Afro-Peruvian emperor wears no clothes

Wednesday, April 24, 2013

BDLR has filed a motion asking Judge Nelson to order the defendant to appear at the April 30th hearing and state on the record that he is waiving his right to the immunity hearing.

H/T to Southern Girl 2 for providing the link to BDLR’s motion

He also asks Judge Nelson to issue an order that she will not permit the immunity hearing to take place during the trial or after it.

I support this motion. In fact I published three posts in early March warning that this needed to be done to avoid significant legal problems that might otherwise come up forcing a retrial of the case, if the jury convicted the defendant.

1. Combining the immunity hearing with the trial in the Zimmerman case is a terrible idea

2. Combining the immunity hearing with the trial in the Zimmerman case is a terrible idea (Part II)

3. Post trial immunity hearings are a terrible idea

This motion is an example of a prosecutor taking action to protect the record from a collateral attack by a new lawyer representing the defendant after he is convicted and sentenced to prison and arguing that the defendant is entitled to a new trial and a statutory immunity hearing because he never waived his right to that hearing and did not know or consent to Mark O’Mara waiving it for him.

BDLR also wants Judge Nelson to clarify the record regarding the possible merger of the statutory immunity hearing with the trial, which O’Mara had suggested as an alternative to holding the hearing during the last two weeks of April, so that the record shows that she considered and denied O’Mara’s request more than a month before trial. Such an order would foreclose an argument by O’Mara that he never waived the statutory immunity hearing and reasonably believed and relied to the defendant’s detriment on the two matters being combined.

Best to clarify that current ambiguity in the record so that it does not result in reversal and remand for an immunity hearing and a new trial, if the defendant loses the immunity hearing.

Therefore, I believe BDLR’s motion is timely and necessary to protect the record.

Although I believe O’Mara decided long ago that he had no chance to win the immunity hearing because the defendant could not withstand cross examination due to his many conflicting and inconsistent statements. I think he decided that he did not want to formally admit in open court on the record that he was waiving his client’s right to the statutory immunity hearing because he was concerned about the effect that his waiver would have on his efforts to substantially increase donations to his “innocent” client’s internet defense fund and win the trial in the court of public opinion. To use a poker analogy, folding your hand at the last minute by waiving the hearing establishes that you were bluffing when you kept insisting that you had a winning hand.

Not exactly the ideal position for the defense to be in on the eve of trial.

BDLR is going for the jugular with this motion to clarify for all the world to see that the Afro-Peruvian emperor wears no clothes.

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567 Responses to Afro-Peruvian emperor wears no clothes

  1. KA says:

    “O’Mara said that if it were not for the intense coverage on the shooting, Zimmerman “may never have been charged.” Now since he is, the case “probably would have been addressed as a matter at a self-immunity hearing and it would have gone away that way.”

    I find this statement laughable since somehow it is just “not going away with a self immunity hearing…”….but this story laughable overall….

    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/zimmerman-attorney-social-media-caused-firestorm-trayvon-martin-shooting-article-1.1329529

    • Deborah says:

      @KA:

      Moron O’Mara needs to STFU! He must think this is 1945, when blacks had no civil rights and racists whites could murder blacks without any repecussions. Sorry Mark, but this is not the 40s and 50’s. You cannot murder black people without provocation and walk away from it!

      If i weren’t for the parents of this boy and the many protests calling for the investigaton in this case, Fogen may have gotten away with this murder. Moron O’Mara seems to have forgotten that many of the laws were changed due to civil disobedience, with blacks marching and protestin for equality.! What O’Mara states is ignorant and of course laughable! If he thinks blacks are going back to the old days, he must be smoking some good stuff! LOL!

      • ladystclaire says:

        @Deborah, those are the days that O’mara and many others like him would like to see this country go back to. if they had their way, this country would be regressing and not progressing. Trayvon was a human being and, he and his family deserve the justice that is afforded to ever murder victim and, their family no matter what the color of their skin may be.

        There have been some pretty nasty things said about this child victim, his family and, AA in general. this kind of stuff IMO is not what this country is suppose to be about. how can it be the best in the world, if we have some people who feel that certain people don’t have any rights as well as a right to be here. never in the history of this country has a murdered child been so mistreated and disrespected as Trayvon Martin has.

        He was only a seventeen year old child who was walking home, minding his own business talking to his gf until this murdering *THUG* came into his life only to take his life. now how can anybody with any heart and soul, support someone who can just do what Fogen did, when he took this kid’s life? IMO you have no heart and you certainly have no soul, if you can support a murdering POS like George Zimmerman.

        You are IMO no better than he is because, you are just like him!

  2. “Pervian schnozz” Thanks PMom….I now have a permagrin installed for the evening…

    Anyone wanna take a shot at “fogen” by Dr. Seuss?

    • PiranhaMom says:

      @MountainMan.

      Pat, please let me apologize for my spelling mistake. This was supposed to read “Peruvian” schnozz. That is the nose you see in the highlands of Peru. You never see that profile on, say, Mt. Kilimanjaro. Thus, I do not see any “Afro” ethnicity to the schnozz.

      Pervian perhaps was just Freudian, but as Sigmund Freud once famously stated, “Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.”

  3. Big Willie says:

    I have a strange feeling, when Fogen appears in court he will have lost a substantial amount of weight. I believe he wants to give the impression of a man in control! I think over the years, Fogen has mastered gaining and losing weight, whether it be by prescription, purging or cleansing. Narcissist are all about reflection (theirs and others) and Fogen is coming with a dumb ass, narcissistic trick up his sleeve. JMO

    • cielo62 says:

      Big Willie~ It was weird he GAINED over 100 pounds in a month. I don’t see him losing the weight almost that quickly. But we will see.

    • Yeah, I can see him Porkin’ & Pukein’………he sure as hell wasn’t studying…IMHO

    • pat deadder says:

      BigWillie I’ve been thinking about that as well.I think the reason he gained weight is because he is not on Adderall.And the reason he isn’t is because no doctor will prescribe it .Isn’t a possible side affect violent tendencies.

  4. ladystclaire says:

    Joonyah is on one of his rants on twitter, talking about Trayvon was armed that night. he is saying that Trayvon picked up a chunk of concrete and hit Fogen in the nose with it. now, these people definitely don’t have ALL that GOD promised them. what I’m saying when I made this comment is the fact that, every member of that family is *LACKING* in commonsense and, morals dept.

    As for motor mouth Joonyah, someone needs to put a muzzle on his mouth and, he also needs to produce that chunk of concrete so it can be tested for the presence of his murdering brother’s DNA on it. also, some people are questioning the whereabouts of Trayvon’s wallet, tht he had on him when he was at the counter of the 7/11 paying for his purchases. this is a question that is being asked by some over at HP web site.

    Who took that child’s wallet and, where is it now? Trayvon’s parents are wanting to know where it is. I’m thinking that, Fogen took that wallet when he was searching the body and, he may have given it to good ole boy Timothy Smith. this is how LE knew who Trayvon was and, yet they elected to list him as a John Doe in the morgue.

    IMO officer Timothy Smith, is more involved in this case than we know and, that involvement is not for the good. how can these people in LE know that a child was murdered and yet they chose to turn a blind eye to his murderer and, attempted to sweep this murder under the rug. smdh

    • Lonnie Starr says:

      It’s going to be quite something to see the look on Joonya’s face when the civil trial jury hears and reads his rants in court. While no one faults him for supporting GZ, there is no reason at all for his spreading lies about Trayvon Martin in public forums, my guess is that is actionable fare. Since such remarks are exceptionally hurtful to family members of the lost loved one. Were what he was saying actually true, there would be no issue to raise, but where these hurtful claims are made up lies, society says, and we all agree, there is no right to do that to the grieving family.

    • racerrodig says:

      All of this begs the obvious question……..why didn’t FogenPhoole say that starting the night 2/26/2012 ?? He clearly stated he was punched in the nose with bare hands.

      Game – Set – Match.

      Note to Robbie the Racist…….Give up & stop trying.

      • Here’s a question for Ya’ll……

        Who do you think is gonna visit him in the joint?….momma z?….papa z?……joonur?……..shellie will find another “man”…..a credit I WON’T give fogen….

        BTW..My current odds on him running are 2:1 at present.

        • racerrodig says:

          First ………..”shellie will find another “man”…..a credit I WON’T give fogen….”

          Fogen will GET another man…….pretty sure on that one.

          You have been saying for quite some time he’ll make a run for it and I cannot argue that at all.

        • cielo62 says:

          MMP~ “I’ll take your bet, that  your’re gonna regret. cuz I’m the best that’s ever been!”  $20 bucks my man! NO RUNNING (except off at the mouth). He’ll go eagerly to trial and try to use his “charm” that has gotten him out of so much trouble in the past. His EGO will stop his feet.

          • And he’ll still be free when the jury goes into deliberations….

            YOU’RE ON….2:1 HE RUNS $20.00

            did I mention years ago I used to play the ponies?….Hughes Aircraft….and we had a Bookie in the shop 🙂

          • cielo62 says:

            MMP- Nope, you never mentioned the ponies. But then again, you never mentioned you WON!  LOL! $20 GZ stays in town. Tries to schmooze his way out of this. After all, the NBP STILL has that “reward” out for him right?

          • Worked graveyard shit as a machinist….pick up a racing form on the way to work….have my ponies picked when Jose came in in the morning…….I did win big a few times…..overall I came out at a loss 😦
            It was fun tho 🙂

      • Jun says:

        You keep forgetting to use Robbie The Racist’s words against him

        “Joonyah, you were not there.”

        • racerrodig says:

          My bad…….I stand corrected.

          • Lonnie Starr says:

            @racer: any update on what’s going on at the Conservative Outhouse? What ever happened to the M-DSPD? (LOL) Poor things, they’ve taken some pretty tough blows lately, and JZjr isn’t helping at all. Looks like MOM has grabbed the towel, bunched it up and drawn back his arm. While GZ is still trying to perfect his best “poor me” face. My guess is MOM doesn’t like the looks he’s been getting lately from his peers at the bar. You know there’s something wrong when, every group you move towards breaks up and moves away. Oh well, there’s still time for him to put a new face on his practice.

          • racerrodig says:

            Have not been to the Outhouse in a few weeks, but I did raise a little hell oh HP the other night. There are only 2 Zidiots left there. One is LJP and he’s so messed up (it’s been proven to be RZ sr) and army002 who is s stone dead idiot who just parrots what LJP says. Even the sock puppets we know are Fogen are gone.

            As hard as I tried, I could not get them to respond back at all. It looks like reality may very well have set in. LJP was focused on some insignificant piece of crap so off the wall as if it made a difference.

          • Xena says:

            @racerrodig.

            Even the sock puppets we know are Fogen are gone.

            The cell phone contract that GZ had ShelLIE pay for last year has now expired. He should still have WiFi but maybe was accessing the internet with his cell phone.

          • racerrodig says:

            Anything is possible…maybe he was warned that what he was doing is jury tampering……just sayin’…

          • Lonnie Starr says:

            Well, it looks like they’ve finally had to realize that stupidity isn’t smart, and superiority might not be such a good selling point anymore. That doesn’t mean that they’ll change, but just that they’ll go quiet for a while.

          • racerrodig says:

            Could be that they are just biding their time, but I will say that both old and new members of Team Trayvon kicked the living shit out of them. It was an unmitigated crushing and I was hoping to have a more involved report……they couldn’t even respond !!!!!

            It was like I picked on Mike Tyson on a bad day……well, Mike was having a bad day and I picked on him…..making it a bad day for both of us. Well, he’d be able to claim another early 1st round KO, but you know what I mean. That Bebe Belle, can whoop some Zidiot ass, that’s for sure !!!

    • Jun says:

      How does he come up with this nonsense?

      Fogen clearly claimed he got punched and attacked with bare hands and there is no dna transfer whatsoever on the victims hands, arms, sleeves, cuffs

      a concrete smash on someone’s face would likely kill someone, cave in the face, and also leave blood splatter, and there was no blood splatter

      Lastly where is the proven treatment for such an attack because you do not self heal from a concrete smash

      • One of my sons has a hole in his cheekbone where he was punched by the setting of a ring on a finger of the hand that punched him….

      • Funny you mention it like that….My Uncle Virg looked just like Abe Vigoda…..Virg was a tanker in WWII…..escaped from a burning sherman…still carried the scars….My Dad & my Uncles were my hero’s growing up……..all gone now 😦 hell my Dad would have been 101 last month

    • pat deadder says:

      ladystclair So we know why the demented brother is saying concrete because he knows there is none of fogen’s dna on Trayvon’s hands or anywhere.I’m sure omara is feeding him things to say.jooyna was deposed by BDLR wonder how that went.this shit has got to stop.

      • racerrodig says:

        Every time they have a new version, it should be followed by “…yeah………that’s the ticket….yeah”

      • PiranhaMom says:

        @Pat,

        The Zimmerthugs are claiming that Trayvon was such a SuperBlackSuperHuman that he could not only rip out chunks of the concrete dogwalk to smack panty-waist Fogen across his Pervian schnozz, but that the juvenile was so SuperPowered that he could replace the concrete in the dogwalk after death?

        Dang it, Pat, I knew “white guys can’t jump” but this adds another deficiency to the white race: no record of any white guy ripping out concrete with his bare hands, then replacing it after he died.

        My thanks to Junyah for unearthing this anthropology factoid.
        Stuff we never knew until a Zimmerman told us!

        • racerrodig says:

          As a 57 year old white guy, I’m shocked at this “…revelation…” by Robbie the Racist.

          So as I understand, Black Dynamite Slim, ripped out a piece of the always lethal concrete, smashed Fogen in the nose, and replaced the aforementioned weapon completely intact, with no signs of removal. Hmmmmmmmm sure sounds like a winning defense to me.

          Sure sounds more viable than the “Always Lethal Skittles” attack theory.

          I’ll have to look into that and tell all of my contractor friends / customers to hire black kids. Sure will defray demolition and set up time doing sidewalks & driveways.

          Those silly Zidiots…….what will they come up with next.

          • Xena says:

            @racerrodig.

            So as I understand, Black Dynamite Slim, ripped out a piece of the always lethal concrete, smashed Fogen in the nose, and replaced the aforementioned weapon completely intact, with no signs of removal. Hmmmmmmmm sure sounds like a winning defense to me.

            And, GZ did not point out the piece of concrete he was hit in the nose with, neither the concrete where his head was smashed like a ripe pumpkin, and the cops saw no blood that made them go “hmmmm,” this must be where it happened.

          • racerrodig says:

            We’ve been saying stuff like that since day 1. What blood on the concrete?? what, where….duhhhhhhhhhh.

            I’ll say it again…..remember falling off a bike and those ground beef knuckles, elbows and knees????? I do !! Fogen’s head would have looked like that.

  5. ay2z says:

    Benjamin Crump audio from the AP event.

  6. ay2z says:

    ’43 Days, George’

    • Lonnie Starr says:

      Justice for Trayvon
      Hoodies up!!!
      |||=> Tick Tock! Clink Clank <-|||

      • racerrodig says:

        I’m gonna have to do a lyric rewrite using one of those dirge songs with bells in it….

        In a rolling thunder, pouring rain
        I’m coming on like a hurricane
        My pistol flashing across the sky
        You’re still young but you’re gonna die
        I won’t take no prisoners won’t spare your life
        Nobody was putting up a fight
        I got my bell I’m going straight to hell
        I’m gonna join ya, Satan join ya

        Hells bells
        Hells bells, you got me ringing
        Hells bells, my temperature’s high
        Hells bells

        I don’t like black sensations they curl my spine
        If you’re into evil, you’re a friend of mine
        See the white light flashing as I split the night
        Cos if good’s on the left then I’m sticking to the right
        I won’t take no prisoners won’t spare your life
        Trayvon wasn’t puttin’ up a fight
        I got my bell I’m going straight to hell
        I’m gonna join ya Satan join ya

        Hells bells
        Hells bells, you got me ringing
        Hells bells, my temperature’s high
        Hells bells

        Hells bells, Satan’s coming to me
        Hells bells, he’s ringing them now
        Those hells bells, the temperature’s high
        Hells bells, across the Sanford sky
        Hells bells, they’re taking me down
        Hells bells, they’re dragging me down
        Hells bells, gonna split the night
        Hells bells, there’s no way to fight
        Hells bells

        Kind of like this………….both Evil Incarnate.

        • cielo62 says:

          Racer~ Good choice! Play it in the background as GZs sentence is read out!

          • racerrodig says:

            Back in Jan. & Feb. I did a whole bunch of them on Xena’s site. Even my 14 year old son did one. I have to say. some of them were real good.

            I may actually do this one in a shorter version with his band and post it. The “darkness” is fitting of Fogen.

  7. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    One of George’s patterns or MO’s was to STAY AHEAD of Trayvon. This is why George “lost it calm” and hurriedly exited his car and ran after Trayvon when George said, “He ran.” In other words, George, at that point, no longer had the strategic position of being AHEAD of Trayvon.

    [To see more of my post on this, you may click>
    .

    http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/03/05/17197493-zimmerman-wont-seek-stand-your-ground-hearing-in-april?last=1367153393&threadId=3679334&sp=800&pc=25#c75847209

  8. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    Did you notice how Officer Timothy Smith’s report is all silence when it comes to where George’s vehicle was parked? Does he just forget to mention it? Or does he actually not know? To me it is a glaring omission.

    George described his vehicle to the NEN dispatcher and then said something like, “Actually, could you just have them call me ((for my location)) when they arrive?” So did the dispatcher then NOT relay any info about George’s vehicle on to the arriving officers?

    Or should I look at the situation with a question like this:

    Should I assume that the NEN dispatcher did indeed tell the arriving officers what George said about the location and description of his vehicle?

    Then, I could perhaps say:

    Officer Timothy Smith did not see the truck upon entering Retreat at Twin Lakes. This is why he drove around to RVC when relayed info that Witness 3 had provided as to being behind her house.(Officer Smith could have just parked in front of Witness 3’s building and walked around the side of it.)

    He would have seen the truck on way to where he parked or even parked where he found George’s truck. Why does Officer Smith not mention the location of George’s vehicle in his police report?

    [Also, remember that George OMITS telling the investigators during the reenactment that he told the NEN dispatcher to just have the arriving officers call him.

    George only tells those investigators at the reenactment scene that he told the NEN dispatcher the location and description of his vehicle.]

  9. ay2z says:

    One has to wonder if O’Mara was arm around a black lawyer for the victim’s family and the estate of the victim, is flying in the face of their very racist ‘supporters’, to be politically correct, and to have this ‘arm around black man’ image rub off on client.

    Aside from whatever cordial attitudes the two might have for each other as professionals, was this an O’Mara media op to shift the racist image of the killer/client by association?

  10. ay2z says:

    And http://www.cfnews13.com has a different article that includes Trayvon as a victim (unlike OOM”s remarks that his client may never have been charged without media, and even if so, would have probably gone away with the self-immunity. .

    ‘Sanford memorial dedicated for Trayvon Martin, other families’

    [PHOTO of the memorial]

    By John W. Davis, Reporter
    Last Updated: Saturday, April 27, 2013, 8:27 PM

    SANFORD —
    A new memorial was dedicated Saturday not only for Trayvon Martin, but for 10 other people who were killed in Sanford.

    Families of the victims used the occasion to share their stories and speak out for closure and justice.

    The new Trayvon Martin Memorial was established at the Goldsboro Welcome Center on Historic Goldsboro Boulevard in Sanford.

    It features Trayvon Martin’s name on a headstone and 10 other Sanford area residents who family members say were killed unjustly.

    Kimberly Walker
    Pernecia Jones
    Anthony Mark Pearson
    Andre Williams
    Corey Donaldson
    Danny Lawson
    Brian Robinson
    Dominique Stafford
    Travares McGill
    Keith Jones West

    “We’re of the opinion that people know who were involved in these particular situations and just need to come forward,” said Sanford City Commissioner Velma Williams.

    Corey Donaldson is one of the names memorialized.
    His father, Pastor Alvin Donaldson, said before any family can seek closure and justice, they must forgive.

    “The key to all of this is to have forgiveness. That’s hard for some people to swallow, especially after losing a loved one, somebody that dear to you, like my youngest son,” he said.

    The memorial was paid for and built by volunteers who wanted a proper memorial to remember local families seeking justice.

    Community members say neighbors hold the key to solving these cases by speaking up.

    “Knowing that we can trust our community, police, law enforcement, judges, our community in general. We have to have some trust within that or otherwise, we’re going to have the same community incidents happening over and over again, so that’s what we want to band together for,” said Vince Taylor with the Florida Civil Rights Association.

    Organizers hope the memorial will lead to another step of healing for the Sanford community.

  11. ay2z says:

    http://www.clickorlando has the same basic story, no video. Here’s a quote of MOM blaming the need for trial vs immunity hearing.

    O’Mara said that if it were not for the intense coverage on the shooting, Zimmerman “may never have been charged.” Now since he is, the case “probably would have been addressed as a matter at a self-immunity hearing and it would have gone away that way.”

    • I just read it to verify that indeed O’Mara is a total moron….his name should be O’Moron.

      1. ‘O’Mara said that if it were not for the intense coverage on the shooting, Zimmerman “may never have been charged.”

      You’re right…..he wasn’t charged…Yet people saw the bullshit and called it…..THEN he was charged….

      2. “Now since he is, the case “probably would have been addressed as a matter at a self-immunity hearing and it would have gone away that way.”

      OK so now he’s charged…..”the case “probably would have been addressed as a matter at a self-immunity hearing”
      So O’Moron is saying that now fogens charged would have made it all go away.

      So they’re gonna be in court the 30th to “make it all go away”….
      Yeah know what?…”making it all go away” sounds of hell of all better by having the immunity hearing instead of passing on it and going to trial instead….Am I missing something here?

      It appears that this man, even with an education thinks and looks at things pretty much the same way fogen does….

      Prof………And I’m serious…….do you think MOM might need a little mental health help himself?

      • racerrodig says:

        Moron o’ Mara is so stupid he doesn’t even know what is going to happen on Tuesday…It won’t go away nor is any evidence of Immunity going to be discussed as a defense per se.

        The Honorable Judge Debra Nelson simply wants FatFogenPhoole to acknowledge before the court what he is looking at legally by waiving his right to an Immunity Motion. That’s all folks.

        It could be this short.

        “FuckingFogen….do you understand that by waiving your right to an Immunity Hearing, you are facing trial for Murder in the 2nd degree….”

