Bernie be damned, lol
Denies reading anything on the internet about the case.
now I am curious about his line of work…
Has a problem with cases tried in the media.
Didn’t like HLN’s coverage of the case early on because it seemed prejudiced against GZ.
Normally, watches CNN.
THe defense tends to not want people who watch CNN. THat’s the big libtard media according to the Treestump.
“What about the local media?”
I can so see myself being excused for saying, “Well, you know, I mean, Rene Stutzman is stoned.”
Mediocrity at its finest for a sub-par rag.
This guy is slick
good luck West
Defense’s dream: an AA Zimmietard.
He may be a stealth
I have the same feeling.
If I am right, I also think he is good at it and he will force a peremptory from the defense
Me too.
I don’t see that.
I just checked at the outhouse – they don’t trust him.
You bet the interns will have that noted to send to MOM’s ipad already.
Did he say HLN ‘over the top?’
*standing ovation*
Ha, HLN is also the next channel up or down from CNN from my family’s cable co.
Ditto on U-Verse
He did not like HLN, I like him, lol
Next in the box is I-5, a black male.
Kathi Belich, WFTV@KBelichWFTVI-5 is up. He is a middle aged African American man
retained… detained it’s all the same.
Oh, good, this witness has a strong voice. I can’t stand meek voices.
I-5 Freeway on deck. A man. watches cable.
Crane-Station:
Talk about mentally dyslectic, took me a minute before I realized you were talking about a juror not the Santa Ana Freeway… daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
“Having said that, the defense will argue the inconsistencies are minor, inconsequential and expected, when someone under stress is asked to repeatedly recall certain traumatic events.”
I can relate the most traumatic event in my life, like it happened today and not have different versions. But my last name is not Zimmerman.
sorry that event that I speak of happened almost 12 years ago.
As someone who is ADD, I can ALMOST understand Fogen’s different stories. However, if you pay close attention to the hard evidence coupled with the stories, it’s pretty clear that Fogen is trying to tailor his story to what is acceptable under the law as self-defense.
My son became involved in some allegations by someone and at first the story was one thing, but as time went on, they grew and grew and grew to the point they were nothing like what was first said (like GZ – looking around then looking at houses then looking IN houses) and I was told that this is very common in people who are not telling the truth. The story grows and grows in hopes of being more believable.
To me a minor inconsistency would be forgetting when he holstered his gun but when you switch the story from he jumped out of bushes and ambushed me to he calmly walked up is a BIG change. That and he’s running, he isn’t running.
I really hope that fogen gets on the stand.
at which point does an inconsistency become a lie
Bernie is a Sky-Hawk. There is no better description of him. And you know what, the rodent in this case is fat, very fat. NO Sky-Hawk walks away from that.
🙂
LOL! I love hunting sky-hawks!
There’s on inconsistency that is hardly minor. Zimmerman said one day that he was dropped by Martin’s punch right at the T. He emphasized that to Det. Singleton. Then, during the walkthrough, realizing how far the body was from the T, he said the Martin punch him, and he staggered and stumbled through a flurry of blows until falling to the ground thirty feet away.
Zimmerman said Trayvon walked down the ‘T’ on 2 occasions. In the re-enactment he said Trayvon went down the ‘T’ came back and walked around his car then back down the ‘T’.
But I don’t believe it. And that’s is no minor discrepancy!
So Zimmerman never does walks down the ‘T’ once, he continues on the path to RVC? That’s baloney.
I think he walked down the ‘T’ did but did not see him then he may have walked to RVC to look down the street , then walked back to the ‘T’. Trayvon was hiding, thought he was safe, when he came out Zimmerman saw him. That’s what I think.
RobertSF: He said he was on the ground after the first punch….at the T. Then when he realized in the reenactment he was too far away he starts with the shooing/pushing TM away but he doesn’t explain how he got back up or how he was knocked back down again.
Boyd, several people like “State of the Internet” have done youtube videos about that. During his interviews with Serino, Serino has him mark at each stage of his NEN call where he is at. From the time he says that TM first passes him at the clubhouse to the point where he says he is running, 35 seconds go by.
In those 35 seconds TM walks past him at the clubhouse, goes down Twin Trees, GZ moves his vehicle to follow, TM goes down the sidewalk leading to the T and disappears behind the homes, TM then reappears and retraces his steps, circles Z in his vehicle once and goes back down the sidewalk and runs at the last minute. This is a distance of appox 735 feet and it cannot be done in 35 seconds. It would be a push to do it at a full sprint.
Z lied.
I was just reading that 70% of register voters in Seminole county are Caucasian…. is this true? Another research for me. lol
That’s consistent with what I’ve seen regarding population numbers
Wikipedia has a racial breakdown but it is based off the 2000 census and not the more recent one and the one listed was before the housing crash.
