O’Mara out of time in Zimmerman case

Tuesday, April 16, 2013

Abbyj said,

Omar will ride the PayPal buckaroo to the bitter end in an effort to squeeze out every last cent. He is hoping for a massive windfall, as fogen received early on. Without any hope of a great fortune appearing, O’Mara will then stand before Judge Nelson, wring his hands, and whine, “I haven’t had the financial resources to hire experts . . . ” Could fogen use this as grounds for an appeal?

Good question.

We begin at the beginning. Appellate courts hate piecemeal appeals. With one notable exception, they will refuse to review a case unless the circuit court has entered a final judgment terminating it. The exception is the writ procedure that permits a party to seek extraordinary relief from a specific order issued by a judge in the circuit court that, in effect, functions as a final order in a case depriving the losing party of an opportunity to present its case and argument in the circuit court.

The defense used the writ procedure to recuse Judge Lester (mandamus) and is now using it (certiorari) in an attempt to get an order vacating (setting aside) Judge Nelson’s order denying the defense motion to depose Benjamin Crump. I do not believe this effort will be successful because I think Judge Nelson made the correct legal decision. Since other witnesses were present when Crump interviewed Dee Dee to determine the cause of Trayvon’s death on behalf of his clients, Tracy Martin and Sybrina Fulton, his efforts constitute protected attorney work product that is not subject to disclosure. Moreover, the defense team cannot show they were prejudiced by Judge Nelson’s order because they can interview Dee Dee and the witnesses who were present. Therefore, Judge Nelson’s decision is not a final judgment or order that functioned like a final judgment by depriving the defense of its only opportunity to discover potentially favorable information for the defense.

With regard to your specific question, the defense would have to file a motion requesting some form of financial assistance from the court to pay for something that the defense has a right to do, but cannot afford to do. The defendant has a Sixth Amendment right to effective assistance of counsel at public expense, if he cannot afford counsel. The right to effective assistance of counsel at public expense, includes paying reasonably necessary expenses for investigators and expert witnesses.

Mark O’Mara and Don West have agreed to work pro bono, so they will not be asking the court to compensate them for the time they spend working on the case. However, their agreement to work pro bono does not mean that they also have agreed to pay the costs that will be incurred to defend their client. Specifically, the court cannot require them to pay experts and investigators.

The internet donations were supposed to cover those costs. According to O’Mara, however, the defense is underwater by approximately $10,000. I doubt that includes the $28,000 claim for services rendered by the security company, unless O’Mara has paid down the balance. Therefore, the defense may be in more serious financial trouble.

Judge Nelson cannot do anything unless O’Mara files a motion. An appropriate motion would be to ask her to enter an order declaring the defendant indigent and entitled to the reasonably necessary assistance of investigators and experts at public expense. Such a motion would have to be supported by a detailed financial statement or tax return submitted under oath. Given the substantial sum of money donated to the defendant via the internet (possibly approaching $500,000) that somehow disappeared and the defendant’s “potted plant” behavior at his bail hearing last summer when his wife under oath denied knowing that he had any assets just a few days after she transferred over $100,000 from the internet account into her personal account via his personal account pursuant to his specific instructions, I think Judge Nelson would refuse to accept anything at face value. I think she would insist the prosecution review the documentation or she might appoint a special master to review it, if the defense were to object. I think the defendant and his lawyers could safely assume that any irregularities would result in additional criminal charges.

If Judge Nelson were to deny the motion to declare the defendant indigent, her denial could be challenged on appeal. The issue would be whether she abused her discretion in denying the motion. In turn that would depend on the sufficiency of the documentation supplied by the defense.

To properly preserve this issue for appeal, the defense would have to ask Judge Nelson to reconsider her denial of his motion to appoint an investigator or an expert at every available opportunity. A failure to provide a road map in the trial transcript of requests to reconsider supported by specific reasons why an investigator or expert was reasonably necessary at that particular time might be fatal. For example, the DCA might agree that Judge Nelson abused her discretion by denying the request for indigency, but find that the error was harmless absent sufficient documentation of the harm to the defense caused by the denial.

If Judge Nelson were to grant the motion, O’Mara would have to submit ex parte motions to appoint specifically named individuals to do specific things. She would probably appoint one investigator. The number of experts she would be willing to appoint would depend on the relevance of their area of expertise to the subject matter at issue in the case. The rate of compensation would be at the reduced rate that the court has established for appointed cases.

If the jury were to convict the defendant and O’Mara failed to hire an investigator or an expert to assist in preparing for trial and putting on a defense, his failure to do those things could be raised in a state habeas petition after the appeal is unsuccessful. Habeas petitions are based on evidence that is not in the record and typically are based on defense counsel’s failure to do something that he should have done. The failure asserted in this instance would be the failure to hire an investigator or expert. If that happened due to lack of money and O’Mara did not ask Judge Nelson to find the defendant indigent, the claim would be that he provided ineffective assistance of counsel by failing to make the request.

In order to prevail, habeas counsel would have to convince the court that O’Mara’s conduct was deficient according to prevailing standards of conduct and that, but for the deficiency, the result of the trial probably would have been different.

It takes time to assemble a team of experts and investigators and it takes additional time for them to complete their assignments. O’Mara should have assembled his team before Thanksgiving. The trial is scheduled to begin in less than 60 days and the defense fund is underwater $10,000.

Even if Judge Nelson were to enter orders tomorrow finding the defendant indigent and appointing an investigator and experts, all financial compensation would be limited to services provided in the future.

Given that dire financial situation, plus one unhappy creditor having already sued O’Mara alleging that he has refused to pay $28,000 for services provided, I doubt anyone will invest any time or effort to help O’Mara without a substantial retainer up front.

Such is the nature of the criminal defense business.

Just like his client, he is out of time.

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187 Responses to O’Mara out of time in Zimmerman case

  1. JustMe says:

    follow ~

    • JustMe says:

      Want to read some more O’Mara BS? Haven’t had time to read in its entirety, but this popped out. >>> O’Mara continues to lie about witness #6 stating that he witnessed a so called “beating”. LIE!

      And what does a civil suit that has been settled have anything to do with trying this CRIMINAL case other than proving “work product” to the court?!

      Another ridiculous answer to the court by no one other than, Mark O’mara!

      Click to access resp_to_crump.pdf

  2. ay2z says:

    Aside, the young victim of the Boston Marathon bombing held a dove peace sign he created in response to Trayvon’s death.