        “……um……yes”

        Do you understand what the word “Waive” means??

        “……um……yes”

        Do you know it means you forfeit that right forever in regards to this case??

        “……um……yes”

        You do know that you cannot have a trial and an Immunity Hearing at the same time”

        “……um……yes”

        You do know that if you are convicted at trial, you cannot attempt to claim Immunity from Prosecution after that??

        “……um……yes”

        You do realize that this is a very serious charge and if you are convicted you could be facing the rest of your life in prison.

        “…..um……well, Mr. O’ Mara said it’s not my fault and……..um, he’s never lied to me before, so……..um…….”

        I give up……Voir Dire to begin as scheduled……..O’ Mara………in my Chambers………….Bailiff’s…….you and you also……..

        • Xena says:

          Something on the docket, but not posted on http://www.flcourts18.org/page.php?129 ….

          04/24/2013 MOTN
          WAIVER OF ANY PROCEEDING TO INVOKE IMMUNITY (SELF-DEFENSE/STAND YOUR GROUND

          So maybe O’Mara has formally filed the motion to waive immunity proceeding. This would also mean no rolling of an immunity hearing in with trial. GZ can still claim self-defense, but no matter the jury’s decision, his butt is still exposed to civil causes of action.

          • racerrodig says:

            I can smell the burnt toast all the way over here.

            All I can say is “…..ribs, chicken……….or both….and the salads are over on the table on the deck, and cold drinks over in that cooler and in that covered round tub…..my son will show ya” “Oh and my wife said she really likes your blouse”

          • cielo62 says:

            Racer~ I’ll bring a slab of brisket! And a six pack of Stella.

          • racerrodig says:

            No Problem here…..as we say “And a good time was had by all”

          • Xena says:

            @racerrodig. I hope O’Mara has lots of Polygrip on his dentures on Tuesday and during trial, because GZ is likely to punch him in the mouth.

          • racerrodig says:

            I can see that headline now. And nothing would surprise me.

            I wonder what Renee Stutzman will say about that ??

      • groans says:

        @ Xena re:

        Something on the docket, but not posted on http://www.flcourts18.org/page.php?129 ….

        Sorry, but the “WAIVER OF ANY PROCEEDING TO INVOKE IMMUNITY (SELF-DEFENSE/STAND YOUR GROUND” line on the docket is just part of the description of the State’s 4/24 motion. They use multiple lines on the docket website for long descriptions / titles of filings, and you have to read them upside down – i.e., from bottom to top.

        • So this means it’s going to be more than just a yes or no from fogen…….he’ll actually be questioned as to whether or not he understands the consequences of doing this?

          OH this is gonna be good……….When was the last time fogen spoke in court?

          Boy if he doesn’t know his shits weak after this……..

        • Xena says:

          @groans.

          They use multiple lines on the docket website for long descriptions / titles of filings, and you have to read them upside down – i.e., from bottom to top.

          Ahhh. Thanks so much for the correct and that explanation. Here I was thinking we wouldn’t hear oral argument about that when actually, I was looking forward to a fight. 🙂

    • Xena says:

      @ay2z.

      “O’Mara said that if it were not for the intense coverage on the shooting, Zimmerman “may never have been charged.”

      It’s strange when people say truth but there are different perspectives or motivations behind the words.

      Zimmerman may never had been charged had it been 1960’s Florida when Blacks understood that law enforcement was not going to arrest anyone for killing an unarmed Black male teen unless it was another Black person. That is mostly because had Black parents taken actions like Trayvon’s, their houses would have been burned down; they would have lost their jobs; and just maybe, lost their own lives in a traffic accident, ending up in a ditch.

      Trayvon’s parents were right in questioning why there was no arrest. Had GZ given any other story other than Trayvon being violent, maybe there would not have been so many questions.

      Due to the strength and courage of Sybrina and Tracy, the media did provide intense coverage and the public heard GZ’s NEN call. That call speaks volumes and clearly provides that GZ followed Trayvon after Trayvon ran.

      Now since he is, the case “probably would have been addressed as a matter at a self-immunity hearing and it would have gone away that way.”

      And so, let us remember that after the first bond hearing, in answering a question from a reporter, O’Mara responded that he had to examine discovery to see if there would be a SYG hearing. Evidently he did and determined that GZ does not qualify for immunity. O’Mara is not pulling the wool over anyone’s eyes, unless it is those of GZ.

      • two sides to a story says:

        And some Fogen supporters really detest him for his honesty.

        Peculiar event and photo of OM and Crump. But then I always did say that at the end of the day and outside the courtroom, all these lawyerly types are cordial to one another.

        • Xena says:

          @Two sides. I haven’t seen the photo but don’t doubt it. One of the most difficult things that lawyers wrestle with is not taking things personally. The same is true for many pro se litigants. At the end of the day, they can’t take the shit that other lawyers do home with them. Attorney Crump’s job is representing Trayvon’s parents and their best interests. He doesn’t have to be friends with O’Mara, neither his enemy. Being cordial, allowing another to put their hand on your shoulder, is simply being a gentleman.

          In the courtroom, it’s plaintiff, defendant, legal counsel and the judge. The only person legal counsel wants to mop the floor with is the defendant.

        • Xena says:

          @ay2z. They are wearing Associated Press badges. Not sure of the event. Neither of them are looking at the camera so it’s not a staged photo. Personally, I don’t place much into it.

          • PiranhaMom says:

            @Xena,

            O’Mara is trying to rejuvenate his image with this cordial grip ‘n grin photo op with Crump.

            He’s soon going to be out of a job — if he’s lucky — so he can start raising some real $$$. Most “reasonable” folks he could acquire as clients are repulsed by his client Zimmerman, but are not aware – as we are – of the depths of racism that O’Mara has mired himself in, just for the bucks.

            So when he’s available again for PAYING clients, they’ll see only a guy who took on a loser client, did his best for him, and hardly made a nickel. They won’t know “the slimer” like we know “the slimer.”

            I bet he puts that photo of Crump and himself on his office wall. (Pass the barf bag, please.)

            And a fairly sophisticated client knows attorneys try to be “Gentlemen of the Court.” As the photo shows.

            Well, it won’t be long now before Zimmerman heads from “slimer” to “slammer” …

          • Xena says:

            @PiranhaMom.

            …O’Mara has mired himself in, just for the bucks.

            It should be pretty obvious to O’Mara that GZ’s financial base of supporters is not increasing, neither are they donating enough for GZ’s living expenses and legal defense. If O’Mara thought that birds could donate money, he’d take photos with birds.

          • Guys that live in the mountains don’t let scumbag lawyers put their arms around them…

            Ben Stein is OK tho
            rush limblah a NO NO

          • PiranhaMom says:

            @MountainMan.

            Pat, even Rush Limbaugh with his arm around a telephone pole is … eeeee-yew. And ick!

          • racerrodig says:

            On Friday one of my sources told me Fogen is 30K in the hole now.

          • Xena says:

            @racerrodig.

            On Friday one of my sources told me Fogen is 30K in the hole now.

            Those are unpaid debts. Who could he possibly owe and for what? Rent? Transcribers for depositions? Maybe a few experts who took a look at evidence and found it was not to his benefit?

            Overall, it serves to prove that GZ is not mature and does not live in reality. Last year when donations no longer paid his living expenses, (because that is all he was paying then), he should have made some changes to live within his means. Instead, he racked up $28,000 to AIS hoping to increase his support base and donations.

            And, the more Junior talks, the more donations decrease.

          • racerrodig says:

            Mostly living expenses……..as if that’s actually “…living…” Remember Fogen said to the effect SheLie can’t breed life young, nor cook. Take out gets pricey.

        • racerrodig says:

          Is that a real picture ? Ben Crumps head looks photo shopped for some reason and where was it taken.

      • ay2z says:

        Xena, another one, cfnews13 has a new article up, haven’t read it yet but linking the photo they have of Ben and Mark at the AP afternoon.

        • Xena says:

          @ay2z. In that photo, as opposed to the other photo, O’Mara is wearing a different tie, and Crump is wearing a different suit. O’Mara’s AP name tag can be seen. These were apparently some type of events. Since both are attorneys in the Florida Bar, it might have been a Bar event.

      • FactsFirst says:

        IMHO, had it not been for TRACY MARTIN and SYBRINA FULTON not excepting the SPD’s BULLSHIT and contacting Crump, the NAACP, and whomever else would listen, fogen WOULD HAVE gotten away WITH MURDER… THE REAL HERO’S here are THE PARENTS of the VICTIM.. NOT the MEDIA… The media, unlike O’HaHa were just doing their jobs…

        • Ain’t it a bitch?………It’s only because people spoke up to an injustice that was done…..that fogen was even charged

          IMHO MOM just needs a good bitch slappin’

          What a fukken O’Moron………

          • cielo62 says:

            MMP~ (in my best drag queen voice) “OOOH, I’ll scratch his eyes out!”

          • Cielo….when I lived in Manitou Springs my neighbor…Big Gay Al…..had a sign over his drive way….”Queen parking only…You are not worthy” He also had a 6×9 rainbow flag…….while my gay neighbors…(been together 27 years) across the street had the rainbow flag….patio table cover….and a similar sign to Al’s….

            ME?…..I had my rebel flag flyin….the stars and stripes above it…..and a sign at the bottom of the steps….”X rated film star parking only”

            Always out in the street in the evenin’ bustin’ each others balls……they all loved Biscuts cookin’ too….

            Ya know what I don’t like….call me prejudiced…

            I don’t like assholes…..and it piss’s me off when someone uses their race, gender preference of whatever as the reason I don’t like them….when in fact the only reason I don’t like them is they’re assholes.

          • racerrodig says:

            “I don’t like assholes….”

            Now ya did it.

            The silicon chip inside his head
            gets switched to overload
            and nobody’s gonna go to school today
            he’s gonna make them stay at home
            And Daddy doesn’t understand it
            He always said he was good as gold
            And he can see no reason
            Cos there are no reasons
            What reasons do you need to be shown

            Tell me why
            I don’t like assholes
            I want to shoot
            The whole day down

            The telex machine is kept so clean
            and it types to waiting world.
            And Mother feels so shocked
            Father’s world is rocked
            And their thoughts turn to
            Their own little Fogen boy
            Sweet 16 ain’t that peachy keen
            No it ain’t so neat to admit defeat,
            They can see no reasons
            Cos there are no reasons
            What reasons do you need

            Tell me why
            I don’t like assholes
            I want to shoot
            The whole day down

            Tell me why
            I don’t like assholes
            I want to shoot
            The whole day down

            All the playing’s stopped in the playground now
            He wants to play with her guns awhile
            And school’s out early and soon we’ll be learning
            That the lesson today is how to die
            And then the bullhorn crackles
            And the captain tackles
            With the problems and the how’s and why’s
            And he can see no reasons
            Cos there are no reasons
            What reasons do you need to die

            Tell me why
            I don’t like assholes
            I want to shoot
            The whole day down

            Tell me why
            I don’t like assholes
            I want to shoot
            The whole day down

          • U don’t like Ska…but you like the Rats….Hell yeah Gurl 🙂

          • cielo62 says:

            MMP~ LOL! I can SEE that! I really believe one the ways to get along with people different from you, is to NOT take yourself too seriously.  A little respect and tolerance and you can have a civil world. I need to get one I saw in a catalog: Witch Parking Only. All others will be Toad.”

          • Cielo……..”don’t take life too seriously”?….that’s the line from a Robert Service poem..”Laughter”….one of my favorites….I’ll post it on Xena’s chat wall..BTW…Desiderata has hung by my front door for more than 30 years…

            The rocks are in your box and were mailed yesterday…….

            Now let the rest try to figger that out !!!!!! 🙂

          • cielo62 says:

            MMP~ Ah, the Desiderata! Y’know, you’re pretty spiritual for an atheist! 😉

          • Because I refuse to be confined by only one belief

            I mean people rip on Islam….yet think of what they can do with the bible?…..god enjoys babies heads being dashed into rocks and such?

            The 72 virgins thing?……to me that would be hell……72 broads on the rag at the same time? RUN FOREST RUN

          • Our doormat says

            DO YOU HAVE A WARRANT?

        • Xena says:

          @FactsFirst.

          THE REAL HERO’S here are THE PARENTS of the VICTIM.. NOT the MEDIA…

          Amen!!

          • PiranhaMom says:

            @Xena
            @Facts First –

            Let us also include in our Heroes, the young Howard University grad, Kevin Cunningham, who circulated the petition for Justice for Trayvon, receiving 2million signatures.

            Per US News and World Report, “Cunningham,, a red-head who describes himself as the “super Irish” son of activist parents, said he learned about the Martin case when he read a story posted on a listserv for Men of Howard, an informal, secretive fraternity that he joined while attending the historically black Howard University as a law student.”

            You don’t have the be Black to support Justice for Trayvon, and only a minority of the white population are vicious, racist rednecks.

            Let us add Frederick Leatherman to the Hero List, too, along with Trayvon’s family and their attorneys. In fact, the young Mayor of Sanford forced the release of the 911 tape, which galvanized the country. I am indebted to him for this stand.

          • racerrodig says:

            You know where I stand….

          • Ya know this is one of the few times in my life where I’ve had an opinion on something so strong that there is NO question at all in my mind I’m right…

            HOODIES UP

            JUSTICE FOR TRAYVON

            I did vote for Carter the second time 😦

          • Xena says:

            @PiranhaMom.

            Let us also include in our Heroes, the young Howard University grad, Kevin Cunningham, who circulated the petition for Justice for Trayvon, receiving 2million signatures.

            A little behind, are you? 🙂

            Posted by BlushedBrown on 2/24/13.
            http://blackbutterfly7.wordpress.com/2013/02/24/let-us-not-forget-kevin-cunningham-the-creator-of-the-petition/

          • PiranhaMom says:

            @Xena,

            Not behind, but just want those who worked for Justice for Trayvon to continue to be recognized as among the many heroes.

          • Xena says:

            @PiranhaMom.

            On Blackbutterfly7 is a category titled “Heroes.” It includes Kevin Cunningham, LLMPapa, and Whonoze and the team that produced that fantastic video analyzing the clubhouse videos. There are more people on the list, and BlushedBrown was helping in writing the articles, but then she went to work full-time.

            So, if you want, feel free to write about the heroes and I’ll be happy to post it.

          • PiranhaMom says:

            @Xena,

            Just wanted to add to today’s post re heroes that all races would be on that list, some who made very unique contributions. We know many, we don’t know others, we want to include them all.

      • FactsFirst says:

        What really pisses me off about O’Moron is the fact that ITS EVERYBODY ELSE FAULT but fogens… Now, it’s the MEDIA’S fault!!! The same MEDIA he’s PIMPIN to try get his MURDERING CLIENT off…. This kat is has NO SHAME! SMDH..

        SN: I can’t wait to see the Professor’s choice words today…

        • And without pimpin’ the media where would all of fogens donations come from?….O’Moron has studied Orwell in his use of doublespeak.

          To paraphrase Orwell…..O’Moron & fogen are Double plus BAD

        • racerrodig says:

          True all of that but the beauty of it is it is “…obvious to the most casual observer…” that the more Moron O’ Mara talks, the more he’s actually saying he knows they are burnt toast.

          He knows it and I’m sure PhatoldFogenPhoole is crying desperately for O’ Mara to do something, say something that makes Phoole feel better and makes it look like he’s the victim.

          His biggest line was that “..if he wasn’t arrested early….gee, he mustn’t have committed a crime.” Like that actually makes sense. if it was true, there would be no Statute of Limitation then.

      • racerrodig says:

        “O’Mara is not pulling the wool over anyone’s eyes, unless it is those of GZ.”

        Nope…..he surely isn’t. You can tell by his rhetoric now he knows the end is near. He needs to fear Fogens attack more than anything.

        What are the odds he’s already preparing a civil defamation suit against a select group of Zidiots and Robbie the Racist for what he’ll say in about………….oh, say 43 + 20, or thereabouts ??

    • pat deadder says:

      I’m really confused by omara’s statement so he’s saying if the parents,petitioners ,and marchers had just shut up fogen could have gotten away with this.What is wrong with him.To two sides I too never thought of killing or even hitting back but like fogen violent people know who to victimize.I’m happy now and alive Trayvon is not. fogen was never hit in the first place.If fogen didn’t have a gun is he trying to say a tall skinny kid could have beat him up.What a crock of shit.I’m really confused.No wonder there are more minorities in jail.What they have to do to get justice is appalling.

      • Malisha says:

        Exactly, PD, if protesters and decent Americans had “just shut up,” Fogen would have gotten away with murder. That is what bothers his camp so much. They resent the fact that people they disdain and despise have bonded together and sought, and obtained, real power in our society. They can’t get over the fact that power has not rested solely with their “chosen” — that somebody else has chosen, this time.

    • Lonnie Starr says:

      Trouble is the case had a better chance of going away early on, before much evidence had been collected. The reason the immunity hearing was not held back then was, because there were no charges filed. By the time the public got involved, more than enough evidence, that had been uncovered before, became public knowledge and so charges were filed by people the Gov. had to appoint to replace those who refused to do their jobs.

      Now GZ is whining because the public believes the evidence shows him to be guilty of a heinous crime. He now thinks he should go free, because the police didn’t charge him right away. Didn’t he learn anything at that law school? Oh, yeah, right, it’s MOM putting on this “defense”, and he knows he’s got to so something more than just stand there like a potted palm.

  12. ay2z says:

    OS has photo of Ben Crump with M’OM, MOM”s hand around Ben’s shoulder, all pals.

    No video, just a text article so far.

  13. racerrodig says:

    Yep, nothing but easy living for Fogen & SheLie with that “…good life…” thing.

    • pat deadder says:

      What I’m about to write I have never spoken about or mentioned in anyway to anyone but it is the reason I think Shelley is as bad as fogen and his injuries were not life threatening.Of course this is not the only reason.I was married to a man for 25 years who drank on weekends I have had my head banged against a wall at least 10 times,received 6 stitches in my forehead,had black eyes on many occasions never once did I feel I was going to die.So I look at fogen with disgust to think he thinks people will believe his bullshit.The day I left my husband was the day after he kicked the dog.I know that sounds a little crazy.So shelley staying with that degenerate after he murdered a child is just nearly as big a POS as him.imho.My X died at 59 from drinking.He died in his 18 wheeler.Everyone loved him he was a smooth talker.nieghbours remained my friends because they knew him.I became an asshole for a year after I left.Once I got over my pity party I became a responsible citizen again.My Mother said to me during my asshole stage That success is the best revenge.I have an amazing son and daughter in law 2 grandchildren. My son is able to joke about some of the things his father did like pee on him one night.I owe a lot to people and try in everyway I can to help .I still work although I’m shall we say older.So the long and the short of it is fogen needs to fess up and face the music.You are all amazing.Thank you for your patience.

      • acemayo says:

        no one should never had thier head banged against head wall
        but after the banged where you able to think 10 seconds or more
        after it, because GZ was able to think clearly while he is punch
        in the face, a broken nose(which I don’t believe), trying to breath
        because TM had his hands over his mouth and nose, GZ had blood in his eyes, can’t see, but some how he felt TM looking at his gun. Throught all that pain he was able to sense what TM had on his mind move his hand(GZ) take aim and shoot

      • two sides to a story says:

        I’ve also had similar experiences and not once considered killing my abuser.

        American self-defense law is WAY out of control. People should not be able to apply any more force than is applied to them and should be absolutely certain that death is imminent before killing anyone.

        Fogen is full of it.

      • racerrodig says:

        Girl, I am so sorry to hear about any abuse. I have a brother just like your ex….a smooth talking asswipe he is. I have no doubt that the jury will not buy his story in any way, shape or form. I have posted before that when I played football and would take a hit to the head the concussion from that WITH a helmet gave me, and millions of football players, more head pain than Fogen showed.

        Again I say that all of us who ever fell off a bike as a kid with short pants on had knees and elbows that looked like ground beef……where is that look of FatassFogenPhoole??

        He’s burnt toast. Despicable and I loathe him and what he represents. There is the possibility SheLie has flipped and even though she is just as bad, if she does the right thing, I’ll give her credit for that……when….

      • cielo62 says:

        Pat Deadder~ KUDOS TO YOU! Leaving an abusive relationship is harder than people could ever know, UNLESS they’ve had to do it, too. I think seeing a being who is unable to defend itself get hurt by that scum is what broke the camels back. You refused to see yourself as a victim, but you KNEW the dog was! Stories like yours are what should be published more often, so that anyone in similar sitautions can see that  it CAN be done. There CAN be life, love and sweetness afterwards. BRAVO!

  14. ay2z says:

    On so many levels, Trayvon would not have met his death that night 14 months ago last night, had someone taken advise to just ‘listen’.

    • ay2z says:

      You may have to click through to Youtube and do ‘skip ad’, but worth it.

    • racerrodig says:

      You got that right as simple as it is. Some people don’t listen and get a bug bite, fail a test, miss a bus, have a bad date. Some end up with a verbal fight with a friend or co – worker.

      Fogen doesn’t listen, commits a murder and then talks his ass off making things worse for him, therefore helping ensure justice.

      Gee……..it sucks to be Fogen.

      • fogens life sucking is something he’ll need to get used to…

        Get my drift Vern?

      • ay2z says:

        Simple message, beautifully sung by a young man who, even with his attack of stage-fright, got right back in there, and showed he was a very brave person.

        Hundred fold more brave than fogen could ever muster, even with his chemical assistants and guns.

      • ay2z says:

        And the weak, manipulative, angry killer will try to sell his personality wares if he’s incarcerated, and control his world, but he will fail as surely as the fresh fish at Shawshank.

    • ladystclaire says:

      This little boy can sing his @$$ off and, this voice is GOD given talent that comes around just once in a lifetime. he’s going to go very far in life.

  15. Soulcatcher says:

    Can someone please tell me how to post something from ytube……thanx

    • Just copy and paste the link in the address bar above the video you want to post using cont C to copy & con V to paste

    • Xena says:

      @Soulcatcher. Under the video you will see “share” and click there. A code will come up highlighted. Do a Ctrl C to copy it. Then go where you want to embed it and do a Ctrl V to paste. After the coding, if you enter &rel=0, it will prevent the thumbnails of other videos showing after the video has played.