Yes, and that’s why the defense wants her. They think she will fall for their lies.
The jurors are becoming more guarded in their opinions each day.
Not good. They are following everything to get on that Jury.
She was boring.
She’d definitely swing with the majority unless she’s hiding support.
15 minute recess. Resume at 11:13 EDT.
Why does he keep talking about evidence not brought in, and the PJ who said get a deputy? He does realize the broken nose is coming in correct?
You mean can she leave out all the crap you put out there? Ughhhhhhh
lol 😉
X2. He manages to get crap in during jury selection too. I’m surprised there’s been no objection on it.
Bias- News station has MOM’s mug on tv more than I want. That is bias.
Have to leave…..will have to get caught up later. Have a good afternoon everyone.
This woman does not impress. I place her in my follower category.
No basis for a cause challenge and no reason for a peremptory challenge unless I’m trying to create an open seat on the jury to seat the next PJ in the order.
Professor, she is already on my ‘to-strike-list’. I don’t like dealing with folks who for whatever reason are not opaque and thus unpredictable. She might be a follower. She might also be a good con artist. Folks who claim not to know nothing I fear most. They always give the LEGALLY right answer and seem coached as to how to answer questions.
.. Folks who claim to know nothing .. (was meant)
WHOA – Bernie just asked a PJ about VIDEO evidence in the case!
Wondering if he was referring to the surveillance tapes from the clubhouse ?!??
I hope so. They prove a LOT
Willis, pls. elaborate. I am very curious. I just went down to the reception and must have missed that part.
Not sure i can quote verbatim but BDLR was asking if se had seen any “evidence” yet, speaking about “photos or video” and that is what made my ears turn up like a car that just heard a bird land two feet away. To my knowledge there is only ONE or two batches of “video evidence” of interet to the orosexution and that’s either the surveillance videos from the clubhouse or possibly the ATM video that might show mark Osterman in the area. I doubt the prosecution has much interst in the 7eleven video, really.
If bernie was letting out a slip of the prosecution strategy then I am encouraged. While many bloggers seem to think the surveillance videos from the clubhouse are strong evidence for the prosecution, we’ve had zero indication yet that they will be featured at trial.
Willis Newton, I just think Bernie meant videos, NOT videos that would be regarded as evidence by any sane person or by a judge. So the video of Trayvon Martin giggling while grown bozos argue with each other might be carelessly described as “video evidence” when it is not.
By the way I loved the word you coined: orosexution
I shudder to think what it might MEAN! Maybe with BDLR but definitely NOT with O’mara or Skeletor! 😳
Thanks, Willis. Seems we shear something in common: my antennas are very sensitive to certain words. When those words are mentioned, they go up immediately and close in on target. Bernie has a very subtle way of indicating the kind of weapons he has in his arsenal. He uses it often to jab O’Mara (whose eyes does not see and whose ears hear not).
why couldn’t he be referring to GZ’s fake reenactment video? I didn’t hear the exchange you’re talking about so i’m just sayin…in case that slipped your mind?
We make it just fine without a TV, Mr. O’Mara, and so do several of my family members.
I don’t have TV, either. You can stream almost anything, even NFL games during the season. OT but I watched the entire Ravens season from Houston just by streaming online. The stations are in the UK, but they livestream online. Otherwise, locally all I get are the Texans and the Cowboys, neither of which I like.
Exactly. (also, we will contact you by email, and see to getting supplies out)
Crane~ Thanks! Excited for my new toys to use in class!
________________________________
I think your students will be delighted.
Bill Sheaffer: Juror H-69 has not left the courthouse, she is through. That would put us at 33, first potential juror to qualify today… 7 more to go
I need to compare my list to theirs because I have 1 more on my list than they do.
OMGosh… they put her through… hopefully she will be let go on the “cause” round.
Omigosh, the defendant introduced like he’s a co-colleague. Bwa-ha-ha.
*co-counsel*
-doesn’t think media is truthful
-watches it anyway
But never heard about THIS case.
Yeah.
*elbow to buzzer*
Nobody she knows or associates with knows anything about the case. She doesn’t recall being involved in any discussions about this case.
Does she live under a rock?
There seems to be an abundance of big rocks in Seminole County.
😀
Hey, how did they get a picture of my rock on there? That’s my private rock, I get to craw under it while being attacked! Now that everyone knows about my rock, where can I hide? Oh woe is me?
It almost seems like these PJ’s have been coached to lie to try to get on the jury.
I keep thinking the same thing, although not professionally.
She could pass a voice-stress test!
LOL!
Why do I feel like there is an abundance of liars in court today?