    • looolooo says:

      Let’s see if Joonyah goes on a viscious tweeting tirade about how the poor young tyke deserved to be murdered for insinuating that his thug of a brother is some how to blame for Trayvon’s death.

      Poor sweet precious boy. 😦

  3. whonoze says:

    I have made a composite that shows the (more or less) complete image of W13’s photo of GZ’s bloody head, w/o the banner and logo, taken from still frame exports of a tilt-up over the photo in an ABC news clip, downloaded from the ABC website.

    I am convinced BRD that this photo has been edited by ABC to cover GZ’s left hand area, and to obscure something that is lying on the ground just in front of his left knee.

    willis has determined BRD that in this photo GZ is kneeling or squatting over the exact area on the dog walk where the brown plastic bag from 7-11 was found and photographed by the SPD.

    I can’t embed stills here, so you’ll have to go here to see it.


    • ay2z says:

      whonose, good catch. It is possible that someone retouched the ground area to eliminate something white, like a dropped piece of tissue, but the other areas are strange and don’t need to be changed for any reason like that.

      Did you notice the right ear area? Looks like something black with a shiny surface helt to his ear. And the solid black inside the jacket collar could be altered as well for some reason.

      The left ear white outline on the ear could suggest something white or light, but why bother manipulating.

      Shows how news organizations manipulate things because evidence photos have no need for manipulation to make them more appealing to ‘masses’.

      • whonoze says:

        ABC could have both story-interest and ethical obligations to edit the photo. Given that the photo is presented to show the blood on GZ’s head, background objects, which may be indistinct and/or irrelevant, may yet appear as distractions. So they would be covered over or obscured to make sure the photo ‘popped’ with it’s intended purpose in it’s brief screen time during a news clip. On the other hand, say there was something distinct and possibly relevant there, e.g. what if it showed GZ was in handcuffs? (Assuming the time stamp on the photo is accurate, he wasn’t, because Ofc. Smith had not yet arrived and placed him into custody). But in the handcuff hypothetical, that could have been considered prejudicial, and covered for that reason.

        My hypothesis is that they obscured something relevant, or at least interesting to us, for broadcast-effectiveness reasons, not recognizing any significance in the alterations I think they made.

      • Malisha says:

        I remember O’Mara did not even want to discuss that photo when it first came out (in the media, not in the evidence dumps). He said he was not sure “how or if” that photo would be used by the defense. Indeed! He’s still pretty shy about it, preferring to talk about the “bloody nose” picture, which is frankly laughable.

        • ay2z says:

          There’s an interesting point. The difference in the two photos, one taken by cop, the other by a ‘neighbor’ hang-around at the scene lookie-loo. One taken as killer kneeled or crouched at a piece of evidence, maybe putting that evidence there to be included in the photo.

          Will be interesting to see the original file photo image.

      • gbrbsb says:


        Did you notice the right ear area? Looks like something black with a shiny surface helt to his ear.

        IMO it looks like a mobile and going by the reflection I tend more towards it being a deep dark blue, even metallic, than black. I doubt it’s a smart phone because no screen light, it appears to taper inwards and/or is too rounded at the top so doesn’t appear to be very modern, it doesn’t seem large enough, the zims weren’t broke, and IIRC both he and Shellie bought brand new mobiles with the donated monies.

        The left ear white outline on the ear could suggest something white or light, but why bother manipulating.

        IMO it is the bounce back from the flash hitting the collar below. The flash hits to the left of the crown, as well as the left ear, shoulder and collar. The cyclist type jacket appears made of a smooth poly and/or nylon mix material (water repellent?). The fluorescent effect where the flash hits demonstrates a high reflective quality that by the laws of physics would have a strong bounce back with little scatter. IMO it is the bounce back from the collar that catches under GZ’s ear causing the “silver lining”.

        • ay2z says:

          I’m sure it’s a phone, interesting idea about a cheaper style phone, he was ‘frugal’. HE could have had a couple phones, to use to communicate with third parties while on his own phone. If someone was giving him the description of Trayvon, for example, the button. Why would he say ‘wearing a button’ when Trayvon was at ‘he’s running’? Maybe someone on another phone, like wife or sis.

    • whonoze says:

      Here’s willisnewton’s photo array establishing where W13’s photo was taken:

      superimposition of video screen grab and web photo by  ABC news

      • ay2z says:


        From the photo, sure looks like fogen is on his phone. Who would he be talking to at that very moment.
        Using this video to show that it sure looks like a bent right arm holding a phone to right ear.

      • ay2z says:

        The phone and right jacket cuff is especially evident in the second photo, as it’s lightened to see the details. Thanks

      • ay2z says:

        The photostream is very interesting/

      • willisnewton says:

        for the record, I’m willis newrton and my flickr is jean dodge. Whonoze and I agree on many many things but I DON’T see anything awry, sinister or manipulated in the cell phone pic taken by w13.

        I have to point out very strongly that this is NOT the original photo file, although it is a great facsimile thereof and whonoze did a good job assembling it from a panned video source on the web. There are several generational losses and even the original image is a compressed one.

        Yes the shadows are odd but i think there are two light sources, one the in camera flash that creates a very slight dark edge on the right of objects by virtue of the flash being to the side of the lens on an iPhone 4s, and the deeper and more mysterious shadows caused by the flashlight we know Jon/W13 carried in his hand and would have used to help compose the photo with in the dark, and to see the injuries on GZ’s head as he describes doing in his FDLE interview.

        The sidewalk smudges are crude interpretation of stains that are visible in the tan bag evidence photo and it is in “boring” neutral color areas like these that compression programs remove the most detail and “hide” the missing information by default. Busy areas are where the program tries hardest to represent the original pixels the best.

        Once we see the original photo file we might be able to say if the tan bag is there or not. Currently I am torn. At first I thought it was there, now I mostly don’t. One wonders why it isn’t there, and if GZ is kneeling on it in the grass w his right knee to keep it dry. Unknowable. The bag moves somewhat even in the evidence photo session so it wasn’t anchored to the ground by amy means.

        The spot the photo was taken at I believe is completely identifiable by the details in the sidewalk crack we haven’t been able to see before, and the obvious color cast to the upper and lower squares of the walkway. This is 30 feet south of the T and GZ is kneeling or squatting facing the dying or dead teenager he shot. His left arm reaches towards his right side in some fashion and is identifiable by the two tone pattern to the sleeve of the jacket he’s wearing.

        This gives us a tiny sliver of “new” information and as usual raises more questions than it probably answers.