      Sorry if this isn’t clear. It’s way past my bedtime now. 🙂

  16. RIP George….Hope you find an Angel with tight fittin’ jeans

  17. acemayo says:

    before GZ shot TM his owns words
    TM had boths hands over my mouth(GZ)
    TM took one hand sliding across my chest then down my side to get my gun
    At the police station on video time mark 2/27/2012 6:51: 31 PM
    That means TM had only one hand free
    GZ did not say that TM bang his head one more time before he shot him
    On the video
    But later on he added that TM bangs his head one more time than he shot him
    After he had TM arm locked up
    GZ could only get the the hand part of TM because GZ was on the ground and TM couldn’t move his hand pass GZ arm pit.
    Put your arm between someone arm pit and see how close you are
    The only way GZ can get TM arm locked up if they was not on the ground
    GZ statement was that he was on the ground when shot TM on his back
    also
    When GZ went for his gun his hold on TM hand would had losen TM could pull his hand free
    IF aim his gun TM would hand free his hand
    I had 10 friend pin my hand between thier body and forearm even with them moving I got
    my hand free.
    Also with my 10 friends I try to move thier head up and down with one hand I could not do it.
    One thing about this fight being one sided as GZ put it
    GZ had full movement of both arms and hands
    At any time he could had stop or try to stop TM

    • Mandelbaum says:

      I’d love to see and hear GZ demonstrate how OCTOvon managed to do all that, with ONLY two hands. Trayvon was so capable of complete domination of GZ, but not at all able to prevent (a DYING man, only seconds and one more head bang away from needing to be spoon fed by his brother) him form blasting his heart and life away. YEAH RIGHT!

      • Yeah….If you believe fogens BS he sounds like he was attacked by an 8 armed Indian Elephant god……

        Serious….I wonder what Trayvons football coach would have to say about him…..better on the offense?….or defense?

        HOODIES UP

      • Mandelbaum says:

        I hear ya Mnt. Man.

        Too bad the poor kid didn’t do as DD instructed him to do. Go long. 😦

      • racerrodig says:

        I coined the term “The Octopus Defense” last May and I’d like to see an explanation as well.

        • Having extra appendages is about the only thing the zimbots haven’t tried to beat down Trayvon with.

          Of course the ME’s report would have contained this info as to the number of Trayvons EXTRA arms if it were noticed.

          Of course the zimbots still to this day try and say Trayvon was 6 ft. 180 lbs……entirely contradictory to the ME’s report

          HOODIES UP

          • racerrodig says:

            I’m sure some Zidiot diehard will come up with the fact that Black Dynamite Slim had 6 retractable apendages…..It’s coming.

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          So far all I see is the “Colin Ferguson” defense all over again. Of course he tried to defend himself and he did not have an internet beg-a-thon going on. But it was essentially the same thing, run out the clock with silly motions that continued to fail, then trial.

          At trial Colin Ferguson tried an outrageous defense, where he claimed that someone else did the shooting, then handed him the gun and left the train and escaped. Of course, witnesses and victims alike had watched him do the shooting and cctv’s on the platforms showed that no one left the train before the police arrested him. So he was toast, he’s now sitting in an 8 x 12 cell where he will remain for the rest of his life.

          GZ’s case is even more disgusting than Colin Ferguson’s case was. Because GZ had a real chance to escape justice early on. Only his bad karma, toxic nature and stupidity ruined his chance to escape.

      • Malisha says:

        I don’t know why people have a hard time calculating how many hands Trayvon had. He could have had four, six, eight, even nine (although odd numbers are disapproved) because the Trayvon who beat up Fogen was a figment of Fogen’s retroactive imagination. Figments can have dozens of arms and legs and whatnot — check out Hindu mythology, the monsters of old yore, whatever. Trayvon entered the realm of “myth” as soon as Fogen’s fevered imagination glommed onto his innocent image walking along in the rain. Only problem is Fogen killed the REAL TRAYVON, not the “video game monster” of his sick dreams.

        • racerrodig says:

          The only thing FogenPhoole could have done worse than what he did, would to have profiled a kid with a birth defect or had an accident in which he only had one arm.

          As sad as that is, FogenPhoole still would play this game.

          Imagine that story……”…..he had his hand over my mouth and with his other hand, er, the elbow, he was covering my nose…..um, then he used his toes and ran them down my chest and he saw, or I felt he saw THE gun……..I knew I was running out of time……”

          Maybe he could have picked on a one armed blind kid…..

          • “Maybe he could have picked on a one armed blind kid…..”

            You forgot to add……In a wheelchair…….

            You do know that wheelchairs can be used as weapons……..moreso than Skittles & Ice Tea

          • racerrodig says:

            Good point. I’d say this is about how fair the events of that night were.

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          Now that you mention it, an amazing thought just occurred to me, is it possible? Could Stutzman and Pipitone be white supremacist sympathizers??? I know, it’s a horrible thought but… is it possible?

      • Malisha says:

        MMP: Slinky People! HA HA HA HA HAHAHA!! Ouch Ouch, I can’t breathe, STOP! 😆 😆

  18. ay2z says:

    Another SYG immunity bites the dust.

    The shootings happened after an argument in which one of Mobley’s friends was punched. Mobley testified he thought one man had a weapon and that he was frightened.

  19. Nef05 says:

    Some levity for a Friday night. A friend posted this on my FB page.

    HOW DO COURT RECORDERS KEEP STRAIGHT FACES????
    These are from a book called Disorder in the American Courts and are things people actually said in court, word for word, taken down and published by court reporters that had the torment of staying calm while the exchanges were taking place.

    ATTORNEY: What was the first thing your husband said to you that morning?
    WITNESS: He said, ‘Where am I, Cathy?’
    ATTORNEY: And why did that upset you?
    WITNESS: My name is Susan!
    _______________________________
    ATTORNEY: What gear were you in at the moment of the impact?
    WITNESS: Gucci sweats and Reeboks.
    ____________________________________________
    ATTORNEY: Are you sexually active?
    WITNESS: No, I just lie there.
    ____________________________________________
    ATTORNEY: What is your date of birth?
    WITNESS: July 18th.
    ATTORNEY: What year?
    WITNESS: Every year.
    _____________________________________
    ATTORNEY: How old is your son, the one living with you?
    WITNESS: Thirty-eight or thirty-five, I can’t remember which.
    ATTORNEY: How long has he lived with you?
    WITNESS: Forty-five years.
    _________________________________
    ATTORNEY: This myasthenia gravis, does it affect your memory at all?
    WITNESS: Yes.
    ATTORNEY: And in what ways does it affect your memory?
    WITNESS: I forget..
    ATTORNEY: You forget? Can you give us an example of something you forgot?
    ___________________________________________
    ATTORNEY: Now doctor, isn’t it true that when a person dies in his sleep, he doesn’t know about it until the next morning?
    WITNESS: Did you actually pass the bar exam?
    ____________________________________

    ATTORNEY: The youngest son, the 20-year-old, how old is he?
    WITNESS: He’s 20, much like your IQ.
    ___________________________________________
    ATTORNEY: Were you present when your picture was taken?
    WITNESS: Are you shitting me?
    _________________________________________
    ATTORNEY: So the date of conception (of the baby) was August 8th?
    WITNESS: Yes.
    ATTORNEY: And what were you doing at that time?
    WITNESS: Getting laid
    ____________________________________________

    (This one is my personal fave)
    ATTORNEY: She had three children , right?
    WITNESS: Yes.
    ATTORNEY: How many were boys?
    WITNESS: None.
    ATTORNEY: Were there any girls?
    WITNESS: Your Honor, I think I need a different attorney. Can I get a new attorney?
    ____________________________________________
    ATTORNEY: How was your first marriage terminated?
    WITNESS: By death..
    ATTORNEY: And by whose death was it terminated?
    WITNESS: Take a guess.
    ___________________________________________

    ATTORNEY: Can you describe the individual?
    WITNESS: He was about medium height and had a beard
    ATTORNEY: Was this a male or a female?
    WITNESS: Unless the Circus was in town I’m going with male.
    _____________________________________
    ATTORNEY: Is your appearance here this morning pursuant to a deposition notice which I sent to your attorney?
    WITNESS: No, this is how I dress when I go to work.
    ______________________________________
    ATTORNEY: Doctor , how many of your autopsies have you performed on dead people?
    WITNESS: All of them. The live ones put up too much of a fight.
    _________________________________________
    ATTORNEY: ALL your responses MUST be oral, OK? What school did you go to?
    WITNESS: Oral…
    _________________________________________
    ATTORNEY: Do you recall the time that you examined the body?
    WITNESS: The autopsy started around 8:30 PM
    ATTORNEY: And Mr. Denton was dead at the time?
    WITNESS: If not, he was by the time I finished.
    ____________________________________________
    ATTORNEY: Are you qualified to give a urine sample?
    WITNESS: Are you qualified to ask that question?

    ______________________________________
    And last:

    ATTORNEY: Doctor, before you performed the autopsy, did you check for a pulse?
    WITNESS: No.
    ATTORNEY: Did you check for blood pressure?
    WITNESS: No.
    ATTORNEY: Did you check for breathing?
    WITNESS: No..
    ATTORNEY: So, then it is possible that the patient was alive when you began the autopsy?
    WITNESS: No.
    ATTORNEY: How can you be so sure, Doctor?
    WITNESS: Because his brain was sitting on my desk in a jar.
    ATTORNEY: I see, but could the patient have still been alive, nevertheless?
    WITNESS: Yes, it is possible that he could have been alive and practicing law.

    • racerrodig says:

      Feeeenomanallll !! I have had several myself whereas I owned the opposing counsel.

      One was with opposing counsel with the initials MM I swear.

      MM, ……so racer, you previously stated that a Nitrous system will not operate at a temperature below 40 degrees, correct ??

      racer….no, you stated that yesterday and I called you a liar then as well………(MM sitting on Jury hand rail, bare foot, swinging legs gayly)

      Judge Baldwin……..Mr. Molz, this is my furniture you’re sitting on, not yours…….OFF !! Molz falls to floor

      Set up…..All carburetors I sell have a stamped serial # so I can record all tuning parameters.

      MM, so……racer, this is a duplicate of the carburetor you built for my client correct.

      racer……Yes it is, I used his Invoice and build sheet to duplicate it. The one you claim I did has no such number so It’s obvious I didn’t build that one.

      MM (………………long pause followed by that I got ya look) where is the serial number on the sample carb,…..it has no such number, so you’re lying about that !!

      racer……..Uh, hey genius, I said when I sell one I record the number, this one hasn’t been sold yet………..(stone silence)

      racer..Uh, next question Mr. Molz, I can take it you can.

      MM drops racerrodig carburetor exhibit on barefoot.

      These are from the transcript.

      This trial should be published and enacted by The 3 Stooges…..
      Especially the part where MM finally realized his client and witness are 5 days in conflict on 3 major events. What a bunch of clowns.

      The one witness, the tow truck driver / owner was allowed to spend much time talking about the beautiful spring weather that day…..the clouds were especially puffy, and the birds singing so well, and the sunshine was great…..20 minutes of that.

      Then racer hands the lawyer a certified weather record in which 5 inches of rain fell that day……..

      Mr. tow truck driver, can you explain how we had all this rain and 35 degrees different temp that day ??

      Typo ?? was the answer.

      Oh yeah……how hard it is to keep a straight face.

      • Nef05 says:

        Oh, Racer – that did NOT happen to you. You have got to be kidding. I’m cracking up over here. There is no way possible I could have held a straight face. The judge would have to order the baliff to pick me up off of the floor!

        • racerrodig says:

          Everyday the opposing counsel would do or say something so bizarre we’d die laughing. On the 3rd day of trial, he called a sidebar and they went into the Judges chambers one of the jurors started laughing…..I asked what gives and he stated he won the pool for the day on how many sidebars the defense lawyer would call by lunch and he won the pool.

    • fauxmccoy says:

      @nef

      thanks for the lulz … the husband and i just laughed ourselves silly 🙂

    • ATTORNEY: What is your date of birth?
      WITNESS: July 18th.
      ATTORNEY: What year?
      WITNESS: Every year.

      I can’t stop laughing. Hilarious!

    • Tzar says:

      ATTORNEY: ALL your responses MUST be oral, OK? What school did you go to?
      WITNESS: Oral…

      I just about lost my sh*t with this one

    • cielo62 says:

      Nef05~ ROTFLMAO!! Those were HYSTERICAL! Professional or not, I don’t think I could have kept a straight face! All those zingers at the attornies were AWESOME! I wonder if any of them were MOM??

      • I remember one where a witness to a robbery was on the stand……in the questioning they asked her if she would recognize the person involved in the robbery….she replied “yes” and was then asked if she saw that person in the courtroom…..THE DEFENDANT STOOD UP…..BEFORE SHE EVEN SAID A WORD

        They need special prisons for window lickers….just sayin’

  20. racerrodig says:

    Maybe this will help…..

    Aaahh Freak out!
    Le Freak, C’est Chic
    Freak out!
    Aaahh Freak out!
    Le Freak, C’est Chic
    Freak out!
    Aaahh Freak out!
    Le Freak, C’est Chic
    Freak out!
    Aaahh Freak out!
    Le Freak, C’est Chic
    Freak out!

    Have you heard about the new dance craze?
    Listen to us, I’m sure you’ll be amazed
    Big fun to be had by everyone
    It’s up to you, It surely can be done
    Young and old are doing it, I’m told
    Just one try, and you too will be sold
    It’s called Le Freak! They’re doing it night and day
    Allow us, we’ll show you the way

    (Chorus)

    All that lying, has it got you down
    Has your head spinning all around
    Feel the justice, check out Bernie
    Come on along and have a real good time
    Like the days of stopping at the Savoy
    Now we freak, oh what a joy
    Just come on down, two fifty four
    Find a spot out on the floor

    (Chorus)

    Now Freak!

    I said Freak!

    Now Freak!

    All that lying, has it got you down
    Has your head spinning all around
    Feel the justice, check out Corey
    Come on along and have a real good time
    Like the days of stopping at the Savoy
    Now we freak, oh what a joy
    Just come on down, two fifty four
    Find a spot out on the floor

    (Chorus)

  21. pat deadder says:

    Rachael Just want you to know Fox Channel is not allowed in my Country neither was ann coulter or whatever her name is allowed to come and speak at a Unniversity here There has to be a limit to free speech when it becomes hate speech.There is something mentally unbalanced about these people.The law has to worry less about marajana and more about these vile people.

    • Rachael says:

      Thanks. I keep saying that free speech is NOT hate speech, but it seems to fall on deaf ears.

      • ladystclaire says:

        @Rachael, I agree with you in that free speech is NOT hate speech. yet we see a lot of media blog sites who are allowing hate speech on their sites and, it’s just not right. we need to find out who the different companies are, who advertise on their sites and, let them know that, they will be boycotted if they continue to do business with them because, they are allowing hate speech on their sites.

        This just might be what is needed, to put an end to all of this racial hatred directed towards Trayvon and his family. I don’t mind making phone calls because, I’ve already made calls to some of the networks about this very subject and, I’m making two more on Monday. this needs to stop!

    • Plantain Republic says:

      Strange as how Bush and Cheney were welcomed into Canada and both pocketed hefty sums for their pearls of wizdom. Not only that, FOX News gets major viewership in Canada. Everyone says they hate it, but everyone tunes in anyway. Go figure.

      • pat deadder says:

        Plantain Republic Wow I did not know that.I remember they tried to get a license here and couldn’t.I only remember Bush coming once and there were many protesters.I know there was tension when Canada refused to go to Iraq.None the less anyone here is welcome in my home any time and we can only pray TM’s family sees this monster who murdered their son put away for life.Oh and if Fox gets lots of viewers in Canada that would be a channel they pay extra for which makes it that much worse.

  22. colin black says:

    One of Travis Alexanders Sisters petitioning for a law to prevent defamation of the victims.
    By so called experts dureing trial with no corroberation.

    Seems to me a simlar type legislation is required to stop simmilar disspariging remarks.
    Accusations ect made about victims of crimes in the media ect.
    By those pro defence without any evidence to back up there allegations that the victim was of bad charecter
    TRANSLATION

    Deserved to die .

    I think you all know what case Im talking about.

    Here is a Link to The Travis Law petition pls sign an re post if you agree.
    Only 3 thousand more needed

    http://www.change.org/petitions/create-travis-alexander-s-law-stop-allowing-highly-prejudicial-claims-against-murder-victims-without-evidence

    • ladystclaire says:

      @Colin, my reply is in the wrong place but, I signed the petition because, this shit has got to stop! no family of a murder victim should have to go through this.

    • racerrodig says:

      Thanks for the link…signed and delivered…..

      • fauxmccoy says:

        @racer — this is peculiar, the song you posted earlier was going through my mind earlier as well, but with different lyrics

        for everything (churn, churn, churn)
        that GZ says (churn, churn, churn)
        makes my stomach (churn, churn, churn)

        • racerrodig says:

          That’s pretty good !! Lets partner up on one. You pick one and we’ll both contribute lines.

          We’ll show Simon and Garfunkel a thing or 3.

        • cielo62 says:

          Fauxy~ LOL! “As the Stomach Turns” another episode starring GZ with co-stars MOM, West and the Z-Familee. Oscar Award winning script provided by The Outhouse Team of schemers, dreamers and bullshitt-beamers. Don’t miss a single episode! Catch the critical reviews from Bernie, the Bullshit Blaster!   (with credit to Carol Burnett for the original “As the Stomach Turns”)

    • ladystclaire says:

      @Patricia, I was only too glad to sign it because, I sign all petitions that are for the good of those who are no longer here to speak for themselves and, also those petitions that are for the good of all of mankind in different situations.

      I would like to think that if I were in the same situation as the family of the Arias victim and the family of Trayvon, that people would think enough of me and my family and do the same thing. we need to stand together in the face of evil, instead of judging a murder victim and his family by the color of their skin. Trayvon was killed out of the pure evil that is George Zimmerman and, this is the kind of evil that needs to be eradicated by us all instead of some people branching off in a group of their own, to sing the praises of someone who has taken the young life of this child because, in their minds, this African American child’s life had no meaning because of his race.

      Is this what the greatest country in the world is all about? we are all human beings and, the BIBLE tells us that GOD made man in his image and, that goes for every human being known to man kind. I’m seeking justice for Trayvon, just like I did for Caylee Anthony. I only wish that Caylee’s justice didn’t come. what that jury did in her case, was a sin and a shame before GOD ALMIGHTY. Casey Anthony should be sitting in a prison cell but, thanks to 12 village idiots she is walking around free as a bird.

    • pat deadder says:

      ay2z I wasn’t going to read the comments after this article as I find the vulgar racist remarks too disturbing.I wadded in and there were some reasonable comments there.So maybe there’s hope for a fair jury after all.There was one comment which went something like this ”If only the colonists had learned to pick their own cotton” or something like that.I read no more but it struck me funny in a strange way the irony of it.Yea and there might not have been slaves.

      • Rachael says:

        You think this is reasonable?

        “Meanwhile, Traycoon is in the ground… Mission Accomplished.”

        That is so gddamned disgusting!!! How the hell can they allow people to say something so crass. I’m going to be sick. I just can’t believe it.

        How can there be people like that?!!! Is that not proof that for some, perhaps many, this has NOTHING to do with self-defense?

      • ladystclaire says:

        @Rachael, not to worry my dear, I will be getting in touch with whoever is responsible for this site. I am sick and damn tired of hate speech being allowed in some media outlets as freedom of speech. something has got to be done and, I mean now. maybe it would be a good idea to let those who advertise on these racist sites, to be boycotted until they stop this BS.

        This kind of shit is not necessary and, it needs to stop. instead of the Zimmerman family calling off these racist SOB’S, they themselves are taking part in the smearing of this child whose life was taken by their evil spawn of the devil himself. these people keep bringing up AA rioting, they just don’t know do they.

        They are showing us and the rest of the world just how *IGNORANT* that they as racist can really be.

      • Rachael says:

        Thank you ladystclaire. My cousin is the managing editor of the Orgonian. I’m going to ask him to help me find the real people I need to contact to put an end to this kind of crap. He doesn’t deal with online publication, but I’m sure he knows people who do and would help us somehow. They all say inappropriate comments will be deleted, but they aren’t. I really cannot believe they think that is appropriate or freedom of speech. There really has to be some way to get them to stop allowing such horrible crap. I honestly do not know how Trayvon’s parents make it through another day. I would not be able to do it. I just wouldn’t.

    • ay2z says:

      I don’t read them, the times I have taken a peek, reminds me not to.

      “they’ = ‘it # 1 and it # 2, maybe an it #3

      • pat deadder says:

        Rachael I didn’t read that comment as a matter of fact I wish I hadn’t seen it now.I never never go to any of those sights.I don’t understand how these remarks are permitted.This must be illegal.God I hope they are prosecuted for hate speech.I’m an old lady and have never seen the likes of this.There is a you tube by someone called ”ThisShitHasGotToStop”.that is very good,I have no idea how Trayvon’s family can deal with this disgusting trash.plus the loss of their child as well as having to go though a trial.I feel ashamed of myself when I see their endurance and dignity.

      • ladystclaire says:

        @Pat, Trayvon’s family shouldn’t have to deal with this kind of BS and, if it were not for the media sites that allow it, they wouldn’t be seeing just how some white people in this country still see AA as less than human beings. no other family of a murdered family member have had to put up with this kind of disrespect. by these media sites to allow them to do this, just proves to me that, this is the way they think about this case as well.

      • ladystclaire says:

        Signed sealed and DELIVERED!

      • Rachael says:

        But why do the media sites allow it? Have they sold their soul for ratings? It should NOT be allowed!!!

    • Two sides to a story says:

      This case truly is a battleground, but I bet most of the attorneys involved are best buds, and if not best buds, cordial to one another at the end of the day. Just sayin’.

  23. colin black says:

    Qoute from Billie Dunn or Ostrander as she calls her self nows Attorney John Young in or to local source?

    John Young, the lawyer for the family of Hailey Dunn, confirms to the Odessa American that the bones found in Scurry County last month are those of missing Colorado City teen Hailey Dunn.

    The remains were found last month. Dunn was reported missing on Dec. 28, 2010, from the family’s home in Colorado City. A press conference was called this afternoon in Scurry County.

    Several law enforcement agencies converged on a location near Lake J.B. Thomas last month after human remains were found there, officials from the Department of Public Safety reported.

    Human bones were found at a location south of Snyder near Lake J.B. Thomas, Senior Trooper Sparky Dean reported at the time.