Sad day when families do not talk about staying safe while walking in a hoodie.
one neighborhood watch has made the community much safer (sarcasm)
It’s probably hard for most of us to understand, but many people live without informing themselves about anything, local, national, or international. Or they might know every last detail about celebrities’ lives but nothing outside that.
True that to some degree, but my feeling with almost all these PJs is that they’re underreporting what they know because they want to be on this jury.
My son and daughter-in-law have no clue at all about what is going on in the news, not EVEN celebrities. They never watch news. I guess if it is something big (locally or nationally) it will be discussed at my son’s work, but my daughter-in-law never watches anything but NetFlix.
Rachael~ I had a co-worker, a fellow TEACHER, who never watched the news. Said it was too depressing. WTF?? Current events is KEY to making our education meaningful! I ALWAYS keep up with the news, if no other reason than to explain it to my students or make connections with our classroom subjects. HOW can anyone live with their heads in the sand??
I think it is a sad day when families have to talk about staying safe while walking in a hoodie. That is just effing sad.
That’s because they don’t have to worry about being profiled because of their clothing or the color of their skin. It’s simply not an issue for them. That may explain the apathy and lack of empathy we are seeing.
And the perception that TM must have been doing something wrong. I see this attitude among the middleclass mainstream and especially whites ALL THE TIME.
I have been nervous since this happened. I walk dogs late at night in hoodie. I walk them at 7pm with hoodie, at distance or with my back turned you can not see the color of my skin. Not that my skin color should matter. But the point is thanks to fatass I do worry!
O’Mara looks like he’s chomping at the bit to get at this PJ.
Folks, today may not be such a good day for the prosecution. All the PJs so far are very depressing.
They do seem to be very young. But, of course, I’m over 60, so Everyone is young these days.
WE don’t get older, THEY just get younger. 🙂
Yeah, but they are getting SO much younger. LOL
I’d love to see 60 again. 🙂
I couldn’t hear her on the wildbout streaming … went to the WFTV site… you can hear her better.
nbc is good too
http://www.nbcnews.com/video/nbcnews.com/52117880/
OoooOOO I like NBC better. Going to stay right here…Now I can record better.
how are you recording it?
Camtashia… but will only record the Trial as it starts..
thank you
I spelled it wrong.. Camtasia
I googled it
looks good
yvw
There is a program called “Debut” which is free but I didn’t like it. I have had Camtasia since it first started… and I love it.
Nice, I had to turn the volume down for once.
Thank you!
if you use this program Tzar… to have good clear audio… “do not use microphone”.
Yes, same here (so it’s not your computer).
Fox News. Great. Just great.
LOL, just when you thought things couldn’t get any…
She watches Fox.
I know that when I was pregnant I was overlysensitive. Not the other way around.
Exactly. Every drop of a leaf, death of a stranger . . . everything made me cry!
Oh, and those commercials raising money for children in poor countries? Tear City. I hear you.
Me, too. I could not bear to read anything about children being hurt, just couldn’t handle it.
Meee too.
I thought she said she is a business major? But then she said in her line of work death happens daily? Did I hear wrong?
HAHHAHAA! In her line of business death is bought and sold daily.
A funeral home? 🙂
@ cielo62:
We think alike, funeral home jumped into my head immediately.
yikes, She’s too cold for anything to do with people.
I’m desensitized to people dying. That blew me away.
Well Hell, since people die all the time, why should we bother to HAVE a law against murder?
it sounds like she has been excused
woo hoo
x2!
“My type of work where people lose their life you become desensitized.”
Speak for yourself, whatever line of work you are.
I wondered about that statement. But she also stated her work was on the or with the phone, and she only went downstairs occasionally to get something to drink.
I don’t know what she was running her sanctimonious mouth about, but I have worked in two Level One trauma centers where we saw spectacular tragedy nearly constantly, and I never knew anyone I ever worked with who said anything quite like this.
Crane a friend of mine works on the emergency ward for several decades now. I always wonder how she manages to deal with it so well.
When I worked in settings where we saw horrific stuff, we often would grab some other nurses, hit the break room, cry and get it together, and return composed. I have done this more than once. One patient had been in a car wreck on the freeway, where his two young children burned to death as he tried desperately to free them; then his wife died in the burn ICU. I needed help with that, I just wanted to start bawling.
So, even though there is a good deal of gallows humor, there is compassion. A lot of it.
Crane a friend of mine works on the emergency ward for several decades now. I always wonder how she manages to deal with it so well.
Losing life to illness is NOT the same as someone taking that LIFE from that person’s family. What a moron.
She’s saved, so we also have a potential 13th juror problem.
What does that mean…13th problem?
Juror potentially defers to God to decide the case for her and we cannot know or trust the identity of the voice she listens to.