        Most significant is the one we already had – who is he calling, and why and why did he have to ask w13/Jon after to call Shellie if he was already speaking to her. Who moved his truck and why and how did they know where to find it?

        Again however I don’t yet see any obvious hanky-panky with the photo, but stress strongly this isnt the original photo file. YMMV.

        • JustMe says:

          Want to read some more O’Mara BS? Haven’t had time to read in its entirety, but this popped out. >>> O’Mara continues to lie about witness #6 stating that he witnessed a so called “beating”. LIE!

          And what does a civil suit that has been settled have anything to do with trying this CRIMINAL case other than proving “work product” to the court?!

          Another ridiculous answer to the court by no one other than, Mark O’mara!

          Click to access resp_to_crump.pdf

          • PiranhaMom says:

            @JustMe –

            Thanks for posting the latest from Zimmerman/O’Mara.

            This is the most vile assertion by O’Mara.
            It is thoroughly disputed by Medical Examiner-reported evidence:

            Can’t the court place sanctions on this sort of stuff?

            Can JohnW6 come forward and say this is all a sack of —- ?

    • cielo62 says:

      Whonoze~ Just based on the angles, it looks like it could be a cell phone. After all, it was reported that the 1st photo was taken while GZ was yakking or texting. This would fit in with a text message on a cell phone.


      • Rachael says:

        That’s what I thought too.

      • willisnewton says:

        Not to be a prig, but I lightened the photo almost a year ago to the day and quickly spotted the cell phone up to his right ear- the photo was broadcast by abc on april 20 or 21st 2012 and at that time I immediately started asking questions about who GZ was calling. This was originally on daily kos, but I’ve continually pointed out the questions it raises ever since then. At the time I wondered if he was cuffed in the front and being given preferential treatment but now I doubt it, mostly becasue of the work of whonoze and his cohorts establishing the good timeline to say that ofc tm smith was not QUITE there just yet, as reported by w18.

        To me the (at least attempted) phone call is as significant of a piece of evidence as anything shown on the back of his head there. (I’m unimpressed by the injuries or the direction the blood flows)

        It’s worth noting as others have cleverly pointed out that MO’M doesn’t emphasize this photo in court or in the many motions he files. IMO he may be shying away from it not only to the lightness of the injuries, but mainly because of the cell phone and how the questions it raises are NOT answered by GZ’s statements to SPD.

        I’d also like to chime in that I find the blood trails and their downward direction proof of little to nothing except that he had lacerations that didn’t bleed much, and didn’t perform a yoga style handstand afterwards. Any blood that might have gone from head to ground (were he on his back) would not make upward trails but instead transfer more or less directly from BACK of head to “pillow” area aka the ground or sidewalk IMO. I think the back of his head hit something and I don’t know what or how but I’m not surprised the blood flows down and under his ear, etc once he stood up. Seems perfectly natural to me. Whonoze and I differ on this point as well.

        Many things are possible. What GZ claims happened is not possible. When in doubt, George leaves it out. (like the cell phone call photograhed and described as in progress by W13/Jon, possibly to have someone move the truck or to discuss what to say to police) What George did, he blames on the kid. ( GZ claims the teen was the aggressor, and that GZ was the one in fear for his life, etc)

      • PiranhaMom says:

        @Cielo –

        Can we have an “office pool” on who he was calling?

        My bet: Norm Wolfinger.

        • cielo62 says:

          PirhanaMom~ LOL! That’s a good bet right there! Someone posted (without a link, though) that GZ spent some time with the Wolfinger family once he arrived in Florida. They were considered friends of the Zimmerman family.  While Billy Lee might have been a good guess, I don’t think they were that close. And GZ and Papa Z were estranged at the time, so he wouldn’t be the 1st one to call. So I won’t take your sucker bet!

  4. ay2z says:

    Prof, thanks for your comment in this article about whether O’Mara would add the unpaid/disputed investigation bill amount of 27 grand into his red ten amount. I’d asked in the last article, many thanks. 🙂

  5. LeaNder says:

    When looking at the “spent money affair” an article or two by Frederick back, I suggested 30% for Fogen’s living and security needs, 30% for the bond + 30% for O’Mara’s office and legal needs. I based these numbers on the offical accounting.

    Now what I obviously missed in that calculation is the “disappeared or unaccounted for” money. I am basing the calculation on O’Mara’s own statement that slightly more than 200k or precisely 204k had been raised by Fogen’s site.

    So here goes a look beyond O’Mara’s fundraising website. Didn’t he claim it was praised by experts for it’s transparency? Or was that is larger PR exercise?

    A look beyond the official “How Has Money Been Spent?” presentation

    Money collected 2012


    spent on F$190.553,1149,47%

    spent on bonds$110,000,0028,56%

    Accounted versus Unaccounted

    f’s website$204,000.00100,00%

    leftover on MOM’s$132.937,2065,17%

    spent hid before accounting$71.062.8034,83%

    Money priorities

    raised by F$204,000.00100,00%

    Security /Household$190.553,1193,41%


    See, I learned tables for you. I hope it works.

    • LeaNder says:

      No, it didn’t, it worked on my htlm preview page though. Back to school, what table tags does wordpress allow.

      Maybe I put that on a Google blog site.

  6. ay2z says:

    Junior has some new fangled logic saying that all his fogen’s statements are ‘truth’ unless and until they are ‘DISPROVEN’ (he supplied caps), until then they are ‘truth’.

    He wants the jury to believe that they must hold all those statements up as truth unless the state proves otherwise? He seems afraid that the jury will be able to evaluate someone’s credibility, believeability.

    Running scared.

  7. Kelly Payne says:

    They are using an internal investigation as to why Trayvon’s suspensions were released and and another document about a possible cover up of incidents at Miami Dade School districts to imply the Trayvon had a suppressed criminal record. those document mention the jewelery incident a few times and is quite repetitive. those other documents don’t really have any specifically to do with trayvon they just detail some unspecified incidents throughout the school system. They have very active imaginations,those treepers

    • ks says:

      @Kelly Payne,

      Yep. It’s an absurd and convoluted conflation of different things designed to mislead the dimwitted.

      For example, a “suppressed criminal record” is an actual criminal record that’s been surpressed and not, as they are implying, incidents that they feel should have charged as crimes and weren’t and also, TM’s suspensions were not suppressed. They were released by somebody despite him being a minor. Again, it’s really ridiculous stuff.