    Speculation began immediately after the discovery about whether the remains are those of Dunn.

    Billie Jean Dunn, the mother of the missing teen, was in contact with investigators following the discovery of the bones, the OA reported last month.

    Dunn reported her 13-year-old daughter missing Dec. 28, 2010, from the family’s home in Colorado City. Since then, there has been very little evidence uncovered involving her disappearance. Shawn Adkins, the then live-in boyfriend of Billie Jean Dunn, is the only person identified as a suspect by Colorado City police. No arrests have been made in the case.

    The remains were found near the lake about 22 miles west of the community of Dunn, where Adkins lived with his grandmother following the teen’s disappearance.

    Dean did not know what types of bones had been discovered. However, Billie Jean Dunn said via text message last month investigators said that “as soon as they can compare dental records they (investigators) will let me know.”

    An FBI evidence-response team had been at the scene of where the remains were found.

    The Texas Rangers requested the FBI’s assistance, which is routinely done because of the FBI team’s expertise on processing and collecting evidence, Chaumont said.

    When asked if the FBI agents were on scene because of the possibility it could be Hailey Dunn, Chaumont could not speculate and referred to the local law enforcement. She did say that the evidence-response teams are called at the assistance of local law enforcement.

    The bones were found by an individual who immediately contacted the Scurry County Sheriff’s Office, Dean said. Scurry County investigators enlisted the assistance of the Texas Rangers and the DPS.

    Because of the extreme decomposition, investigators were unable to determine the gender and age of the bones, including whether the remains are that of an adult or child. Billie Jean Dunn said investigators did not tell her whether clothing was found near the remains.

    Dean said the remains were sent to a medical examiner either in Lubbock or Tarrant County.

    “We are treating this as a crime scene,” Dean said at the time. “We want to make sure that we preserve any evidence that may have been left behind.”

    An expert in identifying human remains, Dr. Roger Metcalf, who works in the Human Identification Laboratory in Tarrant County, said that with skeletal remains there’s no way to tell how long it might take to identify a person. And it’s possible that the skeletal remains might never be identified, he said. Metcalf was speaking generally and not specifically about the remains found in Scurry County near Snyder.

    April 26, 2013 at 4:46 PM

    • Thanks colin for letting us know at least her body was found. poor thing. and I guess we already knew she was gone rather than kidnapped or ran away. she didn’t run anywhere. someone took her somewhere and killed her. and as usual the nasty step-father is suspect number 1. didn’t he have little girl pics in their own bedroom?
      and you know I totally believed her mother when she first spoke out. but then she was too absolute about the boyfriend being innocent. but she turned on him real fast. I thought that was pretty suspicious on her part.

  24. colin black says:

    Re above meant couple of people or people monsters more apt descriptor

    HAILEY

    You were never forgotten lost in the ugly feilds though your body lay.

    You found your way into my heart in the UK.
    And Millions of others found a place in there hearts for you.

    You also found your way into our thoughts an prayers an will never leave.

    Your blood mother may have betrayed you and abused you allowed you to be used an abused.

    Us your adoppted loved ones never gave up hope .

    R I P Angel

  25. colin black says:

    O T

    Hailey Dunn remains confirmed Scurry County.

    couple of prople I can think of considering scurryn back under there rocks about now.

  26. http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/042613_crumps_memo.pdf

    George Zimmerman’s defense team is aware of several witnesses that will identify it was Trayvon Martin crying for help on February 26, 2012. Therefore, Tracy Martin’s testimony would be unnecessary and immaterial for the purposes which defendse counsel purports that George Zimmerman’s Sixth Amendment Rights would be violated.

  27. MOTION TO DETERMINE CONFIDENTIALITY OF COURT RECORDS IN OPPOSITION TO DEFENDANT’S MOTION TO UNSEAL

    http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0413/042613_crumps_memo.pdf

    Conclusion:

    Here, George Zimmerman’s defense team seeks to draw the attention away from the events that took place on February 26, 2012 when Trayvon Martin was killed by George Zimmerman. Instead, Defense Counsel wants to focus on immaterial collateral matters involving a confidential settlement that has nothing to do with the elements of second degree murder; which is why George Zimmerman is on trial.

    *************

    Wham! Bam! KaPow!

    • Lonnie Starr says:

      I’m sure the court will take note of these incredibly foolish wastes of valuable time, when the motion for continuance comes up.

      I’m sure the judge will say: Gee, you’ve had over a year with nothing to do but pursue your claims of self defense and firm up your claims for immunity, and instead you’ve wasted the entire year and some 350 thousand dollars in cash, on nothing but extreme nonsense. So, yes, you Sirs are richly entitled to another years time to waste on everything other than getting ready for trial. NOT!!! June 10th FOOLS, this circus is shutting down!!!

  28. Malisha says:

    I think BDLR also wants to ascertain for certain that Fogen is where his ankle bracelet alleges he is, and not (as on 2/26/2012) just “have them call me when they get here, OK?”

  29. Malisha says:

    “Motions and Potions” — Colin, that’s INSPIRED! :mrgreen:

  30. colin black says:

    M O M says the man with no time to prepare his clients defence.
    Not enough hours in the day for us to be ready by June tenth.
    But plenty time for B S motions an potions .

    How could an alleged intellegent man defending a client guilty of setting his own laws an regulations as he went ahead an profiled Trayvon as up to no good on drugs or summpin thug asshole fkn coon.

    Yep– the defense has about 8 motions added today to be heard.

    ‘Govern yourself accordingly’ says M’OM.

    Just like your client governed the retreats at twin lakes acordingly to his rules.
    Acording to your client walking whilst black an unknown to he who knows everone in the complex is a death sentance.

    Although he cant even remember one of the 3 streets names within the community .

    • racerrodig says:

      “B S motions an potions .” That’s a great expression !!

      Punch ’em in the face Colin……right in the kisser !

  31. Trained Observer says:

    Whine, whine, whine …

    We need alternative whine lyrics to change, change, change. 🙂

    http://www.orlandosentinel.com/os-george-zimmerman-motion-sanction-20130426,0,4640522.story

    • I’ll take whiskey over whine any day

      • Rachael says:

        I won’t repeat what my ex used to say about stores with the sign saying “Liquor and Wine.”

        But he sure thought he was funny.

      • ay2z says:

        (take whiskey over whine, any day, rain or ‘shine’?)

      • ay2z says:

        Spill the Whine

        • racerrodig says:

          I was once out strolling one very hot summer’s day
          When I thought I’d lay myself down to rest in a big field of tall grass
          I laid there in the sun and felt it caressing my face
          And I fell asleep and dreamed

          I dreamed I was in a Hollywood movie
          And that I was the star of the movie, this really blew my mind
          The fact that me an overweight short haired lying gnome
          Should be the star of a Hollywood movie

          But there I was, I was taken to a place
          The hall of the mountain kings
          I stood high by the mountain tops, naked to the world
          In front of every kind of girl

          There was long one’s, tall ones, short ones, brown ones
          Black ones, round ones, big ones, crazy ones
          Out of the middle, came a lady
          SheLie whispered in my ear something crazy, she said

          Spill the wine and take that pearl
          Spill the wine and take that pearl
          Spill the wine and take that pearl
          Spill the wine and take that pearl

          I could feel hot flames of fire roaring at my back
          As he disappeared, but soon he returned
          In his hand was a bottle of wine
          In the other, a glass
          He poured some of the wine
          From the bottle into the glass
          And raised it to his lips
          And just before she drank it, he said

          Take the wine, take that girl
          Spill the wine, take that girl
          Spill the wine, take that girl
          Spill the wine, take that girl, take that girl, yeah

          It’s on girl, all you gotta do is spill that wine
          Spill that wine, let me feel, let me feel hot, yeah, yeah
          Spill the wine, spill the wine, spill the wine, spill the wine
          Spill the wine, spill the wine, spill the wine, take that girl

    • racerrodig says:

      Oh, a hint I see.

      Fogen…………….

      To everyone you Whine, Whine, Whine
      There is a reason you Lie, Lie, Lie
      And a time to every purpose, under Heaven

      A time to be born, a time to die
      A time to plant, a time to reap
      Why did you kill, it’s time to heal
      A time to laugh, and you made a weep

      To everyone you Whine, Whine, Whine
      There is a reason you Lie, Lie, Lie
      And a time to every purpose, under Heaven

      A time to build up,a time to break down
      A time to dance, a time to mourn
      A time to cast away stones,
      A time to remember Tray – von together

      To everyone you Lie, Lie, Lie
      There is a reason you Whine, Whine, Whine
      And a time to every purpose, under Heaven

      A time of love, a time of hate
      A time of war, a time of peace
      A time you may embrace, a time to refrain from embracing

      To everyone you Lie, Lie, Lie
      There is a reason you Whine, Whine, Whine
      And a time to every purpose, under Heaven

      A time to gain, a time to lose
      A time to rend, a time to sew
      A time for love, so why would we hate
      A time for peace, I swear it’s not too late

      • Trained Observer says:

        Racer — Superb, simply superb. Fogen soon will be rending aplenty.

        • racerrodig says:

          I haven’t done a lyric rewrite in a month so I was due. I’ve been so busy in the shop I haven’t been able to keep up here. Looks like I’m the only one east of the Mississippi doing carburetors and Hot Rod work any more.

          But it looks like Tuesday will be a hoot…….

          Here’s an oldie

          You are the god of all liars and I tell you

          Liar, we’re sure you will burn.
          Liar, we’re sure you won’t learn.
          We’ll see you burn!

          You fought hard but you never learned,
          but all of it’s going to burn.
          And your mind, your tiny mind,
          you know you’ve really been so blind.
          Now ‘s your time burn your mind.
          You’re defense has fallen way behind.
          Oh no, oh no, oh no, you’re gonna burn!

          Liar, you’ll destroy all you’ve done.
          Liar, to end all you’ve become.
          We’ll see you burn!

          You’ve been living like a whiny girl,
          in the middle of your little world.
          And your mind, your tiny mind,
          you know you’ve really been so blind.
          Now ‘s your time burn your mind,
          You’re defense has fallen way behind. Owwwww, Owww

          Liar, you’ll destroy all you’ve done.
          Liar, to end all you’ve become.
          You’re gonna burn, you’re gonna burn
          You’re gonna burn, burn, burn, burn, burn, burn, burn, burn,
          burn, burn, burn, burn, burn

          A haha haha haha ha ! A hahahaha hahaha !

          Liar, we’re sure you will burn.
          Liar, we’re sure you won’t learn

          Liar, we’re sure you will burn.
          Liar, we’re sure you won’t learn

      • racerrodig says:

        Maybe this is what FogenPhoole is trying to say…………

        People, do you understand me now
        Sometimes I feel a little mad
        But don’t you know that no one alive
        Can always be an angel
        When things go wrong I seem to be bad
        But I’m just a soul whose intentions were good
        Oh Judge, please don’t let me be misunderstood

        People, sometimes I’m so carefree
        With a joy that’s hard to hide
        And sometimes it seems that all I do is worry
        Then you’re bound to see my other side
        But I’m just a soul whose intentions were good
        Oh Judge, please don’t let me be misunderstood

        If I seem edgy I want you to know
        That I really mean to take it out on you
        Life has it’s problems and I get my share
        And that’s one thing I never meant to do
        Because I love you
        Oh, Oh People don’t you know I’m human
        Have thoughts like no other one
        Sometimes I find myself long regretting
        Some foolish thing some little criminal thing I’ve done

        But I’m just a soul whose intentions were good
        Oh Judge, please don’t let me be misunderstood
        Yes, I’m just a soul whose intentions were good
        Oh Judge, please don’t let me be misunderstood
        Yes, I’m just a soul whose intentions were good
        Oh Judge, please don’t let me be misunderstood

  32. ay2z says:

    Musical interlude.
    Brand new from Michael Buble with Naturally 7. Canadian, American, black and white, making great music against the tiles in the tubes.

  33. George Zimmerman lawyers to judge: Sanction state for ‘personal attacks’

    http://www.orlandosentinel.com/os-george-zimmerman-motion-sanction-20130426,0,4640522.story

    George Zimmerman’s defense team has filed a slew of new documents with the court in advance of next week’s hearing in his second-degree murder case — including another request for sanctions against the prosecution.

    Zimmerman’s lawyer, Mark O’Mara, on Friday replied to a blistering filing issued by prosecutor Bernie de la Rionda last month.

    The prosecutor, responding to a defense motion which argued the state delayed in turning over important information to Zimmerman and should be sanctioned, in March called O’Mara a grandstander who “courts anything resembling a microphone or camera.”

    In his reply, O’Mara says de la Rionda’s March filing was full of “scurrilous and unfounded personal attacks,” and should be struck from the record. O’Mara also asks the court to “enter whatever additional sanctions it deems appropriate.”

    “Such behaviors have, in similar cases, subjected the offending attorney to sanctions and disciplinary proceedings,” O’Mara writes.

    O’Mara also filed a series of affidavits in support of another request aimed at penalizing the state: He wants the state to pay more than $4,500 in costs associated with depositions which were delayed when de la Rionda objected to them being videotaped.

    • ay2z says:

      Yep– the defense has about 8 motions added today to be heard. ‘Govern yourself accordingly’ says M’OM.

      Anything to distract and take time from the immunity hearing question that the state wants to have answered. Hope at least that takes priority on the list of motions.

      • ay2z says:

        Just in time for a weekend in front of cameras and microphones, eh, M’OM? That will serve support Bernies accusations, so go ahead!!

    • Rachael says:

      Boohoohoo, call the waaaaaaaaambulance. What a crybaby. Besides, MOM IS a grandstander who “courts anything resembling a microphone or camera.”

    • OMG I was just going to post that! This is a joke! Every single bullshit motion Omar turns is is an attack on BDLR, Ben Crump, Trayvon’s parents, Nat Jackson AND Judge Nelson!!

      I asked yeasterday how does Omar get away with this obvious unprofessional behavior? How do other proffesionals in that district work with him if he can’t be responsible to advocate for clients properly? How can they trust him in situations, like when Judge Nelson told Omar BDLR was an officer of the court and he knows the discovery rules. She had to basically tell Omar that she trusts BDLR and unless/until she finds a problem he needs to STFU!

      I’m ready for this trial to procede! Bernie says : The song is on, IT’S TIME TO GET DOWN!

    • Nef05 says:

      Hmmm, could it be a distraction from the fact that among all those motions there was NOTa motion for an immunity hearing? O’Mara is grandstanding and deflecting.

      The last time this immunity issue was raised, in court, O’Mara (and Stutzman?) went on and on about DeeDee to mitigate the impact of O’Mara waiving of the dates set aside by Judge Nelson.

      Is there anyone who does not think that this slew of motions, are being submitted this close to the hearing date, in order to deflect from the fact that a full out waiver of the immunity hearing is expected to come straight from fogen’s mouth. Anyone want to bet that the OS, puts the majority of their focus on these motions and only casually mentions the result of the prosecution’s demand for immunity hearing clarity?

      AND – O’Mara has motioned for any enahnced version of the 911 call LISTENED TO BY TRACEY MARTIN, AS DESCRIBED BY CRUMP. AFAIK – Mr. Martin listened to a version that brought out the screams, and lowered all background noise.

      This is NOT the same as the enhanced version from the Feds that bring Zimmerman’s voice out in the background. From what I remember, Mr. Martin heard that tape long before the fed enhanced tape with Zimmerman’s voice was even done. So, O’Mara is “looking like” he’s asking for the “enhanced tape” of the 911 call, when really he’s not – or he would have motioned for the one that BDLR, mentioned in December.

      If I am correct in my assessment, (and I believe I am because O’Mara mentions Mr. Martin and Crump, specifically, as opposed to “ANY enhanced version in the state’s possession”), those are two different tapes and O’Mara knows this. Once again, he is playing his non-critically thnking supporters/donors for fools…

      • Lonnie Starr says:

        Hey, now there’s an idea… Let’s see who can write a news report that will come closest to what MOM and Stutzman will put out?

        Here:

        Today in court the magnificent law team of O’Mara and West, went “hell bent for leather” after the ruinous invective laced diatribe laid down by the prosecutions team of predators. The court was filled with the high literary challenges to the irrelevant and immaterial motions filed by the state, in their ongoing effort to steamroll over the defendants rights.

        In the face of the powerful state prosecutor and the tremendous power they hold over the court, Mr. O’Mara was able to win concessions from the court, that acknowledged his tireless efforts and voluminous work product on behalf of his heroic client. Thought his motions were denied on relatively minor procedural errors, oversights and nitpicking omissions, O’Mara and West managed to hold their own ’till the last shoe dropped in the court room and the defendant was allowed to march triumphantly for home. –filed R. Sman lead law reporter for the OS.
        ——————

        There, how’s that? She may not even have to show up for work that day, just copy something from here. 😆

      • Nef05 says:

        @Lonnie – Perfect! Except you write far better than she does. She’d need a dictionary, a thesaurus and an MLA handbook to even come close to your writing.

      • Soulcatcher says:

        You mean the tape where Zimmerman is screaming help me, help me, help me, while Treyvon has his mouth covered with both hands. banging his head on the concrete till he is almost unconcious with 2 more hands, doing the shimmy shimmy, and felt Treyvon going for his gun. Dam, I thought my 4 year old g-son told some good ones, like the punky rooster monster that lives up in a cave in the mountain with the army guy and his dog, but I think Zippys got him beat with his story. According to Zippy, it’s Gods Will that he’s alive to play this out in court. I don’t know what his deal is, maybe he was on drugs, break out the popcorn, this is going to be good. MOM and Co sounds like their feathers are alittle ruffled over getting a sound enhanced version of the call, and I don’t know what the big issue is, cause Zippy told him it’s him screaming. So what’s Mom trying to say?

    • Jun says:

      Even if the court were to agree to that motion, Omara would get fined 1000 times more, because his media appearances have been nothing but “scurrilous and unfounded personal attacks”

      He attacks Trayvon, with no evidence

      He attacks the victim’s parents

      He attacks Crump

      He attacks Deedee

      and besides that, the ultimate defense against a claim of slander, which is what this motion basically is, is that it is the truth or at least appears to be the truth

      either way, whatever happens, I think Omara will get a bad deal on the end

      I also do not get how calling him a grand stander that courts anything resembling a microphone or camera, is considered a personal attack, but that’s me

      The simple fact Omara cant answer a simple yes or no question in regards to the SYG hearing, shows that Omara grand stands, and that he has whore the media for the whole year kind of proves Bernie’s point

  34. ay2z says:

    M’OM is on the warpath once again. Strange (not) how OS gets the story and the court filings before the court enters them on the docket, and of course, they NEVER link the pdfs.

    M”OM brings supportfrom his collegues in Orlando, defense lawyers Hornsby, and from the NeJame firm and more to say that M’OM’s fees are reasonable.

    What is this really about besides money? Is it to reach the jury pool about poor defense, bad Bernie? Is it about a distraction from the core immunity bluff and folded hand issue?

    Or is it about delay, or just anything to give press to the case that avoids the problem of having no case, and backtracking on the immunity issue?

    • ay2z says:

      Going to be a long hearing next week.

      The state added those family and friends witnesses this week, defense doesn’t seem to like that. Does lateness of filing cause the defense the ability to have these witnesses tossed out? (In the past, the defense wanted witnesse listings (experts) delayed and the state said they would agree. Then the defense went on the attack.

      Is the hearing next week going to be about moving along towards trial, or will it be a spaghetti fight in the courtroom?

      • Trained Observer says:

        Yep … best to clear most of Tuesday’s calendar for the proceedings.

      • I don’t think it will be long at all. Judge Nelson will be controlled and concise. She will make a strong statement about this nonsense and send them on their way.

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          By the time the hearings get underway, Judge Nelson will have read these motions and decided what their fatal flaws are and either dismiss them or give modified relief if applicable. MOM doesn’t get to force the court to engage “silly”.

          The only real constraint, that underlay whether or not the Judges ruling will be substance for successful appeal or not, is the likelihood that something the court rules, causes the case to be decided one way or the other, in conflict to what the evidence indicates.

          In other words, if your case is a clear, hands down loser, you can’t blame the judge’s decisions for your loss.

          It may seem unfair to a defendant, to have to face trial without any exculpatory evidence at all, but that doesn’t mean that the judge has to level the playing field by directing a verdict of acquittal. GZ and MOM must simply face the fact that the case they have is a total loser. Further it is a loser because, on top of the evidence going against the defendant, his own testimony is full of self serving lies, concocted in an effort to escape being held to account for his own disgusting conduct.

  35. Malisha says:

    I heard an interview of Dershowitz tonight on NPR about the constitutional issues re the Boston Marathon bombings and the suspect in custody. Dershowitz seemed intelligent and in control of his voice and emotions for about 90% of the interview and then fell off the beam, calling Richard Falk an “idiot” and another derogatory word I have now forgotten. I personally think very negative things about Falk but I find Dershowitz’s rhetoric to be uncontrolled, bizarre and strangely similar to the weird attack he made on Corey for charging Fogen with 2nd Degree Murder. Do you think Dershowitz (who has been half-unhinged for about 10 years by now) is suffering some cognitive problems? Perhaps he should keep to himself more.

    • PiranhaMom says:

      @Malisha,

      Not that you’re asking my opinion, Malisha, but Falk seems off the rails most of the time regarding Israel. I can see Dershowitz gnashing his teeth. Both trying to revitalize the earlier attention they once commanded?

      I think these two old coots deserve each other.

      • Malisha says:

        They do indeed. I never said I thought Falk was “hinged” but calling him an idiot on NPR means, to me, that Dershowitz is UNhinged. As the Fulton-Martins teach us, remarkably stupid and offensive attacks apropos of nothing other than the remarker’s racism/anti-semitism/bigotry/etc. should best be ignored with an elegant and dismissive silence. If, however, a person chooses to contradict or controvert, one should do so with the professionalism and intellectual rigor expected of the person asserting the counter-argument, not by throwing around senseless epithets like “idiot” or “thug” or “fucking punk.”

        Dershowitz has every right to disdain Falk and every right to explain exactly what is wrong with Falk’s arguments. But foaming at the mouth and calling Falk an idiot (he is NOT unintelligent and that is part of the reason his pronouncements are so disturbing; any idiot can blab this stuff to high heaven and not merit a second’s attention) was peculiar and made Dershowitz sound much less prestigious than HE should be.