That’s not evidence based thinking.
Gimme that ol’ time religion.
That’s weird about the 13th; God is not even listening to the evidence and no one should claim to know the mind of God, anyway. Thanks for your answer.
it’s all god’s plan.
I believe in God and his word, but he gave us all free will and choices to make decisions good or bad. It’s not up to God in what we do in this life. It’s up to you and Fogen failed… I wish people would stop saying it is God’s Plan or God’s Will when he gave it to us to know what is good or evil. People need to understand God’s Plan or His Will to believe and trust in Him. No wonder some people don’t believe in God. so be it. The People who do believe… need to stop blaming God for things that happen in violence. Fogen did this to himself…. It’s the Will of the Jurors to find him innocent or guilty. ugghh…
Dismiss her for religious cause. Ugh.
Then, as if he had discovered something that he should have known a long time ago, he murmured sadly, This is the stuff we’re made of, half indifference and half malice.”
― José Saramago, Blindness
One of the better books I have read.
H-86 on deck. Woman.
Love his style and pace
reminds of Freud
Tzar and Crane:
This is going to send me to the library. Thanks!
you won’t be disappointed, reading him is like listening to a good close friend tell you a tale they are a passionate about
Stuck-up Know-It-All: You are not making sense. You rely on the Wall Street Journal for research, how do you do, but you don’t trust the media…and thank you.
???
She GOES to church? Oh Lord.
Have you not read the great Book of Job, my good friend?! The devil do go to Church. Before that, it was the Synagogue. From there HE (not she) move on to the Church.
Interesting way to put it. He did, in fact, attend an assembly in heaven.
SM, a small point, but: “Before that, it was the Synagogue,” — actually, no. “Before that, it was the Temple.”
Interestingly, the Devil or Lucifer was NOT a demon in Judaism. but more like a prosecuting attorney who called up all the sins of humanity before God. His character took a decidedly sinister twist when christianity took over. TOTALLY OT. Sorry.
It’s amazing how all these pj’s don’t watch the media, dont trust the media, but believe all the lies spread in the media… and they wonder why the WORLD looking at their azzes sideways..
She’s on a leave of absence from work due to her pregnancy and she wants to spend two months on a sequesterd jury. WTF!
I wonder what her employer might think about that.
I suppose that, in her position, I might figure that the trial will be over long before the baby is due, so why not? On the other hand – at 5 – 1/2 months and she apparently has a mostly sit-down kind of job, so why is she already on leave of absence? Is that an indication that she has already experienced some kind of complication?
I think a lot of young women who are pregnant, especially the first time, consider that they are the center of the entire universe. That’s been my experience, at least.
“Excuse me judge, need another pee and stretch aching back break!”
Wondering why the didn’t do a sidebar when West said “profiled” yesterday and today they get BDLR for the word “murdered”. What is wrong with BDLR today?
West just made a big point about both, now ‘profiled’ was noticed, as well as ‘murdered’. duh.
What … not allowed to use the word “murder” in a MURDER trial? ❓
Apparently every parent needs to take a photo of their child every day and have it handy in case there are more Fogens in the world.
Her doctor’s appointments will conflict with the trial and if complications arise, what the hell would she do?
Judge needs to excuse her.
West wants to keep her because he thinks she will be a good defense juror.
Infuriating.
Now, he is trying to insulate her from a challenge for cause.
This is nuts.
Come on, Judge.
I had to run out so I missed it but are you serious? wow
He is wasting the court’s time with this PJ.
Prof, you have been mostly silent about this judge. And I liked her more for her handling of the case as this moved through some of the pre-trial antics, she seemed highly organized, the defense could not ruffle her when she knew what was what, and she does have a quiet way of letting something run then putting the brakes on it.
But things are ramping up now. Will she be able to prevent situations early or let them run on awhile until she brings out the big gavel? (does she even own a big gavel?)
But I like her. Just concerned that she may not have the full respect of certain parties, and even certain jury members with biases tucked away about women in society.
and the last point, is still and sadly, relevant.
Here is brainiac West doing what BDLR should have done. This PJ could have a medical emergency while in sequestration. I think BDLR may be getting tired. Someone need to fire him up.
Why does she want to be on the jury? She’s pregnant. Strange.
Defense wants her baaaadly.
She doesn’t want to be on the jury let her go…. Let her be… uggh..
I want her gone… she is self absorbed on her own surroundings not anyone or anything else.
Lord God. It’s the West/GZ coached smile freak show.
You are hysterical…you need a talk show;) I really cannot attend to this stuff for very long….power to you…..I think what gets me is that we really are talking about someone’s young son.
Yes. That is the tragic part.