    • two sides to a story says:

      Yes they do, and it’s quite interesting that they also pat themselves on the back for adhering only to the facts of the case. *picking self up off floor from laughing so hard*

  8. Two sides to a story says:

    Professor, I wonder if you’d comment on the delay of Shellie’s trial until after Fogen’s. Isn’t her perjury noteworthy no matter the outcome of Fogen’s trial? Is she being treated with kid gloves in order to show some semblance of fairness?


    • Rachael says:

      Thanks for the link. Hmmm. Interesting.

      • Rachael says:

        I was thinking because if they find him not guilty, maybe they will just drop it, but what does that have to do with her though? I mean if she is guilty, she is guilty, if not, she’s not.

        But you have a point there. With GZ trial so public, regardless of the outcome to Shelllie’s, it would only put GZ trial out there more and someone needs to try to keep it out of the media as much as possible because his lawyer and brother sure as heck aren’t going to.

      • Trained Observer says:

        Lotsa possibilities:

        Kelly Sims, Mrs. Fogen’s attorney, is clearly playing for time Maybe :

        *) He’s still trying to get her to flip on Fogen in exchange for a dropped charge.
        *) He thinks evidence surfacing at Fogen trial will help her.
        *) He knows she’s gonna go for a plea deal, but that it depends on her Fogen trial testimony.
        *) He’s already got a plea in place for her, but they don’t want her guilty deal to jeopardize Fogen’s chance for acquital.
        * ) He’s got a delusional client who thinks it’ll all go away once Fogen is acquitted and they ride off tin the sunset to their anticipated “great life.”
        *) He’s got a realistic client who wants to spend every cuddly second with Fogen in the run-up to June 10 without the aggravation of considering her own legal woes.
        *) He just plain doesn’t want to move further with her proceedings until after Fogen’s mess gets spilled at trial for all to see.

      • two sides to a story says:

        I’m guessing her defense is banking on the perception of innocence put forward by the Fogen family and his defense that. Therefore, they’re hoping Fogen walks and that his innocence rubs off on her – that her case is either dismissed / she gets a sympathetic jury.

    • ay2z says:

      Now I see it, thanks Two sides!

  9. Rachael says:

    Does anyone know how to find out what happened with She’lLie’s court thing today? I’m sure it is long over by now, but what exactly was it and what happened? Anyone know?


  10. Kelly Payne says:

    More reference to that jewelery incident. and why it was leaked.

    • Rachael says:

      Did you see this one?


      We now know what the detectives revealed thanks to a recently fulfilled Freedom of Information Act request filed by the dogged researchers at a blogging collective known as The Conservative Treehouse. The “Treepers” have literally done more good work on the Martin case than all the newsrooms in America combined.

      They are over there patting each other and SD on the back.

      I’m gonna puke.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        Ptui. They’re twisting what was happening with the Miami school police and school issues to their own designs. I did a quick scan of the site above Rachael and it’s even more racist and less credible than the Treestump. *removes waders and goggles*

      • Rachael says:

        I know. I did too. Hard to believe anything could be worse than them. Just upsets me that there is more out there.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        Just more wingnut blogs. MSM doesn’t seem to be interested, just as they’re not interested in most of the Treestump’s skewed allegations.

      • Jun says:

        I would not even worry, WND has absolutely no credibility and their story has been debunked a lot frickin time ago

        Their first claim is that they make attempts not to arrest Black students

        Then they claim he has a criminal record, when he does not

        Then they claim there was stolen jewelry and a burglary tool, when, its already concluded that there never was any stolen jewelry or burglary tool

        Then they claim marijuana was found, when, they found an empty baggie with perceived marijuana, and in reality most cops do not care anyways about marijuana, and will generally just let it go if they find any on you

        Then they claimed the Treepers did good reporting, when those guys spin more conspiracy theories than people who wear tinfoil hats

        Lastly, it does not prove that the defendant acted in self defense

        and even if they wanted to use that material, it still does not prove a criminal history, because there was none, and it also opens the door to attack Fogen’s character, so they can go right ahead

        And it does not prove self defense

        • I agree that the site has no credibility.

          The author of the post relied on general statements that did not mention Trayvon in support of his claim that Trayvon received special treatment.

          The simple truth is that there never was any evidence regarding the value of the jewelry or evidence that it was stolen because no one had reported it stolen.

          Another simple truth is that a screwdriver has lots of legitimate uses and there was no evidence that the screwdriver in Trayvon’s possession had ever been used for any unlawful purpose.

          There was no basis to charge Trayvon with a criminal offense.

          Yet one more example of racist hatred overwhelming a person’s ability to reason.

          It’s a waste of time and effort to attempt to have a rational discussion with someone who is incapable of participating in such a discussion or who willfully refuses to do so.

          I have discovered that the best course of action is to ignore them completely.

      • Xena says:


        They are over there patting each other and SD on the back.

        I’m gonna puke.

        No — rejoice. The more they delve in effort to prove their BGI conspiracy theory, the more evidence they give of being White Supremacists supporting GZ. That means that they believe GZ committed a racial hate crime. The feds are no doubt having a party.

      • ay2z says:

        Prof said “I have discovered that the best course of action is to ignore them completely.”

        They do want to get attention and repetition of their ‘theories’ (to use the term very loosely).

        I don’t know that it helps to blow their theories out of the water or not as that’s what they thrive on. Now if they were making sense and there was rational discussion, but this seems like batting one’s head against the wall.

        I’m set on ignore, kick me if I slip!!! 😉

      • PiranhaMom says:

        @ Rachael.

        Yeah, the treepers are “dogged.”

        I got droppings all over the ranch that are either “coyote” or “dogged.”

        Take your pick.

  11. Trained Observer says:

    June 10, 2013: Start me up!

  12. ay2z says:

    To which Bernie responds “… do anything your little heart desires, you’ll come running back… time is on my side…. yes it is”.


  13. ay2z says:

    O’Mara baby, you’re out of time, Fred told us!

  14. Lonnie Starr says:

    I don’t know but, MOM has to come up with some very good arguments about why any investigators or experts are needed. An appeals court, just might take into account that, when MOM had the money to mount such a defense, it was obviously deemed so unnecessary, that Counsel allowed the money to be spend on other expenses, in spite of the fact that all parties knew, the seriousness of the charges being faced.

    The court would certainly have a right to know why, MOM and the defendant believed, that all of the money could be spent on matters, other than mounting the most effective defense possible. As if the defense took a fatalistic view of their ability to put on a defense. But, now that both time and money has run out, they’re desperately attempting to breathe importance into these once ignored matters. As a way to delay the inevitable conclusion.