        Of course, I lost all respect for him early in the Trayvon Martin case where he made it abundantly clear that he didn’t think much punishment was in order for a guy simply killing a Black kid. That puts Dershowitz in the same ridiculous position as Falk, but Falk targets Jews and Dershowitz targets those he personally denigrates.

    • Bill Taylor says:

      i have to question dershos intelligence and ability as a lawyer, he made statements about the fogen case that are clearly WRONG, either he did NOT look at the evidence and was just shooting off at the mouth OR he did look at the evidence and is INCOMPETENT.

      either way very bad behavior for an officer of the court.

      • Malisha says:

        He also seems to personally abhor Corey and a lot of his inane ad hominem attacks on her were appalling. I don’t like Corey either, but he suggested she should be disbarred and prosecuted for submitting a false affidavit which HE characterized as false because it did not promote the DEFENSE position about the as-yet-unauthenticated head-bump photo.

        I think Falk and Dershowitz both need a trip down the Great, Green, Greasy Limpopo River on a slowwwwwwwwww barge.

    • Two sides to a story says:

      Dersh seems a bit odd to me.

  36. Rachael says:

    “I think there will be people attempting to get to the jurors, through intimidation, by putting out information that might help bias or prejudice them.”

    Gee, and I wonder who would do such a thing-cough MOM cough cough.

  37. 500 jury summons for George Zimmerman trial to go out soon

    http://www.baynews9.com/content/news/baynews9/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/4/25/_500_jury_summons_fo.html

    SEMINOLE COUNTY —
    You might soon be getting a summons to be a part of the jury that will decide George Zimmerman’s fate if you live in Seminole County.

    Jury notices will be going out soon to 500 people throughout the county.

    But is it possible to have an unbiased jury decide the case?

    News 13 legal analyst Mark NeJame said attorneys have a tough job ahead of them when picking a jury for the June trial.

    An acquittal could spark protest, and it could have a long-term effect on Sanford and Seminole County, where the jurors live.

    News 13 asked Nejame if that could factor into their decision.

    “It can be a factor without question, and I think it is going to be incumbent on the parties, and the judge in this case, to have a sequestered jury the entire time. I think there will be people attempting to get to the jurors, through intimidation, by putting out information that might help bias or prejudice them.”

    Zimmerman’s defense team could have asked for a change of venue, moving the case to a different county, but decided not to because they felt the case was too widely known for a change of venue to really have an effect.

    According to the United States Census Bureau, Seminole County had a population of 430,838 people in 2012, which means residents have less than one percent of a chance – .116 percent – of getting one of those jury summons.

    News 13 will have live gavel-to-gavel coverage from the trial.

  38. Soulcatcher says:

    I guess I would be southwest, off of 10, in La Quinta, near the Palm Springs area.

    • Know the area….Used to go shooting at the Oasis on North Ramon road….fenced off now…..this was back in the 70’s / 80’s

      Threw a rod through the block on a VW camper outside Bombay Beach on the Salton Sea……..Spent a lot of time at Mt Laguna outside Julian….good memories.

      Memories, such as the ones that one young man will never get to have…….because some asshole wanted to be a tough guy.

      HOODIES UP

      • Soulcatcher says:

        Hey, was that your vw camper I saw to long ago at the Salton Sea? Lol….They say that was the happening place back in the day. You can get a beach front lot pretty darn cheap now. Alot of people prefer the nice community at Slab City, no hoa, they can break out the paint at Salvation Mountain.

        • Brown and beige ’71 VW pop top camper….named?

          Hitlers revenge :(….Fukkin money pit….

          I had owned 4 other VW Baja’s…did all the work on them myself….and yeah….right outside Bombay Beach I thru a rod thru the block……$400.00 to have it towed back

  39. Big Park…….50 mi. which way?………My favorite area was on the south side….Cottonwood Springs….Been to the natural arch there…..Barker dam……Rattlesnake canyon……….Got caught in a thunderstorm there once…….A flash flood down a dry creek bed cut off my way back to camp….spent the night there cold and wet 😦

    I enjoy where I’m at now even more :)…..the only thing I’d like to have is more oxygen…….My front door is at 9,000ft……Twice as high as Cajon Pass…..BTW…..I met Bobby Gentry (Ode to Billy Joe) at the Summit Inn on the top of the pass….early 70’s….They used to have the best biscuits and gravy around.

  40. Soulcatcher says:

    @mountainmanpat, that’s alittle over 50 miles from me.

  41. Animaljunkie says:

    The Afro-Peruvian Emperor has definitely lost his groove!

    • Soulcatcher says:

      @mountainmanpat, It’s in the middle of the desert, and you don’t know what hot is until you’ve spent a summer here. Alot of the residents leave here in May and return in October, it’s almost 100 degree’s now. The winters are beautiful.

      • Rachael says:

        I used to live in Phoenix. The jails have no AC. One day in May we had record high of 122 degrees. They had to shut down the airport because the runway specifications only went to 120, although summer temperatures of 115/117 were not uncommon. I was a nurse passing meds in the jail and fortunately that day I was working in the infirmary. While the cells had no AC, the infirmary did. I was sooooo glad.

      • Soulcatcher says:

        @Jun, you are right. I would say 50 percent of the population in our city is Mexican, although we live in a resort city where all the rich and famous come to play golf. In other cities around us like Indio, Cochella, there are problems with the Mexican gangs. If you are arrested in one of the desert cities here, you get your mug plastered in a weekly newpaper, along with the crime you were arrested for and your address.

      • I did a lot of backpacking and camping in Joshua Tree……Fall thru spring only……..

  42. colin black says:

    Prison Officers want as little problems at there jobs as possable.
    Its dangerous enough without makeing work for your self.

    And placeing problem prisoners high profile Child Murderers like Casey Anthony or foggagge in genral population would definiely cause…

    Problems they dont want to deal with paper work they dont want to write..
    The vulnarable prisoners wings are actually sought after dutys for prison officers.
    The inmates are the best behaved and most compliant within the prison system.

    However his big mistahe was his dissparigeing insulting remarks against Mexicans.
    Calling them cowards an threating to run them over with his ve ic KILL.

    And he is going to be liveing within a GATED COMUNITY very soon where the Mexicans are the Neighbour HOOD watch.

    An no one is ungettable in Jail even in vulnarable prisoner wings.
    No one was as high profile an kept in vulnerable unit than Jeffry Dahmer .
    Ang he was murdered .

    • Rachael says:

      Yes siree – he will be living within a gated community. Hahahaha Love it.

    • Two sides to a story says:

      Send him to Cali. He’ll have great fun in the gated communities here.

      • Soulcatcher says:

        @two sides, oh yes, Cali it is, there’s a special one down here in Southern Cali that my sister-in-law works at, and she’s high up on the ladder there. There’s only one thing worse than a woman in charge, and that’s a woman with an attitude that’s black. .

        • That wouldn’t happen to be Eagle Mountain out in the middle of the desert on the way to Vegas would it?

          I like the “DO NOT PICK UP HITCHHIKERS” signs on the 15 going by there 🙂

      • Jun says:

        Fogen would be dead in Cali

        That is Mexican central

        I am sure there are hardcore thug ass Mexicans that want to show Fogen what up

        PS. Not saying all Mexicans are thugs

      • Two sides to a story says:

        Many very lovely people here too. I’m just playin’ with Fogen.

        Eh, soulcatcher, Madea in charge!

        • Used to live in a gated community in So Cal…..Canyon Lake…….the HOA there was nothing more than a bunch of little hitlers…Bought and old pickup for one of my sons and I to restore……..all 4 wheels off and it’s on jackstands…….I get a letter from the HOA that that’s unsafe…..WTF?…….No wheels, and off the ground.

          I’m sure Race knows EXACTLY what I’m talkin about.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        Omigosh, I was airing a futon out in the sun for an hour on a patio in one and got Nazied by an HOA manager.

        But I was talking about Fogen’s type of gated community . . .

      • looolooo says:

        @mmp…… I used to work for the Riverside Co. Sheriff’s Dept. at their Perris Staion, in Perris on 4th St. Our station served the Canyon Lake community! No offense, but most residents seemed to be arrogant and demanding ash holes who acted as though they were living in RVSD CO.’s equivilant of Holmby Hills or sumpem. It was laughable because just outside the community, you drive down into Lake Elsinore, Perris, Mead Valley, Romoland, down 74 HWY for goodness sake!

        Fogenmeister would fit right in. Lot’s of Mexicans though…..

        • One of my sons likes off Cottonwood canyon….another lives in the Creekside tract….both south of railroad canyon…..Know the area quite well…..Remember a bar on Mission trail in Lake Smellsomemore..The Hideaway….they had a bumper sticker over the dorr “Sex, Drugs & Old Volkswagens” :)…or Tanners Outpost on Grand in Lakeland VIllage?

  43. Soulcatcher says:

    What a good role model. Maybe he should give the sh**bag Afro-peruvian white Hispanic gun tottin wanabe cop a job. Just think, they could ride around in the big red shruck and share stories. about them black hoodie thugs. Captain Zippy would be so proud.

  44. FactsFirst says:

    In other news, “Miami-Dade ordered to restore demoted firefighter’s rank after Trayvon Martin rant”

    Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/04/24/3362401/miami-dade-ordered-to-restore.html#storylink=cpy

    WOW!!! SMDH…

    • Rachael says:

      Outhouse rant, word for word.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        Yup. At least he got some punishment, even if he does get his rank restored. Maybe he’ll think twice about running his mouth now. On one hand, we all have a right to free speech, on another, our public servants need to be trusted to serve all equally. Personally, I wouldn’t want him at my fire.

      • Malisha says:

        I’d only want him at my fire if it was…oh nevermind. 👿

      • Rachael says:

        Freedom of speech does not come without freedom of consequence.

      • Jun says:

        Funny how he says Corey is pre-passing judgement and yet he does not know Trayvon or all the facts, and according to him, Sybrina is a shit bag parent, and Trayvon is a ghetto thug, when Trayvon never even lived in the ghetto, and Sybrina works for the city and has not done anything considered shit bag. Mayor Giminez got it right, and actually, Giminez is the ultimate department director because he’s the mayor, so their argument is baseless.

        They are the ones putting lives at risk having that guy even on there

        • Xena says:

          @Jun.

          Funny how he says Corey is pre-passing judgement and yet he does not know Trayvon or all the facts, and according to him, Sybrina is a shit bag parent, …

          And those are the type of statements that scream out racial bigotry and confirm that GZ’s supporters believe that he committed a racial hate crime.

      • cielo62 says:

        Rachael~ It disgusted me so much, I went in throwing a few punches. WHY do scum like that even exist?

    • Jun says:

      If they restore his job, they are really stupid. The guy made some cold blooded remarks about a dead killed kid. How are people supposed to trust him as a firefighter? What if he decides at the last minute the people at a certain building dont deserve to be saved? A firefighter is a position of honor, righteousness, and service and he lacks all of that.

      • PiranhaMom says:

        @Jun –

        The decision was made purely on contractual grounds.

        I don’t know if the union contract precludes this. but if I were Mayor I would have invited the DumbAss Fire Captain to lunch, along with the Fire Chief (the Mayor being a former firefighter) and have Sybrina Fulton included. Without pointing out that Sybrina is Trayvon’s mother. Just referring to her executive position with the City.

        Then I would have ordered Captain DumbAss to write up a report of the Social Event – guest names, food, service – the usual social reporting. If the Captain and the Fire Chief have wives, I would h include them to round out the table for six.

        I am assuming the Mayor has an office big enough to host a non-interrupted catered lunch. It should have been a lovely event.

        The ladies certainly would have bonded as Sybrina is so gracious.

        Then, after reviewing the Captain’s “guest report” I would order him to circulate it among his e-mail buddies.

        Then I would decide his penalty.

        It would be an educational exercise for all …

        • You’re one cruel bitch…..I LIKE IT 🙂

          Busted……In Public 🙂

          • PiranhaMom says:

            @ MountainMan.

            Funny thing, I was thinking of you, Pat, as I wrote that scenario.

            I was remembering a lunch I had with a Police Chief in a SoCal town that you know so well – in the late 70’s. – it wasn’t Lakewood, (to keep the Chief’s identity obscured) but it was nearby and about the same size. The Chief had one of the most common surnames in the phone book, but I’ll just call him “Brady – he had Scots-Irish coloring, sandy red hair (and temperament to match). The reason for the lunch was plenty stupid but he asked me to come down as a favor, and I did.

            The reason was that there was a notable homicide in town the week earlier and it was covered on TV. A crew came down from NBC and inexplicably convinced one of Brad’s guys to unshackle the suspect in the hall for an on-camera interview during transport to Federal custody, “because it would look better on TV.” Unfortunately, the media (especially an on-camera guy that everybody recognized) was inexplicably persuasive on the low-level jailor, who complied. Now – nothing went wrong, no escape – but, of course, the Chief caught the scene on “News at 11!” and figured every other cop in SoCal caught the blunder, too. Hell raged the next day down at the station – and with the brass up at Burbank, too.

            So Mr. on-camera guy, sideburns and all, was sent down by the NBC brass to take Chief “Brady” to lunch, to apologize, and placate him. “Brady” was not all that thrilled, and asked me to come down and join him, to keep the event civil. I was an independent producer at that time and making counter-terrorism films that cops all over the country were using, and he said “You two Hollywood guys might find something to talk about, and besides, come down an hour earlier, I got something to show you.” Well, I wasn’t a guy and I didn’t have Hollywood sideburns like Mr. Slick, but I was intrigued, because what “Brady” had to show me was a neat collection of fake bombs & incendiary devices – which I later used as props.

            So then, NBC’s Mr. Smooth shows up and we head to lunch.

            This was a town with a heavy ethnic population, a working class town, but well-run. No real problems except the rare homicidal maniac. Gang activity was low and under control.

            But inexplicably, “Mr. Smooth’s” idea of developing a beautiful friendship with the Chief was to commiserate with him about the burdens of policing … Mexicans. Except he couldn’t use the blunt, specific word.

            He started out riffing on “minorities.” The Chief sat there, stone-faced (he had, after all, plenty of minorities on the force). Then Smoothy shifted to “ethnics.” (I picked away at my salad, having nothing to contribute to the discussion. My crew was multi-ethnic, too.)

            Then old Smoothy moved onto “Beaner,” “Cholo” and finally “Zoot” – a term not heard since the 40’s.

            The atmosphere got chillier and chiller – and Smoothy more desperate to get some kind or relationship going. Unsuccessfully.

            Finally the Chief spoke up: “Why don’t you call them what they are? They’re Mexicans. They know they’re Mexicans. They like being called Mexican. I know that. My wife’s Mexican.”

            It is amazing what can happen at a little lunch.

            Some good, some bad. you never know.

            That’s why I would have set up a little luncheon with the Miami Fire Captain. Maybe he would have redeemed himself.

            Then, …. maybe not.

          • Yeah…I’ve done a few setups & stings myself….stamp related…….a few of us guys are like stamp vigilantes….someone cheating, not selling stuff as described and such….we go after them 🙂 Yup….we’re Nerds….

            Mexicans? 2 of my kids are married to Mexicans….my D-N-Laws mom and Dad came illegally…he was working on the alaskan pipeline….she was born in Alaska….Her folks got their green cards and became citizens…..That girl graduated Stanford with honors and a masters of Ed Admin….she’s now direct of curriculum for a school district….

            Son in law (I only have one Daughter….3 boys on the side) He’s Mexican also….folks story is about the same his Dad started a business…became quite successful……now son works for Dad……Before he and my Daughter married….I told him ….” You’re the first guys she’s been with who I haven’t beat the shit out of already…..or in the process of going there”……….10 years he hasn’t let me down yet 🙂

            My oldest son used to race for the LA sheriffs cycling team when he was in high school….been to their training center a few times for awards banquets for the kid…

            Remember the Bitter End West? 🙂

            OH….My ONLY Daughter?

          • PiranhaMom says:

            @MountainMan.

            Pat — Bitter End West on Santa Monica Blvd in West Hollywood? … Wow, a long time back! Same time as duck shooting south of Bombay Beach …. Niland … dove hunting in the lettuce fields north of Calexico every September 1st.

            My Lab probably knew your Lab!

          • Did a hike on the PCT….from Pine Valley on the 8…..up past Julian…..then on thru to Santa Ysabel….bout 40 miles….3 days…by myself.

            And then the Bitter End…Who was I kiddin’….not my kind of place…not my kind of people….just young and tryin’ to be cool..and TCOB……It was a nice club tho…..I’ve always preferred the outdoors tho..

            U mentioned Calexico…..U know where shell canyon is outside of Ocotillo?….My boys and I used to hunt for fossils there.

  45. Romaine says:

    loved it @bigwillie

  46. Big Willie says:

    The Foggen who Cried Wolf

    Foggen’s 911 call from inside prison.

    GZ:
    Hey I’ve had some break-ins in my cell and there’s a real suspicious guy. It’s D-Block.The best cell description I can give you is 9 feet by 5 feet and 7 feet high.

    This guy looks like he’s up to no good or he’s on drugs or something. It’s raining and he’s on the yard pumping iron, and looks like a fitness fanatic.

    911 dispatcher:
    OK, is he White, Black, or Hispanic?

    GZ:
    He looks black.

    911 dispatcher:
    Did you see what he was wearing?

    GZ:
    Yeah, a standard inmate uniform, blue chambray shirt, Blue and White trousers, web waist belt, and issue shoes. He’s here now … he’s just walking, smiling, licking his lips (like LL Cool J) and lifting weights.

    911 dispatcher:
    He’s just walking around the weight benches, and weights? OK.

    GZ:
    Now he’s staring at me.

    911 dispatcher:
    OK, you said that’s D-Block or C?

    GZ:
    That’s three-story cell-house, the main four blocks of the jail, A-Block, B-Block, C-Block, and D-Block.

    911 dispatcher:
    He’s near the D-Block now?

    GZ:
    Yeah, now he’s coming toward me. He’s got his hand in waist band.
    And he’s a black male.

    911 dispatcher:
    How old would you say he is?

    Zimmerman:
    He’s got three registry numbers on his shirt. About like his late forties.

    911 dispatcher:
    Late forties?

    GZ:
    Uh, huh.
    Something’s wrong with him. Yep, he’s coming to check me out.
    He’s got a weight in his hand. I don’t know what his deal is.

    911 dispatcher:
    Let me know if he does anything, OK?

    GZ:
    OK.

    911 dispatcher:
    We’ve got him on the wire. Just let me know if this guy does anything else.

    GZ:
    OK.

    These assholes. They always get away.

    When you come to the D-Block , you come straight in and you go left. Actually, you would go past the C-Block.

    911 dispatcher:
    OK, so it’s on the left hand side of the C-Block?

    GZ:
    Yeah. You go in straight through the entrance and then you would go left. You go straight in, don’t turn and make a left.

    He’s running.

    911 dispatcher:
    He’s running? Which way is he running?

    Zimmerman:
    Towards me!!! (call ends)

    911 dispatcher:
    Hello hello
    Is anybody out there? (Pink Floyd)

    Oh well, looks like another one got away…

  47. Malisha says:

    Probably the “yes give me SYG no don’t bother with SYG we want to combine SYG we want to do SYG after trial oh do we don’t we do we don’t we SYG oh pushme-pullyou SYG SYG SYG” dance is going to end up with some motions practice aiming to cause delay and possibly actually CAUSING delay.

    • Jun says:

      He’s pulling a Ng

      So bloodclot stupid

      How difficult is it to have a damn trial?

    • Big Willie says:

      @Malisha

      Lol! Thank you for articulating their actions so eloquently. I’ve been so baffled by all the

      1. Reacting to criticism with anger, shame, or humiliation

      2. Taking advantage of others to reach own goals

      3. Exaggerating own importance, achievements, and talents

      4. Imagining unrealistic fantasies of success, beauty, power, intelligence, or romance

      5. Requiring constant attention and positive reinforcement from others

      6. Becoming jealous easily

      7. Lacking empathy and disregarding the feelings of others

      8. Being obsessed with self

      9.Pursuing mainly selfish goals

      10. Trouble keeping healthy relationships

      11. Becoming easily hurt and rejected

      12. Setting goals that are unrealistic

      13. Wanting “the best” of everything

      14. Appearing unemotional

      Looks like I I just listed the symptoms of Narcissistic personality disorder.

  48. Trained Observer says:

    “Also Wednesday, the defense revealed that prosecutors last week deposed several witnesses close to Zimmerman, including his mother, father, brother, neighbors and supporters.” — Click Orlando

    Bet Gladazz, Boobles, Joonyar and the others found this to be a trying experience. If they were worried about what’s to come before, they must now really be on edge. Tick. Tock.

    • Any bets on how long it will be before he runs?

      • Trained Observer says:

        He must be thinking about it this very hot second. Next Tuesday is going to be a disaster of a day for him — and it’s looking like he has no option other than to show up in court —- unless he tries to something fancy.

        (Am guessing he’s under more than just GPS monitor watch by now.)

        • No SYG means he’ll be going to court on M2 charges…….with any escape by way of SYG long gone.

          I wonder if MOM has had a talk with him about the reality of his situation….he IS going down….Mom’s just gonna try and get him as little time as possible.

          I’d hate to think MOM’s blowin’ smoke up his ass….”We’ll see to it that you walk guy”

          • Lonnie Starr says:

            I think GZ is really convinced that if only he could talk to the jury and tell his side of the story he’d be allowed to walk. MOM has a duty to act like he believes in GZ’s innocence. So far MOM has been right to keep GZ away from any immunity hearing. He knows better than to put GZ on the stand at all, especially since he knows that GZ is capable of aggravated catastrophic stupidity. This is not something a lawyer wants to risk putting on the stand, less when combined with the prospect that the murder 2 defendant will be giggling, smiling and/or chuckling as he did on national tv.

          • ACS…….otherwise known as aggravated catastrophic stupidity…

            It affects millions in this country

            Fogen could be the poster child……Gods plan..bkah blah blah…..no regrets…blah blah blah…..carries it everywhere except work…..THAT alone, if in fact he had no legal CCW was an admission to another crime of his….on national TV…..

            I remember the looks on MOM’s face…”Will you STFU dumbass”

            HOODIES UP

        • Xena says:

          Maybe GZ will look like a lean, mean, lying machine when he comes to court. 🙂

        • cielo62 says:

          TO~ With a million dollar bond at stake, yes, I’d say there’s more than just a GPS ankle bracelet keeping tabs on him.