Give this woman twos week behind locked doors and in chains and naked and pregnant and hungry, with Ariel Castro, and she will learn to feel, maybe even feel a little for the other woman and child in the house.
What a self absorbed bitch! Maybe she will become more empathetic when she becomes a mother.
imo I doubt it. Most women have motherly instincts. This gal could careless about a deceased child.
You’re right. It’s hard to imagine someone that unfeeling.
Plenty of mothers are unfeeling about other people’s children, especially about other “inferior” people’s children. You did not see a lot of Nazi mothers fussing about what was being done to the million children murdered in Europe from 1939-1945. And you do not see mothers of terrorists fussing about the children THEIR children have killed. It’s a particular perversion of Patriarchy that the normal maternal instincts of women have been converted into a horrible form of “patriotism,” coming from the same root word: Patr
Hardship. Plus, she ain’t the doctor, and does not know what her medical course will be.
Did she say she is a first time Mom? If so she already has decided to side with Fogen. My daughter in law has not followed this case and she thinks Fogen is in the wrong. jmo
Meant to add my grand-child is 4 (handful)
Women and especially mothers who side with Fogen have always confused and disgusted me.
How can a woman, but a mother not have empathy… She does not wonder about how this case may impact the world her child will be born into?
These type females make me say WTF!
All women who support fogen confuse and disgust me. One would think they’d inherently understand the fear and concern of Trayvon being followed at night by a stranger, considering our physical vulnerabilities in such a situation.
I’d put money on each one of them listing their “concern” about fogen being followed at night by Trayvon, if the situation was reversed, and fogen was a white teen and Trayvon was a black adult male following him at night; empathizing about how much they’d be worried if it was them.
Oh of course… and that pisses me off as well. The FACT that we know were the roles reversed things would be extream opposite and an execution would have taken place by now.
I REJECT THAT BULLSHIT! (sorry for the strong language, but my rejection is just that strong. As is Sybrina Fultons)
I so agree with you SoulSista, I have been asking myself, how in the hell can some women and especially those who are mothers, support the murderer of another woman’s child. another thing, I do not believe that one single solitary mother, who has suffered the death of a child through murder, have stood by Sybrina Fulton. smdh
5.5 months pregnant! Hardship! Byebye!
She hasn’t provided a basis to excuse her for cause, but I would not want her on the jury because of her lack of empathy, not to mention that she is not well formed.
She is a mask of pretensions.
She’s also 5 and 1/2 months pregnant.
” a mask of pretensions.”
a master at the turn of a phrase. 🙂
whew. she’s gone. hardship.
The word vapid comes to mind as a descriptor.
World’s Authority somehow doesn’t even know the names in the case that the other 7 billion humans on the planet know.
Juror H 69 is not slick. Get her out of here with a quickness.
I be kind of curious why she was on Leave of absence from her job. mmm interesting. but know it is confidential… She is closed minded… would make a very bad juror… it sounds like she will be the type that will follow the majority without knowing the facts or evidence…
She mentioned a baby. Maybe she’s a new mother.
mba arrogant.
She is very beligerent towards Bernie. Let’s see what her attitude is towards the defense,
She’s for the defense and trying to be deceptive about it.
I think we’ll know more when she is questioned by West. Might be nice to hear anyone snark back to him.
Is the question on opinion an odd question or is it the only way to ask the question… Get her outta here, she irks me and comes across as a confused person.
Wall Street journal, my ass.
She’s above it all. Just reads the Wall Street Journal and isn’t interested in local matters.
She is a plant.
I think so too, evasive and deceptive.
We all get that you went to college, and that you place yourself above the lawyer, Your Arrogance.
This is odd.
She sounds like she is not caring about things that surrounds her.
As one who lost a family member to a gun murder personally, this young PJ pisses me off for her sophomoric, moronic arrogant attitude. She doesn’t have the time to focus on the pettiness of a simple murder.
What a bitch.
Did West just say “murder”?
I don’t know. I actually heard that Bernie did and there was an objection, but I missed it. If West said it, I missed that also.
Juror H 69 says people lose their lives all the time.
Translation: Why are people making a big deal out of this case? People get killed everyday.
I got that too
Deaths happen, so she does not pay attention to them.
Stunning empathy!
GET THIS HEFFA OUTTA HERE! Kick ROCKS with open toed shoes!
Agreed!
Don’t like her at all. It goes without saying that people die all the time. She’s way too glib and dismissive.
Unless it’s MURDER then that becomes a justice issue. Sheesh! And she graduated from college? In what, heartlessness and basket weaving??
“People die all the time”
Superfluous, inane and gratuitous=evasive=another philosopher without a clue
Agree.