    • Malisha says:

      It occurs to me that perhaps O’Mara has gone looking for experts but each time he has consulted somebody, that expert has said to him, “Sorry bub, this evidence does not show what you’re trying to get me to say, it actually shows much more clearly the OPPOSITE of your position, so I’m not your guy…”

      I have a friend who is a forensic expert (not in any of the areas needed by Fogen) who recently got a consult in a case and he consulted ME about it to see if I came to the same conclusion he had come to. He did not tell me if he was being hired by the plaintiff or defendant. It was an area about which I have specific knowledge but no credentials. I gave him my opinion. He said, “That was the conclusion I reached too, but I wanted to check it with someone who’s been out in the real world.” The conclusion we both reached was NOT useful to the party that had consulted him, so he did not get the gig. He was satisfied with that result because he said, “I don’t know how I could have concluded anything differently; just wanted to check.”

      It was a civil case in Florida. The other side doesn’t get to do discovery on how many or which experts TURNED THE CASE DOWN. There could be several more who did so as well.

      • Malisha said,

        It was a civil case in Florida. The other side doesn’t get to do discovery on how many or which experts TURNED THE CASE DOWN. There could be several more who did so as well.

        That’s the general rule everywhere except in insanity and diminished capacity cases where the defense is required to disclose unfavorable evaluations to the prosecution because the defendant’s mind is the only source of information.

      • Lonnie Starr says:

        The process of searching for expert testimony is covered by “Work Product” exclusion, so the number of queries or turn downs need not be revealed. Omar complains that he got all the gps data from Trayvon’s phone, except for 2/26/12, personally I don’t think he’s telling the truth, he simply doesn’t want to release it. He hasn’t included or stressed in his motions any demand for this particular data. BDLR is just sitting and watching to see how long Omar sits on the data.

        If that data shows what the detective says it does, then Omar isn’t searching for experts, after all, why bother? When your client is toast, your client is toast! Believe me GZ is toast!

        |||=> Tick Tock! Clink Clank <-|||

  15. Malisha says:

    Should have been:

    4/10/2012 – Time to face the music

    4/12/2012 – Time for O’Mara to take a good look at the case

    4/18/2012 – Time for O’Mara and West to sit down with Fogen, Fogenwife, and Fogenparents WITHOUT Osterman, Taaffe or the Outhousers

    5/1/2012 – Time for a realistic outline of the physical evidence in the caes

    6/1/2012 – Time for approaching some experts to see what they could make of the available evidence

    7/1/2012 – Time for a sit-down with BDLR to see if a plea deal was possible

    8/1/2012 – Time for Fogen to voluntarily return to jail so the money could be used for his defense OR for him to agree to a plea deal

    9/1/2012 – Time for Shellie to find work

    10/1/2012 – Time for Junior and Joe Oliver (both of whom have said they left work so they could devote their efforts to the case) to get two jobs apiece and economize to the max and devote all their income to either paying experts or making sure their best friend/bro got the best defense possible.

    11/1/2012 – Time to stop doxing, fussing, fuming, posting racist crap and carrying on like effing punks.

    12/1/2012 – Time for some genuine reflection and remorse.

    1/1/2012 – Time to wake up and smell the … well it ain’t roses.

    2/1/2012 – Time for Jeralyn Merritt and Alan Dershowitz to devote their full-time and call in all chits and favors to make sure Fogen gets a fair trial if he has not already pled out

    3/1/2012 – Time for the gun lobby to announce, “Fogen is not our hero”

    4/1/2012 – Time for a dose of reality

    4/17/2012 – Time to increase the dosage until you get “effective level”

    SAY GOOD-NIGHT, Gracie…

    “Good night, Gracie!”

    • Trained Observer says:

      @Malisha 1/1/2012 – Time to wake up and smell the … well it ain’t roses.

      This pretty much covers what should have been done every day since that fatal night. … and for the rest of Fogen’s miserable life. Ditto for his trashy family.

    • Rachael says:

      Speaking of Joe Oliver, who was said to have left work so he could devote his efforts to the case, what has ever happened to him?

      • towerflower says:

        He dropped off the grid after he was exposed by Piers Morgan as a fraud…….not a close friend of fogen.

    • Trained Observer says:

      And what are the Ostermans up to?

      • Rachael says:

        They all got pretty quiet, didn’t they. In some ways, makes me think they really are friends of GZ because they STFU and stepped back knowing they weren’t being helpful- unlike his own lawyer, his brother, mother and father who get him into trouble every time they open their fool mouths.

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          They went quiet when the boards began getting heavily into discussions of GPS data on the phones. BDLR says it’s no mystery to the prosecution how Trayvon went home, what route he took and whether he got there or not. GPS data was extracted from Trayvon’s phone, but the SP has not released the data for 2/26/12 MOM says he’s got the GPS data for every other day that Trayvon was in Sanford.

          I have no idea of what would justify the SP withholding that data. Unless the FBI has it and is holding it in contemplation of filing additional charges. Of course MOM is so sloppy he may already have that data and just doesn’t realize it.

          I think GZ’s friend are quiet because they’ve noted that the SP has collected everything they’ve had to say. MO has probably lost his job, because he’s on record as helping remove evidence from a crime scene, instead of assisting the police. Anyone else could be expected to be ignorant of the rules and procedures, but not an ex-LEO.

        • PiranhaMom says:

          @Rachael –

          Well, the Ostermans DID help.

          They put GZ on a diet.

          If GZ got slimmed down to a normal size, it would be difficult to emphasize the weight difference at the time of Zimmerman’s attack on Trayvon: 207 lbs. against 158.

          At his bond hearing, do you recall how much smaller he was, and appeared less threatening (when he didn’t glare)?

          No way is GZ going to be able to come into court June 10 looking svelte.

      • looolooo says:

        Joe Oliver was probably treated to a healthy dose of Zimmerman hospitality ……….. towards black people. That’s probably what happened to him. Also, Joonyah had been chomping at the bit to catapult himself in front of the camera and microphone, so Joe the schmoe had to go. Skank Taffee is probably continually tanked.

        And as for the Osterman’s, they’re probably keeping a low profile wondering if and when the hammer will drop down on him/them for his part in Trayvon’s tradgic murder. Not to mention his job as an air marshall has been compromised by revealing his identity. I wonder if he can be prosecuted for do so. Or at least fired. That is, if he really is an air marshall. Anther possibility is that maybe he has changed his mind, and determined that he WOULDN’T give his life for Fogen after some serious soul searching.