      • looolooo says:

        @mmp….. my guess is as soon as Tom Kruse delivers his HOVEROUND! Where he’ll get a modified van, is anybody’s guess. :-/

      • looolooo says:

        @mmp……… Nah, that wouldn’t work. Cause Fogenmeister is an even bigger ( pun intended) control freak than (space cadet) L Ron.

      • Maybe an escape would be just the thing to seal his fate. He would be found anywhere he went. When captured he would be returned to face trial on M2 charges as well as the flight charges. On all charges he would be found GUILTY.

    • looneydoone says:

      I wonder if the prosecution depo’d sister Grace C, and if not, why not ?

    • Two sides to a story says:

      Bobby mentioned having a long, hard day on twitter recently. Maybe that’s why.

  49. pat deadder says:

    Does anyone think the higher court will overturn JN’s ruling and allow the defense to depose Mr Crump.

  50. ay2z says:

    Brace yerselves people, tonight OS promises a video (presently the promised link ishanging in limbo, aka not working yet) of Jeff Wiener talking to FOX35 about the SYG hearing issue.

    Let me guess, Mark talked to FOX, FOX talked to Jeff’s boss, Jeff’s boss talked to Jeff, and Jeff got a boost from FOX.

    Or somethun.

  51. I don’t know if anyone mentioned this (my apologies if they had… I didn’t read any comments before posting) but Rush Limbaugh compared the Boston Bomber to Trayvon Martin! Very disheartening. Here’s two links: http://thinkprogress.org/media/2013/04/23/1910521/rush-limbaugh-compares-suspected-boston-bomber-to-trayvon-martin/ & http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/23/rush-limbaugh-dzhokhar-tsarnaev-trayvon-martin_n_3140938.html (This one has audio)!

    • LeaNder says:

      thanks, Marshalette, havent’t seen you around for a while.

      Absolutely interesting. I have made a comparable statement from the opposite perspective. Curious nitwit, looking in from the outside, that I am. To what extend could Fogen be a creature of the mental 911 universe.

      Admittedly I immediately feared we could catch the spiritual germs over here or it could waken our own old ghosts. Susan Sontag was right, but no one wanted to listen in the US. The way the Bush adminstration hijacked the event was beyond madness.

      Look at Anders Breivik’s manifesto. Could it be he caught the spiritual germ? His manifesto is a collection of both my spiritual enemies in the US and over here in Europe over the last decade.

      In the late nineteen century in the extreme German right used the coinage: “the Jews and their friends”, if you look at who Breivik targeted the new image of the enemy surfaces: “Immigrants and their friends”, the friends is the left of course.

      I have to admit that Fogen seemed to somehow fit into this larger US post 911 scenario from the very start, mentally. Once you offer a collective scapegoat, people feel free to add their own scapegoats. And in both the larger national scenario and Fogen’s own little business enterprise (alluding to a theory from Piranha Mom) security matters a lot.

      In both cases we have a threat scenario, in Fogen’s deluded mind the scapegoat were young black males, collectively. And that is what matters a lot.

      Now the big riddle to me is, how one can be liberal on one issue, but rigidly right on the other, Stereotypically repeating all the right’s arguments: media misrepresentation of TM and/or “poor” GZ, censoring almost every Fogen narrative skeptic, thus somehow enforcing the line to be followed, while over and over again attacking Benjamin Crump and celebrating with the mother the anniversary of Fogen’s arrest. I am still trying to wrap my head around that part of the larger American narrative. How exactly it works, or if it can be really reduced to gun rights or the fear one’s gun could be taken away. It could be part of the phenomenon but it does not completely explain it, it feels to me. So is it some type of covert liberal racism?

      Last but not least. I don’t think we will be ever able to completely control every human being on earth. But the larger Islamaphobia or for that matter the more hidden racism should not be kindled ever, since it inspires, just as it denigrates people collectively way beyond their own ability to represent themselves, and thus may well create what it claims to fight.

      In Germany we are facing a high profile case that will be finally on trial in May, concerning a series of attacks against Turkish Germans by a neo-Nazi-cell for about a decade, without anybody connecting the dots. The Islamophobes both American and European did in fact inspire Breivik which can be clearly seen from his manifesto. Our big Turkish community is Muslim mainly, as you may have guessed.

      So no, I am not really surprised that the American right connects these matters, really. I do too from the opposite perspective.

      Sorry, I couldn’t help. Thanks again. 😉

    • LeaNder says:

      Well, celebrate may not be the word I wanted:

      and celebrating with the mother the anniversary of Fogen’s arrest.

      What I wanted was: commemorate, maybe? It just slipped my mind at that point.

      • Deborah says:

        @LeaNder:

        What do you expect from Rush Fatman the drug addict, pill popping racist who is so envious of President Obama, he can’t even function without demeaning the President on a daily basis! Chile pleeese! They have called Trayvon everything under the sun but his given name! They have compared Trayvon to Pol Pot, Hitler and idi Amin! The boy never hurt anyone in his life but yet, they call him names only because he is black and racists despise blacks for no other reason! The white young men who set off those bombs are pieces of scum but yet, they are not called names and their crimes are not attributed to the color of their skin. How can you compare what they did, to Trayvon Martin who has never killed anyone? America is one sick hypocritical country IMO! other countries look at us and laugh at our hypocrisy. They see how we treat our President, and how we treat minority citizens but yet, America wants to state that this is the greatest country in the world, and we want to tell other countries how to goven, but we cannot even get along with one another in this country!!! SMH!

        I cannot imagine the grief of the Martin family to have to endure the hatred in regard to their son and all because of his skin color. It is enough to have lost their son, and to hear their innocent boy denigrated and dehumanized by racist strangers?? SMH. I just hope that they receive justice and are vindicated! I prray to god daily for that.

        Trayvon Martin’s parents send message to family of boy killed at Boston Marathon | News – Home

        Trayvon Martin’s parents send message to family of boy killed at Boston Marathon | News – Home

        • LeaNder says:

          @Deborah

          America is one sick hypocritical country IMO! other countries look at us and laugh at our hypocrisy.

          It’s a human fallacy, you will find it everywhere. Since America is a big country, you can meet just as many wonderful people as hypocrites. I prefer to concentrate on the wonderful side of the larger mix. At least as much as possible without ignoring reality.

          I also prefer to look at myself or my own country with this type of statements. The main problem may well be that America is powerful and some people manage to use it to their own advantage, often on others backs. …

          I have to admit that I discovered a “sleeper racist” in my own family, not too long ago. A cousin. So, believe me, it hit uncomfortably close to home.

          I watched him slowly drift from left to right over the last decades. He claims he was fooled by the left, which is slightly hilarious, considering his own personal and professional problems over the decades. They are his main scapegoats, but many many more seem to flow from this basic one.

          Once upon a time he was a highly paid tax inspector and catapulted himself out of his job by refusing to sign the rather dubious final test report for a very influential client. Had he simply signed it, he would be much better of now, no doubt. Mind you, he lost his job, but he ultimately won his lawsuit and the dubious affair become public knowledge, at least in insider circles. But he also became unemployable in the more “polite parts” of society, or the power brokers in his business where the big money is.

          He then more or less unwillingly decided to start his own business and had to deal with much “smaller” clients not the power players that had been his clients before. His background is banking, later he added a degree in national or political economics. Over here politcal and business econmics are two different fields, the one he studied are the generalist, so he no doubt he would have needed to improve his knowledge in his changed field. So far nobody in my family seems to have been able to lure these type of comments out of him. Which apparently he didn’t. Over the years he became more and more eccentric.

          It is my suspicion that he simply does not manage to accept his earlier decisions and live with them, so now he has to find scapegoats that he ultimately can blame. Beyond the “left” that supposedly deceived him by influencing his way of thinking in his earlier life, his top argument, he seems to steadily increase the scapegoats by picking up on standard right wing lore as he moves along. E.g. there are misogynistic traits he developed over his personal history, but I’ll leave that out.

          During the last phone call I had with him that led to his pet topic, media, which supposedly is dominated by the left too, he committed a huge error. Ironically he suddenly mentioned an interview with Hjalmar Schacht, he had once seen. Was he aware that quite possibly Schacht’s PR spokesperson had carefully studied the questions and decided which could be asked? I inquired. Could that possibly have influencd his impression?

          To understand how that led to an exchange that got more and more heated with me finally hanging up when it turned on reparations for Israel allededly paid out of his pension fund. [He never left the state pension fund, which is ultimately unusual for business men, even over here.] you have to watch this: Hitler’s Bankers.

          His is only one of many roads to bigotry or hypocricy, I think. You can jump on the bandwagon or leave it, but ultimately you have to accept your own decisions and live with them and move on. If you don’t, diverse scapegoat may well enter your mental universe. German history shows the same basic scenario on a national level, the Nazis seized the idea on a big scale. Germany did not cause it’s own problems with the Prussian king starting WWI in alliance with Austria, others had to be found that were guilty, that caused all this. I am sure you know the rest.

          • So I take it you’re German?……My area of specialization in philately is Germany…..from the early states up to the present….I find German history fascinating, especially the hyper inflation period….Presently working on a collection of hyper inflation covers (envelopes) showing every rate change from 1919 thru Dec. 1923.

          • LeaNder says:

            I am aware of the hyperinflation, Pat, not only from family lore. I am also aware of the larger historical complexities, and not so wise decisions and politics by other European nations, which made things worse. I am also aware of the completely different approach by the US, after something much worse: WWII.

            But when the Nazis took over the Hyperinflation was to a large extend over. The real problem, and no I am no economist seems to have been the later austerity program. From the little I know the US dealt more wisely with the problem at least at the time.

            I also don’t consider Hjalmar Schacht uniquely evil. He foresaw the problems created by financing WWI with borrowed money.

            The problem I have with him is that he did not see what money in the hands of the Nazis would ultimately mean, no democracy anymore mind you, or what the real intention behind the autobahn (highway) project was, which he helped to finance. No doubt he was not alone in supporting Hitler’s rise and ultimate gain of power. And he is surely wasn’t the worst.

            That wasn’t an issue in our discussion. His completely uncritical position towards Schacht was. He may know much more about economics than I do, but I may know much more about the not only economical history than he does.

            For the record, I am critical concerning the delivery and/or donation of submarines to Israel, especially when they are capable of using atomic weapons. I also consider Israel’s treatment of the Palestinians a huge problem. So uncritical view of Israel’s no matter what wasn’t the issue either. It’s a big irony of history that the worlds only “Jewish state” is an ethnic nationalism now, or a political theocracy in a modern dress:.A neo-theocracy?

            The issue was the unreflected recourse to ultimately dangerous ideologies, that surface more and more lately. Ideologies I admittedly fear.

          • I agree with you on the financing….the U.S. borrows money from China to finance our wars….and to supply the money the U.S. sends out in foreign aid to other countries, which without a doubt will never be repaid to the U.S.

            A bit of German history you may not know……..hitler received a royalty for every stamp issued with his image on it

            Israel? touchy subject as I’ve been labeled an anti Semitic for my views…..even tho I have friends in Israel, and have nothing against Jews or the Jewish faith. One in fact…a British Jew that works as a maintenance man on a kibbutz….over 12 years we’ve been friends by way of stamps and the internet….he knows he’s always welcome at my place should he ever come to the States

            My problem is…….they took what used to be Palestine, under British domination at the time by acts of terror…..claiming that “god” gave them this land which gives them rights to it…..and the U.S. supports this.

            If such is the case…..then the ENTIRE United States should be given back to the Native Americans…….as their “god” “gods” gave it to them long before the white man showed up..

            Anything else would be hypocritical

          • LeaNder says:

            A bit of German history you may not know……..hitler received a royalty for every stamp issued with his image on it

            No, I didn’t know. But I am not surprised either. Something you may not know, Hitler never paid a penny tax. Initially the clerks tried it, but after a while they seem to have given up. His national „socialism“ didn’t go that far, as to pay taxes too. Oh, and every German couple that married had to be given a copy of his book, which the state of course had to pay him for. That was a big source of his income all completely tax free income. 😉

          • racerrodig says:

            Gotta love that “Buy my book or I’ll have the Gestaop arrest you and your family and you’ll all end up in a concentration camp” mentality. And there are those who still say Hitler was just “misunderstood”

          • Race…..not saying that any of it was or is good…

            I do have to laugh at the hypocrisy of the British…….When the war started the British controlled at least a third of the world by force of arms….India, Iraq, Palestine, Egypt etc.

            Yet when hitler goes after them they cry foul….like it’s OK if we subjugate countries of other races…….BUT you’re not allowed to do it to other white European countries. WTF?

            BTW…….U know why the French planted so many trees?

            The Germans like marching in the shade…. 🙂

          • racerrodig says:

            That’s a pretty accurate joke. Well the British conquered all that territory before the 20th Century for the most part and I guess since they thought it was “…..well in the past…” nobody would notice the hypocrisy….kind of like the American Indians.

            And they laud Custer as a hero…..

          • Sherman also…..unless you’re a Southerner

          • racerrodig says:

            Yep…..

          • Race….have you read Sun Tzu’s “Art of War”?………it’s not blood and guts….1,000 ways to kill or any such……Sun Tzu’s whole concept was to be able to defeat an enemy WITHOUT fighting…

            Matter of fact…Sun Tzu is part of the curriculum in some schools for an MBA degree!!!!!!!!

          • racerrodig says:

            I’ve only read excerpts.

          • LeaNder says:

            well, racer, somehow like buy my book via your taxes which I do not need to pay. But elder people told me, that no one dared to not pick up the “present”. Just in case the wrong person watched.

            I am sure the authoritarian mindset love the idea of a leader. In England a pub owner once asked my friends to tell me he would invite me to his “interiors”. It was a real hall of adoration. Amazing scene.

          • LeaNder says:

            well, racer, somehow like buy my book via your taxes which I do not need to pay. But elder people told me, that no one dared to not pick up the “present”. Just in case the wrong person watched.

            I am sure the authoritarian mindset love the idea of a leader. In England a pub owner once asked my friends to tell me he would invite me to his “interiors”. It was a real hall of adoration. Amazing scene.

          • Lonnie Starr says:

            Just what some clerk needs, to be known as the guy who p’d off Hitler. You better believe they gave up. They probably told him those tax payment requests went out automatically, before they had a chance to prevent it. Told Hitler to ignore it. The people close to him knew he was out of his gourd, but their station depended on him, so what could they do? “Cut their own throats” to save the nation? Who do dat?

          • racerrodig says:

            And it wasn’t until the 60’s when people started talking about all the assassination attempts and talk…..like that makes them hero’s after the fact.

          • google operation paperclip

          • racerrodig says:

            Know all about it……WWII history buff here remember……nothing like skating because you’re a scientist ‘n such.

          • OK…some WWII postal history….the German post offices gave out what were called “sign of life” cards with free postage after a city was bombed so the survivors could contact friends and relitives to say they were OK….I have a few of them 🙂

          • racerrodig says:

            My grandfather mentioned something about that as he had family still in “…the old Country…” He was the 1st American born on my dad’s side and spoke fluent German…..he loathed what happened and those who allowed the Nazi’s to get that far.

            My grandfather looked exactly like Sgt. Shultz (John Banner) Exactly……

          • cielo62 says:

            Racer~ Well, at least you didn’t have to READ it! No quiz to pass at the end of each chapter.

          • racerrodig says:

            Thank God nobody ever said “There will be a test”

            If I lived back then & there I’d pride myself of giving the finger to the book every morning.

          • IRC hitler had a law passed after coming to power that removed his liability for all the back taxes he owed.

          • LeaNder says:

            I could check that. I find my way around the volumes of “third reich” laws here in the juridical seminary quite easily meanwhile. They are a bit hidden. But strictly I doubt he did. After all once in power, he was the law.

          • LeaNder says:

            I could check that. I find my way around the volumes of “third reich” laws here in the juridical seminary quite easily meanwhile. They are a bit hidden. But strictly I doubt he did. After all once in power, he was the law.

          • LeaNder says:

            I could check that. I find my way around the volumes of “third reich” laws here in the juridical seminary quite easily meanwhile. They are a bit hidden. But strictly I doubt he did. After all once in power, he was the law.

          • LeaNder says:

            A bit of German history you may not know……..hitler received a royalty for every stamp issued with his image on it

            No, I didn’t know. But I am not surprised either. Something you may not know, Hitler never paid a penny tax. Initially the clerks tried it, but after a while they seem to have given up. His national „socialism“ didn’t go that far, as to pay taxes too. Oh, and every German couple that married had to be given a copy of his book, which the state of course had to pay him for. That was a big source of his income all completely tax free income. 😉

          • Deborah says:

            @Mountainmanpat:

            Yes, I know Mountain it is not everyone in America who thinks and believes like the racist do. I only have to read and look at the wonderful family on Professor Leatherman’s blog and on HP to see that we have some beautiful people on this earth who are fighting for truth and justice and will put their lives on the line for others. Mountain, I served in the U.S. Army, and fought for this country and I see myself and my fellow black americans still being demeaned and dehumanized and treated like animals. I was not treated like an animal in Germany or Japan, but here in the U.S. is another story!

            Trayvon is called a thug, and being castigated for being suspended from school, amongst other made up lies about him like it is grounds for him to be murdered?? Trayvon could never be a typical teenager, who does typical teenage things like teens of every ethnic goup does? He had to be some brutish menacing thug due to his black skin. Fogen knew that he could make up the lie about Tray attacking him because he knew how blacks are perceived in this country, as criminally inclined thugs, prone to violence. Even if they are 5 years old. it is so easy for racist people to believe those lies because that is how blacks are depicted in America. What is even more demoralizing is the fact that the the family had to DEMAND an investigation because local law enforcement’s Chief, refused to take any action!! Fogen and his family know how racist some in America are, from law enforcement to the government, and he used that perception and he perpetuated it big time and almost got away with it too, if it wasn’t for the protests by the good people of this country.

            Thanks for your post. It is very appreciated.

          • One thing you may have seen in some of my other posts……whatever color a man wearing green is……….they all bleed red.

            I was Army too….Were you a career soldier?….I have a friend in Germany…..25 years in the U.S. Army…and retired to Germany……He keeps telling me should I ever come to visit he’ll take me to one of the sex clubs in Berlin 🙂

            BTW….I want a letter addressed to me postmarked from Fucking Austria….there is a town by that name…..from what I’ve read….British tourists like to have pictures of them having sex under the sign….while Americans steal the sign 😐

            A map to the town 🙂

            http://images.search.yahoo.com/images/view;_ylt=A2KJke6cKXxR61YA0zCJzbkF;_ylu=X3oDMTBlMTQ4cGxyBHNlYwNzcgRzbGsDaW1n?back=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.search.yahoo.com%2Fsearch%2Fimages%3Fp%3Dfucking%2Baustria%26save%3D0%26fr%3Dchr-greentree_ff%26fr2%3Dpiv-web%26tab%3Dorganic%26ri%3D35&w=444&h=281&imgurl=www.vincentchow.net%2Fimages%2Ffucking-map.JPG&rurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vincentchow.net%2F968%2Ffucking-austria&size=19.2KB&name=%3Cb%3EFucking%3C%2Fb%3E%2C+%3Cb%3EAustria%3C%2Fb%3E&p=fucking+austria&oid=3a6258b5c48d536c509f7576bb5eea5e&fr2=piv-web&fr=chr-greentree_ff&tt=%3Cb%3EFucking%3C%2Fb%3E%2C+%3Cb%3EAustria%3C%2Fb%3E&b=31&ni=140&no=35&ts=&tab=organic&sigr=11e2lmo36&sigb=13n45c0op&sigi=11aeqkot0&.crumb=kms8Z1fDYo6&fr=chr-greentree_ff

            This country can never be united as long as divisions are, can, and will be created…..Trayvon being an example.

            HOODIES UP

  52. Xena says:

    To use a poker analogy, folding your hand at the last minute by waiving the hearing establishes that you were bluffing when you kept insisting that you had a winning hand.

  53. colin black says:

    kllypyn says:

    April 24, 2013 at 8:48 pm

    The autopsy report. no bruising or swelling to the fingers or knuckles just a tiny abrasion on his ring finger. the wound track direct front to back.1inch left of midline half inch below the nipple. The holes in his shirts are in the upper chest,near his shoulder. They show stearlate tearing which shows the shirts were stretched when the bullet tore into them.

    Zimmerman was holding onto Trayvon’s shirts when he killed him. Trayvon never touched him. But if he had he would have been within his rights to do so. We teach our kids to run or defend themselves. Trayvon ran Zimmerman instead of going back to his truck decided to hunt for him after he disappeared into the darkness. He said “call me and i’ll tell you where i’m at.

    ” Despite his claims to the contrary he was not going back to his truck. He said he was able to unholster his weapon aim and fire into Trayvon’s chest,while Trayvon was mounted on him beating him. His gun was on his waist at his right rear hip,he was laying on it

    .He’s going to have to explain how he got his gun. the only way he could getb his gun like he claims is if he knocked Trayvon off stood up pulled his gun and killed trayvon,which would negate his self defense claim.(there is no self defense when you kill an unarmed person anyway,especially a kid.) During a confrontation that lasted less than a minute,he said trayvon repeatedly slammed his head into the sidewalk for nearly a minute while at the same time TRAYVON TRIED TO SMOTHER HIM WHILE ALSO PUNCHING HIM IN THE FACE 30-40 TIMES.

    He is going to have to explain. How would Trayvon have done that? Did he grow an extra set of arms? Was Trayvon super kid? He is going to have to explain why he only had scratches. no facial bruising no busted lips and of course despite his claims no broken nose and no black eyes

    . You do not escape with just scratches when you are punched in the face like he claims.About Those injuries. I have enlarged those photos of scratches on his face. They are consistent with the type of scratches you get from running into tree branches or stumbling into bushes.

    They are not the injuries you get from someones fist slammimng into your face. Notice whats missing in those pictures. There is no swelling on his nose. It’s amost pristine except for a couple of scratches

    . Even a closed fracture will have swelling which will not disappear less than an hour later. There is no facial swelling. There is no busted lips. AND NO BLACK EYES.Having injuries is not an indication he was attacked it just shows he was in an altercation.

    Those injuries on the back of his head. One round puncture wound and an inch long cut.THOSE ARE NOT THE INJURIES YOU GET FROM REPEATEDLY BEING SLAMMED INTO A SIDEWALK. HE GOTN YTHOSE FROM A METAL OBJECT. HE DID NOT GET THOSE INJURIES FROM A SIDE WALK.