This PJ is hostile and hateful, and lying to cover it all up. But her hostile written statements are as powerful as an actual confession to hate. She knew her written statement was a mistake before coming today and has apparently decided not to know or remember anything. She is trying to remedy whatever is there to be remedied.
Good insight on her!
Maybe she’s OTR and really NOT wanting to be on jury duty. Nothing like some hostility to get you kicked off.
They’ve got the court reporter looking up something.
bDLR said “people get murdered every day? ” and I’m guessing the defense objected.
Well, West used “profiled” like a dozen times yesterday. Wasn’t that one of the banned words?
I must have missed something. What’s this sidebar about?
We must have been typing at the same time.
Ha, yes, it seems so.
I just want to say that you all know that not everyone is focused on this trial the way folks here are.
I was telling my daughter about following the trial, and she only sort of recalled the incident. She’s not a stupid girl at all, she just doesn’t follow either politics or the news. Just to keep a perspective, here.
As a mother of a son, a wife, a daughter, aunt of AA males, this case should be off the rector scale in the AA community. A message will be sent to the AA community and society in general either way.
Rector – Richter
World Press NEEDS an edit button for the challenged; like me.
I think this side bar is due to BDLR use of the word Murder.
Man!!! I get so sick and tired of people stating about the age of Trayvon Martin and the pictures that are out there are not correct. The age of Trayvon Martin is important but the pictures that are out there are showing that he is not a thug as they are calling him. That he had a good child hood… so what if they showed pictures while he was young… OMgosh on some of these people.
Agreed smokee, any parent should known when seeing the earlier pictures they weren’t of a 17 yr. old.
Sidebar when BDLR used the term ‘murdered’.
We may learn more about this once Sybrina Fulton testifies, (at least I hope she puts this to rest) but I read that the picture was taken when TM was 16. TM had just turned 17 when he was murdered.
Sybrina said in one interview that he had just gone through a growth spurt.
parrot, there were more, like the football pics.
Yes, and OM yesterday called that picture a 12-year-old picture and he knows damn well that pic was taken sometime the year prior to Trayvon’s death.
I have ask that question forever… the picture is irrelevant.
Recalls that TM was not a young innocent child as originally portrayed.
This was a comment by someone at work whose identity she does not recall.
She just finished college this year.
She seems indifferent, if not irritated by the incident.
Get rid of her. She’s horrible.
Yep, too detached for me.
and she’s also a liar…
she’s trying too hard to get on the jury.
She wrote that she knows that TM isn’t the young child that the media tries to portray. Yet, when asked she doesn’t know how old TM is. wishy, washy.
I don’t care if Trayvon was 7 or 17 Fogen called police on both. Fogen did not have any right to shoot Trayvon. Hopefully before they are done with her, her true colors will be known.
He looked young because he was young!
Bill Sheaffer: h 81 being walked out right now behind us.. no traction yet. still at 32
THAT is good news!
Reported to be in her late 20s, mixed race, reporter can’t tell is she is mixed black or Hispanic and white.
Has Jr quit attending the trial?
Practicing punditry in mirror
I don’t think we’re going to get to 40 today.
He went clubbing over the weekend and tore a heavy bender, won’t be back in action for a while. :-O
He is still drying out
Oh Man it seems that if Trayvon had only been 22 years old, Zimmerman would be receiving a Nobel prize
She does not remember what he is was wearing? But she remembers the picture.
I forget to say Good Morning, I’m here.
What is it about this young woman that makes you think she should be out?
She is incredibly over-focused on a picture of Trayvon as a young boy, which has zero to do with the elements of the crime.
Because she doesn’t watch tv, it seems not to know very much at all, which may be why she is mentioning the photo. I’d have to hear more from her to have an opinion.
She also claims that she relies heavily on the Wall Street Journal…
and then there’s the:
“The only opinion I formed was that someone lost their life, but hey…”
…”That happens all the time.”
Precisely!
two strikes:
1) WSJ
2) “not the young boy the media portrayed him”
*forehead hits judges buzzer*
Errrrrrrrrrrrrnnnnnt.
X
She needs to go, all she knows is picture of Trayvon.
but she refers to the defendant by name… pass on this one
Get rid of her.
She should be x’d
How did you get into my keyboard?
(X)
Why, what did I miss?
The media tried to make Trayvon out to be a child
Thanks Tzar.
Bernie will have to light a match on this one. He’s got to go.
H-69 on deck. A woman.
They say if Judge says follow deputy Jarvis that the juror is being dismissed, just from previous ways of finding out if a juror is dismissed or not 😦
coming out of lurkdom today 🙂
So, Jarvis carries a scythe and shows PJs to the outside elevator.
This is H69.
There is no basis for a cause challenge and I do not believe Bernie will use a peremptory, although I would.
In any event, he probably won’t get into the box, so this guy may be irrelevant.