        I’m sure that his very young daughter is most appreciative that her daddy’s love for her has narrowly edged out his love for Fogen.


        • Lonnie Starr says:

          Osterman’s car is parked nowhere near Shelly’s car, since we have the report of both GZ’s car and Shelly’s car being checked. If MO had “drafted” in behind Shelly, most likely his car would have been parked somewhere near hers.

          There’s a question as to whether or not the back gate was locked down by the police. We know the front gate was, because we have a resident telling us she had to leave her car outside and walk in.

          Meanwhile Osterman’s book says he arrived behind Shelly as she was about to enter the rear (east) gate, and he drafted in behind her.
          That doesn’t seem to be true, since it would be way too much of a coincidence. Osterman mentions Oregon avenue, which runs past the north (front) gate, but makes no mention of So. Oregon avenue, which is the street that leads to the rear (east) gate.

          If Osterman did not arrive as he claims, then it’s probable that he entered the RATL before 7pm when the gates closed. That would explain his effort to claim the unlikely drafting in behind Shelly, as a mechanism to explain how he entered without using a code. Entering by coding in would be recorded, so if he arrived after the SPD and fire rescue had locked down the complex, this coding in should be recorded. Obviously if he entered before 7pm, then he needs to explain what he was doing there while GZ was on his NEN call, which started at 7:09pm., and which contains all kinds of suspicious background noises, some of which sound like speech.

          The SP already has these answers, so my best guess is that MO is in very deep doo doo, as such he has little desire to make things worse by blabbing like GZ.

      • JustMe says:

        Lonnie, MOM brought forth a motion demanding the GPS data yet it was never argued in any hearing. IMO, MOM has received the data and the reason why his TV stunts never included “my client is innocent” BS since.

    • Jun says:

      Did Jeralynn Meritt and the Dersh even donate money to Fogen?

      I bet you they did not

  16. time is running out for zimmerman

    tock…9 3

    time is forthcoming for the Martin family

  17. oh i give up on the clock LOL …

  18. tick 12
    tock 9 3
    tick 6

  19. from the sofa lap top of Judy Vallejos

    i have a silly question…can zimmerman get an appeal after he is convicted on the basis that omara did not request a SYG hearing?

    Hoodies Up!!!!!

    9 3

    • Malisha says:

      It woud seem to me that the failure to request/conduct a SYG hearing is NOT grounds for appeal unless the self-defense claim is successful in front of the jury, and if the self-defense claim is successful in front of the jury, the failure to request/conduct a SYG hearing is moot because there will be no appeal because there was no conviction.

      If the defendant does not get a SYG hearing and then gets convicted, the failure to request/conduct a SYG hearing is “harmless error” because the defendant got the chance to present his self-defense claim to the jury.

      • SearchingMind says:

        By “harmless error” is meant the error in the ruling of the trial court, not the “error” or conduct of the defense counsel(s).

      • SearchingMind says:

        Self-defense and SYG are not one and the same. The former constitutes an affirmative defense, while the latter is not a defense, but an immunity statute that shields the individual from arrest, criminal prosecution and/or civil liability.

        The burden of proof under both regimes are significantly different. In an SYG procedure, the defendat must prove by a preponderance of evidence that SYG immunity applies. If this is rejected, the case goes to trial where the defendant can still argue both SYG immunity and self-defense.

        If the defendant claims immunity under SYG Statute, motions for SYG hearing and the Court refuses to conduct that hearing, the “error” is NOT “harmless” because the defendant got his chance to present his self-defense to the jury”.

    • SearchingMind says:

      @ Judy Ann Vallejos

      I think the Professor should address your very good question.

      But before he does, let me say the following:

      Given at least the evidence available to the public, no showing can be made that any SYG Motion has any chance of success. As such, it cannot be said that O’Mara’s failure to file such a Motion constitutes “gross ineffectiveness of counsel” (that might be ground for direct appeal) or just ordinary “ineffectiveness of counsel” that might have changed the result of the proceeding (and thus form the basis for a post-conviction relief).

      BUT, if GZ claims SYG immunity and files a Motion in that regard, the trial Court is obliged to hear that Motion and render a ruling. If the trial Court refuses to conduct a hearing and GZ gets convicted, that conviction will be quashed on direct appeal.

      • Malisha says:

        Hasn’t O’Mara already pubicly announced that SYG does not apply to his client’s case? Would he still be able to demand a SYG hearing now and go forward with it effectively?

  20. SearchingMind says:


    Professor, could you clarify the following, because I am not sure that’s the case in all States of the Union:

    “If the jury were to convict the defendant and O’Mara failed to hire an investigator or an expert to assist in preparing for trial and putting on a defense, his failure to do those things could be raised in a state habeas petition AFTER THE APPEAL is UNSUCCESSFUL (emphasis added). Habeas petitions are based on evidence that is not in the record and typically are based on defense counsel’s failure to do something that he should have done. The failure asserted in this instance would be the failure to hire an investigator or expert. If that happened due to lack of money and O’Mara did not ask Judge Nelson to find the defendant indigent, the claim would be that he provided ineffective assistance of counsel by failing to make the request”.

    For example, in NY, there are three sets of (legal) firearms available to the defendant to challenge and take out his/her conviction:

    a. Direct post-conviction appeal;
    b. State post-conviction appeal and
    c. A federal and/or State habeas corpus claim.

    A defendant who wishes to base his defense on ‘ineffective counsel’ must do so:

    a. FIRST on Direct Appeal’, see e.g. People v. Terry, 44 A.D.3d 1157, 1159, 845 N.Y.S.2d 145, 147, (3d Dept. 2007);

    b. Federal habeas petition in federal court.

    • SearchingMind says:

      Professor, could you also review Reaves v. State, 669 So.2d 352 n. 1 (Fla. 4th DCA 1996). Apparently, under Florida law, ineffective counsel could (albeit under certain circumstances, e.g. “concession of error”) form a ground for Direct Appeal.

    • SearchingMind says:

      Equally, in Gordon v. State, 469 So.2d 795, 798 (Fla. 4th DCA 1985), Judge Anstead noted in his special concurrence:

      “I … write separately only to caution litigants that we will not ordinarily consider a claim of ineffective assistance of counsel on appeal…. Such claims ordinarily turn on issues of fact and both sides are entitled to present relevant evidence to the trial court to resolve those issues. It is only because of the gross and patent showing of ineffectiveness virtually conceded by the state on this record that we are taking the highly unusual step of intervening at this stage of the proceedings.”