    Trayvon made no effort to defend himself at all during the confrontation that ended his life. He simply tried to escape. In fact he never touched Zimmerman.If Trayvon could have gottne away he would never have needed to scream at all. ther evidence which cetain people chose to ignore while making crap up shows trayvon being held by his shirts when he was murdered.again you can’t claim self defense when you prevent the escape of the person you kill. the only way trayvon could have done what Zimmerman claims is if he couldn’t fight back

    .Or he just laid there and let trayvon beat him.Obviously that didn’t happen. Zimmerman was not disabled in anyway. His injuries were less than minor. all he had to do was wait and let the police handle it. If he had Trayvon would at this time be looking forward to graduating.Instead he lays in a crypt never to walk the earth agin while the man who murdered him tries to tarnish his memory in an effort to get away with killing him.

    THERE IS NEVER A JUSTIFICATION FOR KILLING A TERRIFIED KID WHO HAD NO WEAPONS WHILE HE BEGS FOR HIS LIFE. THERE IS NEVER A JUSTIFICATION FOR KILLING A TERRIFIED KID AFTER HE WAS INTERROGATED AND TERRORIZED. A KID WHO NEVER DID ANY HARM TO ANYONE. DURING THE TRIAL THE WHOLE WORLD WILL HEAR HIS CRIES,BECAUSE THE PROSECUTION WILL HAVE THE UNREDACTED AND ENHANCED 911 CALL. TRAYVON’S FRIENDS WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. HIS FAMILY WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. HIS NEIGHBORS WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. THE PRINCIPAL AT HIS SCHOOL WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. THE WHOLE WILL HE IS THE SCUM BAG I HAVE COME TO DESPISE. THE WORLD WILL HEAR NOT JUST TRAYVON BUT EVERYTHING THAT WAS SAID DURING THOSE FINAL SECONDS OF TRAYVON’S LIFE. I GUARANTEE THERE WILL NOT BE A DRY EYE IN THAT COURTROOM WHEN THOSE SCREAMS ABRUPTLY STOP WITH THAT GUN SHOT.

    Trayvon was never a thug. He was never a gang memeber he was never a rapist he was never a drug dealer he was just a kid who screwed up a few times like the rest of us. He was a good kid who never hurt anyone. Who did not deserve to be murdered. Zimmerman is a violent man who should have went to prison years ago. It was only a matter of time before he killed someone if it hadn’t been Trayvon it would have been someone else.

  54. ay2z says:

    What is the Shimmy?

    And the elephant in the room?

  55. kllypyn says:

    A re post to correct typos. The autopsy report. no bruising or swelling to the fingers or knuckles just a tiny abrasion on his ring finger. the wound track direct front to back.1inch left of midline half inch below the nipple. The holes in his shirts are in the upper chest,near his shoulder. They show stearlate tearing which shows the shirts were stretched when the bullet tore into them. Zimmerman was holding onto Trayvon’s shirts when he killed him. Trayvon never touched him. But if he had he would have been within his rights to do so. We teach our kids to run or defend themselves. Trayvon ran Zimmerman instead of going back to his truck decided to hunt for him after he disappeared into the darkness. He said “call me and i’ll tell you where i’m at.” Despite his claims to the contrary he was not going back to his truck. He said he was able to unholster his weapon aim and fire into Trayvon’s chest,while Trayvon was mounted on him beating him. His gun was on his waist at his right rear hip,he was laying on it.He’s going to have to explain how he got his gun. the only way he could get his gun like he claims is if he knocked Trayvon off stood up pulled his gun and killed trayvon,which would negate his self defense claim.(there is no self defense when you kill an unarmed person anyway,especially a kid.) During a confrontation that lasted less than a minute,he said trayvon repeatedly slammed his head into the sidewalk for nearly a minute while at the same time TRAYVON TRIED TO SMOTHER HIM WHILE ALSO PUNCHING HIM IN THE FACE 30-40 TIMES. He is going to have to explain. How would Trayvon have done that? Did he grow an extra set of arms? Was Trayvon super kid? He is going to have to explain why he only had scratches. no facial bruising no busted lips and of course despite his claims no broken nose and no black eyes. You do not escape with just scratches when you are punched in the face like he claims.About Those injuries. I have enlarged those photos of scratches on his face. They are consistent with the type of scratches you get from running into tree branches or stumbling into bushes. They are not the injuries you get from someones fist slammimng into your face. Notice whats missing in those pictures. There is no swelling on his nose. It’s amost pristine except for a couple of scratches. Even a closed fracture will have swelling which will not disappear less than an hour later. There is no facial swelling. There is no busted lips. AND NO BLACK EYES. Having injuries is not an indication he was attacked it just shows he was in an altercation. Those injuries on the back of his head. One round puncture wound and an inch long cut.THOSE ARE NOT THE INJURIES YOU GET FROM REPEATEDLY BEING SLAMMED INTO A SIDEWALK. HE GOT THOSE FROM A METAL OBJECT. HE DID NOT GET THOSE INJURIES FROM A SIDEWALK. Trayvon made no effort to defend himself at all during the confrontation that ended his life. He simply tried to escape. In fact he never touched Zimmerman.If Trayvon could have gotten away he would never have needed to scream at all. the evidence which cetain people chose to ignore while making crap up,shows Trayvon being held by his shirts when he was murdered.again you can’t claim self defense when you prevent the escape of the person you kill. the only way trayvon could have done what Zimmerman claims is if he couldn’t fight back.Or he just laid there and let trayvon beat him.Obviously that didn’t happen. Zimmerman was not disabled in anyway. His injuries were less than minor. all he had to do was wait and let the police handle it. If he had Trayvon would at this time be looking forward to graduating.Instead he lays in a crypt never to walk the earth agin while the man who murdered him tries to tarnish his memory in an effort to get away with killing him. THERE IS NEVER A JUSTIFICATION FOR KILLING A TERRIFIED KID WHO HAD NO WEAPONS WHILE HE BEGS FOR HIS LIFE. THERE IS NEVER A JUSTIFICATION FOR KILLING A TERRIFIED KID AFTER HE WAS INTERROGATED AND TERRORIZED. A KID WHO NEVER DID ANY HARM TO ANYONE. DURING THE TRIAL THE WHOLE WORLD WILL HEAR HIS CRIES,BECAUSE THE PROSECUTION WILL HAVE THE UNREDACTED AND ENHANCED 911 CALL. TRAYVON’S FRIENDS WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. HIS FAMILY WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. HIS NEIGHBORS WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. THE PRINCIPAL AT HIS SCHOOL WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. THE WHOLE WORLD WILL KNOW ZIMMERMAN IS THE SCUM BAG I HAVE COME TO DESPISE. THE WORLD WILL HEAR NOT JUST TRAYVON BUT EVERYTHING THAT WAS SAID DURING THOSE FINAL SECONDS OF TRAYVON’S LIFE. I GUARANTEE THERE WILL NOT BE A DRY EYE IN THAT COURTROOM WHEN THOSE SCREAMS ABRUPTLY STOP WITH THAT GUN SHOT. Trayvon was never a thug. He was never a gang memeber he was never a rapist he was never a drug dealer he was just a kid who screwed up a few times like the rest of us. He was a good kid who never hurt anyone. Who did not deserve to be murdered. Zimmerman is a violent man who should have went to prison years ago. It was only a matter of time before he killed someone if it hadn’t been trayvon it would have been someone else.

  56. kllypyn says:

    Why doesn’t it post like i wrote it?

    • colin black says:

      Just write a sentance and hit the key that says enter on the right of your keyboard like this
      And it moves your line or sentance down one space.
      Hit enter twice like this

      And moves down 2 spaces.

      3x 3 spaces

      4x

      5x an so thats how you down shift to create paragrphs
      Just try it
      Write a sentance hit enter twice an write another sentance an post it will apear as broken spaced up.

      An then you know how to write in paragaphs simples

  57. kllypyn says:

    The autopsy report. no bruising or swelling to the fingers or knuckles just a tiny abrasion on his ring finger. the wound track direct front to back.1inch left of midline half inch below the nipple. The holes in his shirts are in the upper chest,near his shoulder. They show stearlate tearing which shows the shirts were stretched when the bullet tore into them. Zimmerman was holding onto Trayvon’s shirts when he killed him. Trayvon never touched him. But if he had he would have been within his rights to do so. We teach our kids to run or defend themselves. Trayvon ran Zimmerman instead of going back to his truck decided to hunt for him after he disappeared into the darkness. He said “call me and i’ll tell you where i’m at.” Despite his claims to the contrary he was not going back to his truck. He said he was able to unholster his weapon aim and fire into Trayvon’s chest,while Trayvon was mounted on him beating him. His gun was on his waist at his right rear hip,he was laying on it.He’s going to have to explain how he got his gun. the only way he could getb his gun like he claims is if he knocked Trayvon off stood up pulled his gun and killed trayvon,which would negate his self defense claim.(there is no self defense when you kill an unarmed person anyway,especially a kid.) During a confrontation that lasted less than a minute,he said trayvon repeatedly slammed his head into the sidewalk for nearly a minute while at the same time TRAYVON TRIED TO SMOTHER HIM WHILE ALSO PUNCHING HIM IN THE FACE 30-40 TIMES. He is going to have to explain. How would Trayvon have done that? Did he grow an extra set of arms? Was Trayvon super kid? He is going to have to explain why he only had scratches. no facial bruising no busted lips and of course despite his claims no broken nose and no black eyes. You do not escape with just scratches when you are punched in the face like he claims.About Those injuries. I have enlarged those photos of scratches on his face. They are consistent with the type of scratches you get from running into tree branches or stumbling into bushes. They are not the injuries you get from someones fist slammimng into your face. Notice whats missing in those pictures. There is no swelling on his nose. It’s amost pristine except for a couple of scratches. Even a closed fracture will have swelling which will not disappear less than an hour later. There is no facial swelling. There is no busted lips. AND NO BLACK EYES.Having injuries is not an indication he was attacked it just shows he was in an altercation. Those injuries on the back of his head. One round puncture wound and an inch long cut.THOSE ARE NOT THE INJURIES YOU GET FROM REPEATEDLY BEING SLAMMED INTO A SIDEWALK. HE GOTN YTHOSE FROM A METAL OBJECT. HE DID NOT GET THOSE INJURIES FROM A SIDE WALK. Trayvon made no effort to defend himself at all during the confrontation that ended his life. He simply tried to escape. In fact he never touched Zimmerman.If Trayvon could have gottne away he would never have needed to scream at all. ther evidence which cetain people chose to ignore while making crap up shows trayvon being held by his shirts when he was murdered.again you can’t claim self defense when you prevent the escape of the person you kill. the only way trayvon could have done what Zimmerman claims is if he couldn’t fight back.Or he just laid there and let trayvon beat him.Obviously that didn’t happen. Zimmerman was not disabled in anyway. His injuries were less than minor. all he had to do was wait and let the police handle it. If he had Trayvon would at this time be looking forward to graduating.Instead he lays in a crypt never to walk the earth agin while the man who murdered him tries to tarnish his memory in an effort to get away with killing him. THERE IS NEVER A JUSTIFICATION FOR KILLING A TERRIFIED KID WHO HAD NO WEAPONS WHILE HE BEGS FOR HIS LIFE. THERE IS NEVER A JUSTIFICATION FOR KILLING A TERRIFIED KID AFTER HE WAS INTERROGATED AND TERRORIZED. A KID WHO NEVER DID ANY HARM TO ANYONE. DURING THE TRIAL THE WHOLE WORLD WILL HEAR HIS CRIES,BECAUSE THE PROSECUTION WILL HAVE THE UNREDACTED AND ENHANCED 911 CALL. TRAYVON’S FRIENDS WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. HIS FAMILY WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. HIS NEIGHBORS WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. THE PRINCIPAL AT HIS SCHOOL WILL HEAR HIS SCREAMS. THE WHOLE WILL HE IS THE SCUM BAG I HAVE COME TO DESPISE. THE WORLD WILL HEAR NOT JUST TRAYVON BUT EVERYTHING THAT WAS SAID DURING THOSE FINAL SECONDS OF TRAYVON’S LIFE. I GUARANTEE THERE WILL NOT BE A DRY EYE IN THAT COURTROOM WHEN THOSE SCREAMS ABRUPTLY STOP WITH THAT GUN SHOT. Trayvon was never a thug. He was never a gang memeber he was never a rapist he was never a drug dealer he was just a kid who screwed up a few times like the rest of us. He was a good kid who never hurt anyone. Who did not deserve to be murdered. Zimmerman is a violent man who should have went to prison years ago. It was only a matter of time before he killed someone if it hadn’t been Trayvon it would have been someone else.

    • Remember also that this NHW “captain” was “patrolling” while armed with a gun that wasn’t his…..and had no right to legally carry….ANYWHERE……

    • ladystclaire says:

      @Kelly, Fogen did indeed murder this kid and , there was no self defense on his side. Since when do you chase after someone by vehicle and then on foot, start an altercation, shoot and kill the very person who YOU followed and scream self defence. This POS has been lying from the word go and , his chickens are coming home to roost real soon. These bigoted racist have got their day coming. They have made up all kinds of lies about this dead child. They are only showing the rest of us and the world, just how ignorant some people in this country can really be. BTW, someone over at HP is using Cherokee Native’s name to spew their racist hate and ignorance. The way Trayvon and his family have been mistreated by some in this country really make me cry for them. They do not in any way deserve what these IMBECILES have been doing to them.

      • pat deadder says:

        ladystclaire There are people at the complex who say fogen drove around at night with his lights off and he patrolled late at night with his flashlight.He was also out of his truck with his flashlight at the clubhouse that night stalking Trayvon.This murder was pre planned imho.

  58. ay2z says:

    O’mara might be playing for time until the 5th comes down with it’s decision on the writ. If successful, they could try to go after Judge Nelson.

    Bernie got his motion into the file a day early and plenty of time for Judge NElson to s=decide by Monday.

    Still wondering about ‘Witness V’.

    V for Victory? Shellie Zimmerman is a candidate for an unnamed family witness too.

  59. colin black says:

    M O M
    Never intended to have a S Y G Imunitty hearing period.As the Prof states in the article he never had a chance .
    Not on cross with foggagges ever changeing never ending story.

    But he couldnt say this with out affectind donations from the raceists an gun nuts.

    Although he couldnt help major leakage an broadcasted the fact there would be no immunity hearing to those whom listened.
    He said things like there will be no S Y G Hearing for my client.

    As its for traditinal self defence as he couldnt retreat be cause he was on his back.

    Translation I cant put this wingnut on the stand as the prosecuter will knock him out cold.

    Or S YG Doesnt apply to my client I will be argueing more on the lines of traditinal self defence.Although under the umbrella of a S Y G hearing.

    Translation I cant go ahead with S Y G Im totally exposed as is my client an BERNIE will piss on us both from a great hight.

    I knew way back then as did many more that there would be no stand your ground hearing.
    Foggaggge couldnt even stan in the stand for a few minutes at the forst bail bond lie fest.
    Without Bernie tieing him in knots an haveing him contradict himsef from one sentance to the next.

    An that was a few minutes can you imagine him on the stand under direct from Bernie for Days .
    An also under cross from Bernie possably for days.

    I think he will strugle even under questioning from his own lawers never mind the States.

  60. pat deadder says:

    Did anyone see LLMP’S video of fogen drawing his gun with his right hand apparently the gun would have been upsidedown because it was a left handed holster.As well is it possible fogen hit his head when he flew out of the truck.If only the SPD had checked the vehicle.Ialso don’t believe he got on Trayvon after he murdered him he was always on top he just had to make up that story because he knew people saw him on top.He shot the poor child and without getting up turned him over imho.Jesus how callous is this poor excuse for a human being.

    • ay2z says:

      And hold that thought while you ponder this one……

    • Two sides to a story says:

      It’s been established pretty much that the gun wasn’t carried backwards and that Fogen did not crossdraw.

      • amsterdam1234 says:

        Where did you get that it has been established that the gun wasn’t carried backwards?

        I don’t know much about guns, but I believe the holster GZ was wearing, would’ve meant the gun was backwards if carried inside the waistband on his right side.
        MO gives a very detailed explanation about how GZ turned his gun after he gets it out of the holster. MO would’ve known how GZ carried his gun.

        I may be wrong, but I haven’t seen anything that shows GZ was not wearing the grip facing forward.

        • PiranhaMom says:

          @~Amsterdam-

          We had a lot of fun with the upside-down gun for a number of weeks, but it was established roughly nine months or so ago that the holster is adaptable and that Zimmerman, who shoots right-handed (as most lefties do – usually, though, two-handed with knees bent) could reach back and draw correctly.

          Don’t ask me to go back and look it up for you. Some of these “editions” on Fred Leatherman’s site draw over 1,000 e-mails. I have no way of archiving each point. I don’t know anyone who has. It is not a “timeline” issue that Lonnie maintains so scrupulously.

          If you really want to find it, go back to March 2012 in the site archives here and start reading — everything. It’s a great review if you have the time to devote to it. Eventually, you’ll find it.

          Zimmerman used his left (dominant) hand to grab Trayvon by the shirts (both the hoodie and the under-sweatshirt) to detain him, and to steady the victim to carefully place his shot, for the precise kill, and to avoid his adjacent, grasping hand. That evidence – the bullet holes in the shirts – matching each other, but askew from the wound in Trayvon’s torso – was established by forensic evidence. You’ll find that written up September 23, 2012 – “What does Zimmerman’s Blood Tell us?”

          Zimmerman shot with his right hand. He did not cross-draw.
          I don’t think you’ll find Mark Osterman the expert you want to rely on.

        • cielo62 says:

          Amsterdam- what do you mean by backwards or forwards? Towards the small of the back or facing out towards the hip? Based on the gun holder, the grip would have to face the small of the back, making it even less likely that he could use his right hand to draw it while on his back.

          Sent from my iPod

      • amsterdam1234 says:

        @piranhamom

        I have no doubt that GZ shot Trayvon with his right hand, but if you take a close look at the evidence photo of the holster, it appears the clip is not adjustable. The clip as far as I can see, is adjusted to the holster in such way that if worn on the outside(clip would be facing the body) the grip would be facing the back. In order for the holster to be worn on the inside of the waistband(clip facing away from the body), the grip would’ve been facing forward.

        What I am suggesting is that GZ carried the holster for a cross draw, not that he cross drawed the gun when he shot Trayvon.

        In Osterman’s statement, he claimed GZ told him “he pulled the handgun, rotated the weapon and fired one shot”.

        I don’t believe that’s the way it happened, but Osterman would be the one person to know, how GZ carried his weapon, and in his statement he made sure to include the rotation of the gun, that would’ve been necessary if GZ would’ve drawn the gun with his right hand.

        We can wonder if GZ had the gun in the holster when he confronted Trayvon. It just means that for him to have been able to shoot Trayvon from the position he claims, it would’ve required an extra action.

      • pat deadder says:

        Oh my Two Sides thank you so much about the backward gun info.Wow even so what he says happened defies common sense.you all here amaze me everyday with your knowledge.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        Left-handed people use right-handed holsters and draw right-handed all the time. This is old news. Fogen even shows how he did it in his interview with either Serino or the lady cop and again in the shooting reconstruction. He’s not trying to turn the gun around. *shrugs* He’s grabbing the kid with his left, being careful not to shoot his own hand and drawing right – the handle of the gun would have been pointing back , more or less, or if the gun is a little towards his back, the handle would have been pointing left – for a quick, normal grab of it.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        Pat, thank PiranhaMom – she’s far more articulate than I am!

  61. groans says:

    Professor, aren’t there certain things for which a criminal defendant MUST acknowledge to the court his/her consent?

    If so, would a waiver of the Florida immunity opportunity be of a nature similar to those “certain things” – such that the Court, itself, would WANT to hear directly from the defendant that he consents to the waiver?

    (Hope this question makes sense.)

    • ay2z says:

      Should the client have been allowed to waive his appearance at that hearing? And if a decision was to be made that he should have been aware of, why didn’t the judge hold her decision until the next hearing? (would have been too late by the next hearing, to cancel the two weeks for the immunity hearing.

      Could the defense not have been asked to produce fogen that same day for this decision? The hearing did not take all day, they would have had time in the afternoon, Judge Nelson had kept more than a couple morning hrs free for this case. And we know the bail conditions mean that fogen was in town.

    • Although a lawyer can waive a legal right on behalf of a client, the better practice would be to have the client waive the right in writing in open court on the record and follow that up by filing the written waiver in the legal file.

      If the defendant was not in court when the lawyer issued the waiver, the court should require the defendant to appear in court to confirm the waiver on the record and file a written waiver signed by the defendant.

      This procedure should always be followed to make certain that the defendant understood that he had an important right to a statutory immunity hearing before trial and he voluntarily agreed to waive or give up that right after discussing the matter with his lawyer. Filing a written waiver in the legal file builds in redundancy assuring that the waiver will appear in the record.

      By following this procedure, the court creates a record that the defendant voluntarily waived the hearing. This prevents a misunderstanding between counsel and client resulting in a waiver without the defendant’s knowledge or consent.

      • Jun says:

        What happens if the defendant insists on the hearing? Do they just schedule a date before trial to have the hearing for SYG?

      • Malisha says:

        He has no right to a SYG hearing unless he makes a motion for a SYG hearing; on the other hand, he has the right to proffer the affirmative defense of SYG and/or self-defense AT TRIAL without having a separate pre-trial motion. Maybe O’Mara deliberately muddled his announcements about the SYG so that the Outhousers didn’t think he was really giving up the right to have a SYG hearing, just “rolling it into the trial” as if it could still be a separate hearing, rather than an affirmative defense presented to the jury, when the trial came around.

        I think he was trying to fool his “public,” not the court. He has to know by now that he’s not going to successfully fool the Court.

        Perhaps he should also fool his pubic. Oops, typo. 😳

      • groans says:

        Thanks.

      • ladystclaire says:

        MOM, IS the dumbest and the most corrupt attorney, that I have ever seen. BTW, did Joonya tip off fogen’s following Trayvon from the apt complex next to RTL , And on into his neighborhood? I’ve been reading something to that effect over at HP.

    • Lonnie Starr says:

      I imagine that the court set a 45 day advance of trial limit on the immunity hearing, my guess is that if MOM doesn’t meet that, the court, in it’s discretion can and will rule the hearing waived by default.