This guy has 2 civil cases pending before Judge Nelson.
Not sure if he is a lawyer or litigant.
I think he is a lawyer.
I think I heard them say he was a defendant
If so, you’d think sequestration would be a hardship.
Since they know he is in two pending cases… Will he most likely be excused?
2 lawsuits against a HOA with Judge Nelson, think this one might be a goner.
guess he is a keeper according to channel 6
Guess he’s going to get a strike, if he goes to the next level.
Oh! He is a f**king lawyer!
…or else a party to a lawsuit.
H-81
same judge.
Wowsers.
Prosecutors/lawyers can do their best to force their way into someone’s head/mind, but the access will always be limited to an extent.
PJ H81 is not opaque, it’s kind of hard to read him. He comes across as thoughtful, analytical, detached, cold and dry. IF he is not stonewalling, he would make an excellent juror. That said I would put him on the ‘to-strike-list’. It’s better to err on the side of caution.
It seems to me MOM is trying to undermine JN. She told him last night that would be decided after trial about how long to keep Jury info private. Why does he then try to get PJ to request it?
O’Mara is staying away from substance and merely schooling the guy.
They are trading words.
He has served before, and says he wonders what happens to jurors after high-profile cases.
Has anything ever happened to a juror?
Maybe he wants a book deal.
O’Mara is trying to endear this guy.
O’Mara you hole.
(I think the defense wants him)
Phone rang again, and the judge is annoyed.
Well DUH! It’s very clear that NO cell phones are permitted in the courtroom. Take the offender out and put him in the stocks!
Morning beautiful people! Let’s go get some justice. Sorry, I am generally this chipper in the morning.
I think JN sequestered jury cause MOM can’t keep his mouth shut and stay away from camera.
That is definitely the reason; it’s also the reason for this specific area of questions the PJ are being ask.
I don’t think an attorney should be allowed to walk away unscathed by the BAR after mucking up a case in this way. MOM & co. are very disgusting people.
Ughhh, woke up late. Sorry bout that. Glad you guys are here to fill me in.
Can’t get past him alleging to seeing more of BDLR than O’Mara on broadcast news. To that , I offer a big fat HUH?
If he watches MSNBC that could be possible, and that could be a good thing.
Bernie wants to move on. He’s allowed himself to fall into a bit of a rut and he’s not as plugged-in or listening to the answers.
This is dangerous. He needs to get back in the moment and he is preaching too much.
I find it astonishing that this would happen given the narrow focus of the examination. I kind of wonder what exactly is Bernie cueing in or listening for from these PJ’s
Strange.
Bernie never listens. It’s his Achilles heel.
is it possible that bdlr KNOWS his case is so airtight, that this phase isnt as important as it usually is?
No. THIS is the only place where gz has a chance to get a hung jury. Just ONE stealth assh*le Zidiot and it would be game over. THIS is crucial, as the Prof explained once on an entire thread. I just never realized how gosh-darned TIME CONSUMING it is!
Can somebody tweet him & tell him to wake his butt up?
Recalls two emotional families driving this case.
Source of news: CNN and MSNBC.
Doesn’t recall reading any news print about the case.
At least he hasn’t been poisoned by the OS.
Did a cell phone just ring in the courtroom?
He equates Trayvon’s family’s grief with the Z family’s “grief”.
disgusting, imo. Can not compare the two.
yup
Ugghhh.
When he said Z family, that reminded of someone who has been on these media social sites and uses only the first initials. I don’t trust him.
HEY! I only use the 1st initials! Just my habit. Or else I’d call him far worse than fogen.
and you’re where??? lmao
Smokeegyrl- um. I’m at home on my computer…. Smart butt! But hey! I’m trustworthy! Initials aside.,,,
FROM THE CLUTTERED DESK OF Cielo62
lmaoooo… just funning withcha… lmaooo
You just made me laugh… thanks…
he switches memory for opinion in order to evade questioning
He’s covering up
he is evasive
totally agree.
Something’s off…
Hmmm. Yeah he knows a lot more than he’s saying.
Recalls commentary about the 911 recordings but did not listen to them.
I like him.
PLANT!!!
pogy? 🙂
But he doesn’t know which way the streets run.
Perfidy!!!!
get him out of here
Lol
I think he will be fair. But he is also smart, and I think liberal. The facts will lead him to a guilty verdict.
I think this person is a potential leader, given the vocabulary he uses and a tendency to hide behind words.
He’s been a juror before and he knows the rules.
I would use a peremptory challenge on this guy because my gut is telling me that he is not being truthful.
I do not trust him.
This guy is smart. But what’s his opinion?
Bernie needs to pressure this guy
Video is soooo funny. Now I’ll go for the coffee.