      The conclusion could therefore be made that ‘ineffective counsel’ is NOT a priori excluded from direct appeal, as your beautifully written post might suggest (to some).

    • SearchingMind says:

      Also in Henley v. State, 23 Fla. L. Weekly D2421 (Fla. 4th DCA, Oct 28, 1998), the DCA ruled that a “showing of gross ineffectiveness” of counsel may indeed constitute ground for Direct Appeal.

      • Malisha says:

        But that appeal would have to be written by some other attorney(s), not O’Mara or West. That other attorney would be doing a critique of the work of O’Mara and West. It does not sound like a winning strategy for that other attorney, going forward and looking to do business in Central Florida, either way you look at it (gets a court to say O’Mara and West flubbed it badly or gets a court to say the appellate lawyer himself flubbed it badly).

        On the other hand, if Jeralyn Merritt or Alan Dershowitz were to take the appeal, pro bono, on behalf of Fogen, alleging ineffective assistance of counsel, that would be a show I would go to — with popcorn and chocolate covered raisins! But they would have to “pro hac” into Florida (unless they are already members of the FLorida Bar) on the bar license of someone who is already licensed there…oh dear, WHO?

      • SearchingMind says:

        Malisha, you need to abstract the argument from the Zimmerman case. What I addressed with that part of Professors post cited above in quotation marks are ‘general theoretical possibilities’ from the point of view of legal science and doctrines (regardless of the Zimmerman murder case). Jeralyn Merritt, Allan Dershowitz, popcorns, pro bono, pro hac, etc. have wholly nothing to do with it.

        Yes, lawyers do an aggressive academic critique of the works of other lawyers (who sleep on the job). Such is more than welcome to (a) improve the quality of legal protection of the Individual and (b) enhance the standard of the profession.

        And yes, some people have been wrongly convicted for a crime they did not commit because their counsels were either timid or flat-out deaf, blind and dumb (to put it mildly 🙂 ) and criminal convictions have been overturned on the ground of serious ineffectiveness of counsels (thanks to lawyers who are willing and ABLE to put the works of their fellow lawyers through the winger).

      • Malisha says:

        SearchingMind, I don’t get what you’re saying about what I said. The appeal WOULD have to be written by attorneys who had not been the ones who misfunctioned in the trial court, right? I am aware that attorneys criticize the work of other attorneys all the time and so forth but I was commenting on the political situation (not the legal situation) that pertains in this particular case. Attorneys interested in overturning a conviction on behalf of Fogen — while working pro bono of course — would be doing it by attacking the job done by the attorneys who lost the case below when, in point of fact, those attorneys had NOTHING to work with. A defendant they couldn’t afford to put on the stand, who had blabbed himself all over the place with the police AND with the public on national television, a case that stank to high heaven and unbeatable forensic evidence proving the prosecution’s case. It would be like criticizing the work of a faith healer to whom a cancer patient turned after all his vital organs had shut down and his chances were between null and zero.

  21. cielo62 says:

    >^..^< Not a good credit risk. Tisk, tisk.

  22. Xena says:

    For those wanting to post a word of encouragement to Trayvon’s parents and friends.


  23. Nellie Nell says:

    Funny they call it a Defense Fund when very little has been spent for defense. Bail being the most. Living expenses 2nd at over $65k, that pig never had it so good! The upgrades to MOM
    office. Last but not least, $35k on defense, but when you read what specifically, just seems like more upgrades for MOM.

    Heck, Trayvon had more money in his pocket than Fogen had in the bank during his customary Sunday trip to Target for groceries! Sick of that loser and his attorney!

  24. Zhickel says:

    “As long as George’s supporters continue to contribute, we will continue to rely on their generosity to conduct a vigorous defense for George.”


    • Rachael says:

      I’m not really sure I understand that. I mean if he isn’t getting enough money to pay for experts, then he still isn’t able to pay the experts, etc.

      Also, it says: “George has to stay in hiding and cannot work due to the notoriety of this case,”

      Is that right? Hmmm – remember this that his lying SOS brother said just recently: “RZ: Yeah, I do get to see George. It’s very rare. We both have extremely busy schedules. . . But he makes it to work and he participates in his defense,”

      • Malisha says:

        What they’re not understanding is that if Fogen’s case had a snowball’s chance in Hell the experts would be lining up asking for the privilege of testifying for FREE to show how great they were and to get the reputation of the “expert who cracked the Zimmerman case.”

        No experts without big bucks = no way an expert will touch this thing and subject himself/herself to cross-examination under oath

      • rayvenwolf says:

        the only way GZ is working is if a friend of the family/another relative gave him something to do and they probably aren’t paying him much. Hell he’s probably working under the table AND out of the sight of other employees. Since of course you know by now, if he wasn’t someone would have said something to the media.

      • Cercando Luce says:

        “…But he makes it to work and he participates in his defense.”

        He must have found job a slicing baloney.

      • Trained Observer says:

        Cercando — slicing baloney or shoveling shit.

    • Jun says:

      Their hate drives them

      Yeah right Omara is working pro bono

      I am willing to bet the main reason is Omara does not want to have to show Nelson the accounting for the money

      He’s gonna get in trouble for that, that is why

      The crazies will likely continue to donate

      I seen them spewing their hate towards an 8 year old boy, murdered by that terrorist and continuing to spread their hate, by using the Boston bombing now, and all that kid did was participate in a peace walk in regards to the Trayvon murder and the kid made a sign for Trayvon

      Their greed drives them too

      The main fact is Fogen is a liar, racist, and a psychopath and he saw how he riled up the crazies to give him money

      Fogen could care less about the crazies and what the money is meant for, but, who cares, eh?

  25. Kelly Payne says:

    He’s too stupid to be an attorney. Then again maybe he’s not look at Omara. Ok too stupid to be a good attorney.

  26. Two sides to a story says:

    Does anyone wonder who’s paying for Jr. to run around the country giving interviews? He claims to not be able to work . . . who is feeding and sheltering him?

  27. thejbmission says:

    snipped from article

    According to O’Mara, however, the defense is underwater by approximately $10,000. I doubt that includes the $28,000 claim for services rendered by the security company, unless O’Mara has paid down the balance. Therefore, the defense may be in more serious financial trouble.