      Any appeal will have to show that the hearing would have succeeded, in order to successful. The door on that will close when the verdict comes in. Of course, MOM can leave GZ with false hope to spend his days enamored of fruitlessly.

  62. vickie s. votaw says:

    Stunning closing statement! Thank you. 🙂

  63. ay2z says:

    The claim that fogen wants to be judged by a jury of his peers because that will heal the country, won’t fly if he trys that statement out of his mouth.

    • Trained Observer says:

      America has shifted its focus to Newtown and Boston … Now that facts are out , the focus is not on this two-bit murderer who apparently still fancies himself as of interest to the nation. important.

      It is Trayvon and justice for his loss of life that remains important to decent Americans.

  64. Xena says:

    @Professor.

    To use a poker analogy, folding your hand at the last minute by waiving the hearing establishes that you were bluffing when you kept insisting that you had a winning hand.

    BINGO!!!

  65. Nef05 says:

    No clothes, indeed. He’s got it coming at him from all sides – Bernie’s motion, the state’s appellate response, am just waiting for Blackwell’s response to fall tomorrow/Friday.

    Just out of curiosity, I’m wondering who they’ll find to blame when fogen has to waive the immunity hearing out of his own mouth? Who are they going to blame when the 5DCA refuses/turns down the petition for writ of centiorari?

    Not a good day to be a fogen. I, on the other hand, am giggling like a teenager. 🙂

    • PYorck says:

      I fully expect them not to waive the hearing. They’ll twist and turn and not commit to a definitive answer either way. In case Judge Nelson puts them on the spot and tells them that if they don’t do X, then she will take that as a ‘no’, they will let that pass. Later they will complain that GZ’s rights were brushed away.

      • cielo62 says:

        PYork- they can complain, but the transcripts will prove who is in the wrong. And it WON’T be Judge Nelson.

        Sent from my iPod

      • Malisha says:

        Defense never has MADE a motion for an immunity hearing, has it?

        You don’t have to waive something that is not automatic. You have to ASK for something to GET it.

      • looolooo says:

        Would it be mandatory for Fogenmeister to take the stand at an immunity hearing?

        • YES…..He could not refuse to take the stand at an SYG hearing.

        • PYorck says:

          No, but in practice he will probably have to if he wants to be successful.

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          It would not be mandatory for him to take the stand because you cannot compel a defendant to be a witness against himself.

          The trouble is, he’s the only one who can put on record the testimony he needs to support his claims of innocence. Without his own testimony, he cannot hope to reach the “preponderance of evidence” threshold needed to win the immunity (SYG) hearing. Thus, any hearing other than a full fledged trial by jury, would be a complete waste of time, if GZ were not to testify, because he would lose.

      • ladystclaire says:

        @MMP, the truth is I never left you, all through my crime filled days I can’t stop lying, I’m going to prison! Have I said enough there’s nothing more the law can do for me all you have to do is look at the evidence, because every bit of it is TRUE.

      • LeaNder says:

        PYorck, I am not completely sure. Yes, they sure would like to keep it vague. And yes, the only way open to them now seems to have no fixed time deadlines,. in other words the motion could be strictly filed whenever they like to file it, and not as the usual “C(4) motion” which has to be filed at arraignment or before. But look at the argument below

        Well, under 3.190(c)(1-4), the defendant can file a motion to dismiss for a charge that has been pardoned, for double jeopardy, for immunity being granted previously, or for “undisputed facts” that don’t establish a prima facie case, that was discussed above. Notably, these 4 claims “may at ANY time [be] entertain[ed]” by the court. For a 3.190(b), it must be made either before or at arraignment.

        There’s been some claims that an immunity hearing could be conducted at trial, or post-trial, but the case law and Rules of Criminal Procedure seem quite clear, at least to me, that this is impermissible unless Judge Nelson decides to allow the Motion in her discretion.

        What specific “undisputed facts” do you think they have to offer?

        The defendant would have to show, during the hearing, that no material disputed facts exist and the undisputed facts to not establish a prima facie case of guilt against the defendant. So essentially the material facts have to be undisputed.

    • SearchingMind says:

      @ Nef05

      Nef, I also await a Blackswell/Crump response. If they do respond, the deadline is not April 28 2013 but 29th April 2013. See RULE 2.514(a)(1)(A)(B)(C) of the Florida Rules of Judicial Administration. 28th April is a non-business day.

      Blackswell/Crump response may thus choose to respond before- or on Monday the 29th of April 2013.

      • LeaNder says:

        SM, I wonder if they need to respond at all. In a way the settlement with HOA may be all they consider necessary to add to their argument. It takes care of the opposing counsel argument.
        See also the Motion Blackwell has already filed on the topic Were he elaborates on the topic from a legal perspective.

  66. trina cosbie says:

    I think that when BDLR argues this motion in court, he is going to drop a bombshell on GZ whole defense….

  67. fauxmccoy says:

    loved the article, prof, am cursing the visions of this emperor without benefit of clothing now circling in my head.

  68. acemayo says:

    eddieyorkre
    p at 3:57 PM April 24, 2013
    Gator/Kater-
    The FBI’s investigation declared George never profiled Trayvon

    But

    Zimmerman falsely profiled Brandi’s guest as a burglar.
    Zimmerman filed a false police report about a non-crime by a non-criminal.
    Zimmerman chased the guest on false premises that existed only in Zimmerman’s head.
    Zimmerman didn’t try to introduce himself and expain his predatory conduct after he cornered his prey.
    Zimmerman shot the young man for legally standing his ground against a depraved maniac.

    • Jun says:

      The FBI never made any such declaration

    • Trained Observer says:

      “Howdy, I’m Fogen the Great, Afro-Peruvian Emperor of these here parts … what you all be doin’ on my personal turf here at the T?”

    • Xena says:

      BDLR and O’Mara have both said in court that the FBI’s investigation is ongoing. That in fact, O’Mara is steamed that the FBI will not give him discovery material. He wanted the State to get it for him, and Judge Nelson told him to get it himself.

      • pat deadder says:

        Xena and didn’t he try to get the info from the FBI and screwed up that request as well.The only clients he will have after this fiasco is the hate mongers he and fogen get their money from and that is all he deserves.God I hope he is never hired to go on talk shows to give oppinions on other trials.

    • two sides to a story says:

      Fogen says in his own statements that he profiled, followed, and killed Trayvon Martin. Clear as a bell.

    • Lonnie Starr says:

      Yep, this is fact evidenced by GZ’s own stated interest in Trayvon, without which there would have been no reason for him, to hold any interest in Trayvon at all.

      GZ freely admits to having raced to follow Trayvon on impulse, the moment he announces that Trayvon has begun to run. That is not the reaction of a disinterested observer, it is the reaction of a person intending to thwart an escape, either real or imagined. Coupled with GZ’s expression of exaggerated frustration; “they always get away”, and the inescapable conclusion is that this one will not get away.

      In fact “this one” as an unarmed person, winds up as dead as you would expect them to, from an aggressive encounter with an armed and angry person.

      What GZ’s stories do not take into account is, we expect the armed person who is in pursuit to be the survivor.

      GZ is trying to explain why we should expect the unarmed teen to be the most likely person to survive, if not for GZ’s firearm.

      So, GZ’s stories already make no sense, even before we discover that Trayvon’s hands show no signs of having been used in any attack.

      My guess is GZ is watching re runs of Prison Break.

  69. Trained Observer says:

    Bravo to BDLR for leaving seemingly no stone unturned on preventing any funny stuff from Team Fogen.

    Bravo to you, professor, for systematically laying it out (especially options if a new lawyer were to take over), and for the great headline and posting wrap.

    Additionally, who among us won’t be pleased to see Emperor Fogen forced to show up to A) assure everyone that he hasn’t gotten out of Dodge B) to give him an up close and personal reminder that his big trial is looming and C) to let him witness in person the rulings issued by Judge Nelson.

    • cielo62 says:

      Trained Observer~ For those 3 reasons alone, it would be worth seeing GZ shimmy his butt into court!

      • Trained Observer says:

        Ha! Shimmy, shimmy — should be played for his entrances and exits at trial!

      • LeaNder says:

        I am gone, but it seems he has already waived his appearance and thus his immunity hearings folded into trial:

        WAIVER OF ANY PROCEEDING TO INVOKE IMMUNITY (SELF-DEFENSE/STAND YOUR GROUND

        Which gets us back to the hope that he will be acquitted which definitively would change the rules anyway. But if he waives it now, it shows us much. Just as defense recognizes it would hinder the fundraising efforts if it was publicized as part of the next hearing discussions. It also puts a strange light on their argument they desperately need continuance due to prosecution’s evidence delays. I think that our hosts argument in this context is highly relevant. They could get a delay if they actually did follow their own argument. All the fault of evil media ,and he should not have been charged to start with.

        Will Rene Stutzman notice all these matters? I somehow doubt.it

        Have a wonderful day all.

        • I LIKE IT 🙂

          To see fogen in the courtroom having to speak for himself in waiving the SYG hearing…..I thought that was his whole defense in the first place?

          Well….being as the SYG hearing isn’t going to happen…..

          Then I guess all he has is a trial for 2nd. degree murder?

          Couldn’t happen to a more decent American….OOPZ…a more decent Afro / Peruvian…

      • PYorck says:

        @LeaNder

        I am pretty sure it just looks like that because of the stone age format of the docket that can’t handle sufficiently long titles.
        Those are three entries that are supposed to be one.

      • Do you think Zimmerman will be asked, by his new FSP friends to do “The Shimmy?”

      • LeaNder says:

        I am pretty sure it just looks like that because of the stone age format of the docket that can’t handle sufficiently long titles.
        Those are three entries that are supposed to be one.

        Yes, PYorck, could be. If you read them from the bottom up your argument seems to make sense. On the other hand I always thought they abbreviated entries and describing them differently than <a href=http://www.flcourts18.org/page.php?129Y<the 18th JCC. In any case here they get it in two lines. And they don’t seem to have much more space. (77, including spaces versus 73, if I counted correctly)

        Yes, good point again, you could be correct. The all are filed under MOTN which seems to stand for motion.

        ——————

        I am pretty sure triggered something, and now it suddenly surfaced: witness #13, I am pretty sure they did CPR? He has a very peculiar intonation at that point, almost like an extra emphasized question.. Maybe that’s why it caught my attention. Or sticked on my mind, including the intonation. In other words, I can’t help reading this innocent phrase without triggering this association in my mind.

        😉

      • LeaNder says:

        Ok, I didn’t close a link, dropped an e in the, and picked the wrong witness. In other words, I should be back to my work. 😉

    • two sides to a story says:

      Oh yes, oh yes, oh yes. Fogen’s getting nailed!

      I’m not sure why OM would risk his reputation with this particular bit of nonsense, but I’m only spending about 1/2 a second wondering.

  70. racerrodig says:

    Kill ’em Bernie……..slay that dragon……!!!!!!!!!

  71. i like the way BDLR is covering all the bases so as not to allow zimmerman to slip out of what he’s got coming to him

  72. Jun says:

    this is Omara’s plan

    waive the syg hearing

    have the trial

    then once convicted claim they never got the chance for the immunity hearing

    then once the new trial and immunity hearing is granted, Omara asks for a 50 year continuance

  73. Nef05 says:

    The state’s response to O’Mara’s writ of certiorari is also up on GZlegal. I don’t see it on the 5DCA website, so either they haven’t uploaded it, yet, or I was looking in the wrong place.

    However, you can see it on O’Mara’s site.

  74. ay2z says:

    The Afro-Peruvian emperor hired the fine fabric clothiers from the firm of Warped, Woof, Woof, Woof, West and O’Mara.

    The juors were to be included in those who would believe they saw APE (Afro-Peruvian Emperor) in his finest.

    Alas, a sham, the court of public opinionators, no fools.

    West and O’Mara debut t’wards the 4 minute mark in the story.

  75. Tzar says:

    yeah buddy, don’t let that Mr. potato head appearance fool, Bernie is a shark

  76. Rachael says:

    I don’t even understand the rationale of an immunity hearing after a hearing if convicted. It just makes no sense to me whatsoever. An appeal I can understand, but that does not give immunity. I don’t get it.

    • cielo62 says:

      Rachael~ Exactly! It makes no sense! It almost feels like MOM is trying that “GZ should never have been arrested in the 1st place” argument by rolling the immunity hearing with the actual trial. PS I got the Trayvon/ Zimmerman app. It was free. I’ll see if it’s any good.

    • PYorck says:

      You are forgetting that in their world he will be acquitted and he will need immunity from his money-grubbing enemies who won’t give up.

      They don’t want to admit any problems with that scenario.

      • LeaNder says:

        good point. PYorck. So we have already a part of their argument. Well Nelson can rule accordingly. But they also have to come clear concerning folding it into the trial. Which makes no sense due to completely different rules as the Prof has taught us.;)

    • crazy1946 says:

      In the mind of the Fogenites, they compare this case to the O. J. Simpson case, where he was acquitted, however was financially destroyed in a series of civil cases, as if Foggen has or will ever have any assets (other than state issued uniforms) for the rest of his pathetic life. Professor, great post, glad to see we are back on this subject…

      • fauxmccoy says:

        @crazy1946 — i understand that you are pleased to be back on this subject, it is what drew many of us here.

        i do think that it is necessary to divert to other legal issues of the day as they arise. this is, after all, a legal focused blog and was before the names of martin and the defendant were ever known publicly.

        at some point, this trial will conclude and i for one will still be reading this blog happily because of the knowledge i gain from doing so. it is important that we also consider other legal actions in our world, as they arise. mind you, i do not say this with any criticism toward your statement.

        • cielo62 says:

          fauxmccoy~ I have found our several detours into other current events to be equally informative: Loughner, Dorner, Lanza just to name a few. This event has brought new posts about the difference between federal and state court procedures, which I knew nothing about. So I second your opinion. Heaven knows we need to become more knowledgable to stop any shenanigans from happening without going overboard into conspiracy theories. It’s called critical thinking. This blog is certainly sharpening those skills.

    • Trained Observer says:

      I don’t (and never have) gotten it. You are not alone, Rachael.

      • Malisha says:

        Here’s what I think about the idea of O’Mara pretending that he wanted to “roll the immunity hearing into the trial.” I think he did not want to (a) embarrass himself and he also (b) he did not want to let the Outhousers and others like them know that he had no grounds and could not even PRETEND grounds for an immunity hearing. He did not want to go ahead and HAVE it and do greater damage to the case than Fogen has already done. I think Nelson realized he was trying to sneak past the issue without letting it be clearly seen so he could “save face,” and I think she was gracious to say, “Do you want me to save those two weeks at the end of April?” so he could single-syllable his way out of the mess.

        Combining a SYG with a trial, however, would not be possible and I’m sure O’Mara knows it. It’s not just a terrible idea, it’s an unworkable procedure. Courts cannot set trial dates and then have pretrial motions that could derail the trial dates. That’s why there is a period of bail, of motions practice, of discovery. Judge Nelson likes to do things by the book and I doubt she’d be willing to throw “The Book of Moron” at her own courtroom.

        Now why BDLR is bringing this up specifically is interesting and I like it. It shows he has a kind of “no quarter” attitude about the case, and that makes me trust him more than I used to. I now think the likelihood of a “down and dirty” plea deal where the public is deprived of the ability to undersand the real underpinnings of the prosecution is greatly decreased. BDLR is saying, and rightly so: WE ARE IN A COURT OF LAW. Let’s act like it.

        I’m wondering which of O’Mara’s silly useless “steps too far” tripped the wire to make BDLR say to himself and his office: Let’s get real on this guy.

      • Nef05 says:

        @Malisha – Great comment. As to which of the steps too far, I’m going to speculate it was probably O’Mara asking the favor of the prosecution of a mutually extended deadline for final witness lists (which BDLR agreed to) all the while O’Mara was writing the motion about the prosecution’s alleged malfeasance with regard to discovery.

        While we can make tons of arguments for other things O’Mara has done – I, personally, thought that really p/o’d BDLR (based on his classic response), and rightfully so.

      • Jun says:

        I dont get them

        They could at the very least admit that Fogen’s claim of self defense is suspect at best because it is very suspect

        Let’s be honest, Fogen did, go after Trayvon, with a gun and anger, as shown by the forensics, witnesses, and his own NEN phone call

        The screams for help sound like a young kid telling Fogen to get off him and pleading for help and his life and there is a point where you hear the young voice squeal in pain

        There’s no dna whatsoever on Trayvon’s hands and arms or his sleeves and cuffs of his clothing

        The rain wash story will not fly because rain is not picky and choosy and just choose to wash off one area, when rain falls rapidly from numerous clouds, and no dna washed off Fogen or Trayvon, as shown by the smear on the bottom of Trayvon’s shirt and the dna and animal blood on Fogen’s jacket

        Witness 6 is dropping his story and it’s good for him because of forensics of the dna, which will also be covered by blood splatter and other analysis experts, and likely he will admit Fogen put him up to the story with threats

      • ladystclaire says:

        I would still like to know, exactly where he got the animal blood from. what animal did he use as target practice in order for him to have animal blood on himself. he didn’t live on a farm, not a hunter and, he sure as hell didn’t have a job working as a butcher in the meat dept at Targets. so where in the hilly haystack, did he acquire animal blood on himself?

        • Xena says:

          @ladystclaire.

          so where in the hilly haystack, did he acquire animal blood on himself?

          Maybe ShelLIE transforms into a werewolf on the full moon. 🙂

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          It sure struck me as strange that GZ should have all the wounds, so superficial and yet so much blood, with so little time for bleeding, and the wounds show every indication of being old enough to have been created before GZ left home. Perhaps Osterman stopped at the MI bank, to bolster an excuse they didn’t use, about coming over to lend GZ money for shopping. After Trayvon was shot, naturally, MO would be very much against using such a story.

          But, he knows the law and knows that GZ needs to be able to justify any attempt at apprehending anyone, so he might have been the bearer of more blood, just to be sure there was enough. So, l unless GZ wears the same clothes for months at a time, I see and hear no proximity to animals in the days leading up to Feb. 26th 2012, that should explain this anomaly.

          Hopefully they’ll release the depositions in time for them to get a really thorough going over from many different angles.

      • aussie says:

        If I recall, it was possible animal DNA, not blood. I believe he had 2 dogs at the time. Anyone with pets is going to have animal DNA on them somewhere.

        • PiranhaMom says:

          @Aussie –

          Yes Aussie. Commented on this before. Could be close encounter with your favorite pet – or a splash from food prep next to the BBQ.

          “Say, do these ribs look good on me?”

          Or injudiciously wolfing down a rare burger … squirt, squirt!

      • Jun says:

        It was a liquid type of dna, so my guess is blood or saliva, but I actually think it’s animal blood. We will find out for sure at trial.

      • Lynn says:

        Liquid animal DNA? Austin said it looked like Fogen had slipped. Maybe he fell in doggie waste or put his hand in it getting up, then wiped it on his jacket? It was a dog walk after all. Maybe it’s the obvious staring us in the face.

      • Jun says:

        Feces are really fucking dirty and I saw no poo smears on Fogen at all

        so

        I do not believe it is feces from an animal

        its more likely blood or saliva, as those can easily be camoflauged on the clothing

      • ladystclaire says:

        @Malisha, MOM is an @$$ if I ever saw one! He is playing up to a group of racist and, IMO he is one of them himself. The word racist is written all over his wrinkled face. He is one of them and he knows it. IMO, if he wasn’t he wouldn’t be so into them or their money. He is also a dishonest person.

    • ladystclaire says:

      I don’t get it either Rachael. IMO how would something like that even be legal? it makes no sense to me at all.

    • Bahama Mama says:

      I think O’Mara was/is just keeping the “idea” of the immunity hearing ALIVE and WELL to keep the ZIDIOTS happy…they may send more money if he keeps their hopes alive.

  77. SoulSistaWoo says:

    Excellent… and Follow!

    • Deborah says:

      @Ladyst.claire: Fogen and his entire dysfunctional family feel that they are above the law! They can do and say anything that they want to say. They denigrate Trayvon and his family and think we are supposed to stand here and take it?? I don’t think so and I let them know it! Fogen can murder a kid, and walk away?? He will not get away with the murder of Trayvon Martin!

      BTW, the little Martin boy who was so tragicly murdered up in Boston last week? The photo of him holding a sign which read and i am paraphrasing here, “Something about people getting along and not hurting one another?” His family stated that he wrote that in response to Trayvon Martin being killed. This 8 year old boy spoke out against injustice and racism in his own way. He had more courage and strength than the entire Z family and all of their racist supporters!! He knew about hatred, bigotry and racism at 8 years old and spoke out against it! When I first saw his photo, I knew their was something special about this little boy with the sweet smile, and the missing tooth. He was so cute and so sweet. I cried when I read what he had done. Why did he have to die like Trayvon? Sorry guys, I am just to emotional right now about this.

      • Bahama Mama says:

        “He had more courage and strength than the entire Z family and all of their racist supporters!! ”

        Sad…my mom always said…”only the good die young”…

      • And then the zimbots tried bashing the kid re: Trayvon…..

        These people breed….they vote……Gotta watch the BP on this one 😦

      • ladystclaire says:

        @Deborah, yes they all do think they are above the laws in this country. I’m so sick of how this kid, his family and AA in general are being dogged out by those in this country who choose to support this murderer of a child. yes Joonyah, I called your brother what he is and, that is a *MURDERER.*

        Fogen has brought the racism that has always been present in this country front and center. when this first happened, I saw nothing but comments condemning his act. then about a week or so later, there were all of these racist comments condemning the victim Trayvon. this is a sad situation for this kid’s family and, those who support this murderer, are cut from the very same mold as he is. chances go around so, these ignorant racist had better be careful because, the wrath of GOD is surely going to come down on them.

      • Lonnie Starr says:

        We are being deprived of the good by the miserable!

      • Deborahi feel your pain.Alot of things that happen in life is just not fair.We dont understand why these 2 Martian,s died in such a voilent way.It should not have happened. I was told my whole life that God dont make mistakes.Its a whole lot of folk has to answer for these 2 lives that was taken so young and so un-nessasary.Starting will all of the GZ Bunch,all the rascist that say horrible things about Trayvon and family.How can these white rascist ppl celebrate the murder of this 17 yr old child?

  78. Follow

    Not to worry…The Emperor will soon be wearing a state issued jumpsuit…………..

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