LOVED the video! Sounds like trying to get the truth from a second grader! Does that mean I have the experience to be a defense attorney?? LOL!
Whoa, up way too early on the left coast, but glad I’m waking up to Bernie’s voice, not West! : /
I would b e happy to wake up to Bernie’s voice every morning ❤
He recalls seeing BDLR on TV more than O’Mara.
Don’t know how that’s possible.
Also, says he thinks the lawyer would be truthful.
his mental capacity or his veracity or both are now in question
Well, we all know that BDLR hasn’t been on TV. Just in the court setting. WTH is he talking about.
get him out of here
don’t believe him on lawyers talking.
Kathi Belich, WFTV @KBelichWFTV
Court is in session! H81 is up. He appears to be possibly of mixed race and in his 50’s. #Zimmermanon9
This guy referred to TM as he got shot.
So I think he’s a Z supporter.
h81
Thank you.
On a separate note, Professor, many thanks again for including the video yesterday of Gerry Spence at work. It was brilliant. I loved it like nothing I’ve seen in a long time. The master at work. Thank you so much!
Sorry, went to the store for grapes. Just returned.
What is this guy’s number?
Of wrath?
Heh.
clickorlando.com reports 32 PJs passed
Any chance it will all move more quickly today? The judge must be very weary…..
Beverly:
I think that the judge isn’t weary enough. From the bits I saw yesterday she let the defense ask a ton of questions outside of the scope of the hearing. If she cuts that out, they may get further.
Let’s hope…Thanks
The first day they only did four, so things have picked up quite a bit.
Well, not really.
Because they didn’t start voir dire until the afternoon session.
Good Morning! May this day be a joyous one w/o West…
Don West = Agent Smith. : )
Good morning! Thanks to all who tortured themselves last night to watch Frye Hearing. I caught up this morning with all the comments. West is killing my brain cells and after raising four boys I do not have a bunch to lose. 🙂 I can hardly wait to get to 40 so we can pretty much start all over with the questioning. Maybe West will lose his voice.
I lose IQ points every time I listen to West.
LOL Me too, and I don’t have many to spare.
good morning Crane
oh yeah and a few brain cells too, i’m stiil reeling from yesterdays’ nite court,
Morning!
🙂
Good morning, all: Love Crane’s Courier-Jurnal clip toward end of previous thread of judge tempted to strangle lawyer. Recommend viewing during today’s sidebars.
beta
Good morning all! Should be another interesting day, but likely only slight chance of getting to that 40.
God speed on this one!
Alpha! All aboard on the train to Jordan.
People get ready, there’s a train comin’
You don’t need no baggage, you just get on board
All you need is faith to hear the diesels hummin’
You don’t need no ticket you just thank the lord
People get ready, there’s a train to Jordan
Picking up passengers coast to coast
Faith is the key, open the doors and board them
There’s hope for all among those loved the most
There ain’t no room for the hopeless sinner whom would hurt all mankind
Just to save his own
Have pity on those whose chances grow thinner
For there is no hiding place against the kingdoms throne
People get ready there’s a train comin’
You don’t need no baggage, just get on board
All you need is faith to hear the diesels hummin’
You don’t need no ticket, just thank the lord
@Big Willie!
I love this song. Curtis Mayfield = legend!
You don’t need no ticket, just thank the lord.
*goosebumps*
Fogen get ready there’s a (prison) train a coming and, it’s headed straight for YOU! you see Fogen, this is exactly what happens when you think you are above the law, just because of who your father is.
I’m so glad that, this is one time that he can’t get you out of what you have bought and paid for. had he not interfered in your past criminal acts, you may have very well turned out to be a better person. so, as it stands Fogen, your lying bitter old man, is a big part of the reason, that you find yourself in a world of trouble today.
The racist bigot couldn’t bribe the folks at the FDLE, to just make it go away. the blood of Trayvon B. Martin, is also on the hands of Robert The Racist Zimmerman Sr. just as well as on the hands of his son.
Me too! 😆
Can’t that chariot swing any lower? I’m short and fat!
You get use my shoulders to lift yourself up. 🙂
Xena~ OOMPH! Thanks! Riding that train to justice!
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@cielo62. If both of us should fall, Racer should have a good car jack to lift us both. 🙂
Xena~ If we should fall, there are many here to that will carry on. http://youtu.be/22AKunA1_Bw
(this damn movie ALWAYS makes me cry)
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@cielo62. Glory!! One of my fave movies.
Xena~ mine, too. There is a gorgeous monument set up for the REGIMENT, the only one of its kind, since most monuments are for the generals and NOT the soldiers. I wonder, deep down, would I have that courage? I, too, would want people to know I went down standing up.
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