    Well, that’s interesting. If Zimboy is out of money, who’s supporting him? Who’s paying the rent, utilities, cell phones, FOOD, etc, etc.. ? I guess it’s time for O’Mara to start dismantling that add-on he had constructed to his office. IIRC, one of the first things he did when he took what was left of Zimboy’s donations was to use “$40,000” to renovate his office.
    Hmm…I think Mr. O’Mara has some esplainin to d. Dat’s what me thinks. 😀 I smell a lawsuit in the works.
    Zimmerman v. O’Mara

    • Two sides to a story says:

      GZLC posts a monthly accounting of what donations come in and how they’re disbursed. Fogen’s supporters are supporting his living expenses. There’s still a trickle of money coming in.

    • PYorck says:

      I assume that some of it is in the form of unpaid bills (possibly including bills from O’Mara’s firm).

      You also have to keep in mind that the accounting covers only the official defense fund. GZ is not allowed to have any other bank accounts, but because of the family involvement that isn’t much of a restriction. His parents have their own website asking for donations an if you want to donate a bigger sum then I am sure it is possible to slip RZ Sr. and envelope bypassing even that.

  28. colin black says:

    colin black says: Kyllpyn I broke your comment up for you to assist in its reading..excellent reply bty,

    April 16, 2013 at 9:04 pm

    kllypyn says:

    April 16, 2013 at 3:17 pm

    I hope this is better…A repost because want to make sure you all are able to read it. An email, i sent to Mr nutcracker….. from Kelly Payne

    Dear Mr cracker or Bradman which ever you prefer. Your continued lies and slander against Trayvon and his family are quite disgusting..

    You know as well as i do That Trayvon was not killed in self defense. You also know as well as i do that Trayvon was begging for his life when he was killed. You know as well as i do that Zimmerman had Trayvon restrained by his shirts when he killed him..
    Trayvon was no match for a 208lb bouncer by himself in a fair fight Zimmerman could have snapped his neck like a twig. But we know based on the evidence you chose to ignore that Trayvon never touched him..

    In a fair fight the police would have found an unconscious teenager and an angry adult. Whether Trayvon missed 53 days of school is unknown,but highly unlikely because in most states if your child missed more than 20 he is called truant and the parents are taken to court. There are no known reports of Trayvon being deeply involved in drugs. Smoking weed a few times with your friends does not make you deeply involved in drugs.

    .Also not relevant Another one of your lies. You are taking advantage of peoples ignorance and stupidity. The only one with a thug history is Zimmerman. Now you have a new one,Trayvon has a suppressed Criminal record. he never had any record. you are making assumptions and lying. No one knows why he was transferred from his other school there was a rumor he was bullied at that other school which was never confirmed. Also not relevant..

    You mention MMA style blows. an obvious lie. Trayvon never knew martial arts mixed or otherwise.If he had Zimmerman would have ended up in the hospital and Trayvon would still be alive..

    The man who said that has changed his story numerous times. His gun was on his right rear hip. It would have been impossible for him to grab it the way he described. .

    Trayvon would never have seen it. the only way he could have grabbed his gun the way he described is if he knocked trayvon off then grabbed his gun aimed and shot him. His head was never repeatedly slammed into the sidewalk for nearly a minute.If it had he would not have been in any condition to fire a gun..

    Those injuries on the back of his head are 1 round puncture wound and 1 inch long cut.the blood from those wounds flow toward his face.He was not on his back when he got those injuries. . He did not get those from a side walk. He got those from a metal object.

    Trayvon never tried to smother him another obvious lie. He was never punched in the face 12 times or 30-40 times. All he had were scratches. no bruising no swelling no black eyes no broken nose. As for lying Zimmerman has done nothing but lie. maybe you and him belong together. Whether Dee Dee went to Trayvon’s funeral or to the hospital or somewhere is irrelevant and not material to the case.the only thing relevant is why there was a funeral in the first place..

    If Zimmerman had left Trayvon alone he wouldn’t be in trouble. You continue to trot out that lie that Trayvon was a gang member despite the fact he was unarmed. No gang member goes anywhere with out their weapons which these days would be a gun..

    If trayvon had been a gang member he would have put a bullet in Zimmerman’s head just for following him. And we would never have heard of Zimmerman he would just be another statistic..

    You call trayvon a thug while trying to intimidate a witness. Which as it turned out those girls were not the Dee Dee you have been looking for. Keep it up when you get criminal charges you will have no one to blame but yourself. You so called conservatives always talk about morals christian values honesty and decency. You have no morals you are not honest and you were never a decent man..

    You are not a christian either. A true christian would not pull the crap you’ve been pulling,and he would not support a murderer and slander a murder victim..

    I can’t speak for the Martin/Fulton family but if it were me i would have sued you long ago. So keep.posting those lies. You will eventually Dig yourself a hole you can’t get out of. There is never a justification for killing an unarmed person,especially a kid. If someone hits you you hit them back you don’t use a gun. Have a nice day KELLY D PAYNE.


  29. No money Mo problems. See you June 10th Fogen

  30. Unabogie says:

    I do find it fascinating to guess what happened to half a million dollars if no experts were hired. Where the hell did the money go? Wasn’t George forbidden to have a bank account? Half a million dollars is really hard to spend over the course of one year if you aren’t traveling or buying expensive things. They don’t own a home, they have a truck already, and they have a steady income of donations from his fans. WHAT THE HELL DID THEY DO WITH ALL THAT MONEY?

    • ay2z says:

      The only people who should really care about what happened to the money, are those whose money filled the coffers. The donors might well be concerned that they backed a fake cause, on the strength of promises of immunity through a SYG or immunity hearing.

      But then, give someone a gift, there are no promiises of performance. (but they can stop donating to a failure of a cause).

      • ladystclaire says:

        They did back a fake cause because, he hadn’t even been charged with a crime, when he set that beg site up. My guess is that he set that site up in order to get enough in donations, to leave the country.

    • Xena says:

      Porterhouse and T-bone steaks through room service everyday for two people adds up.

      With GZ’s weight gain, he’s probably had to buy new underwear in a larger size on a monthly basis.

      ShelLIE must do her hair and nails.

      • PiranhaMom says:


        Certainly it’s reasonable for O’Mara to upgrade his office furniture from chairs to loveseats (w/extra-duty steel springs) to accommodate client visits.

    • ladystclaire says:

      What do you want to bet, that they have socked some of that money away some where. maybe a certain safe deposit box?

      • tonydphotog says:

        That’s pretty much a guarantee! I’m under the impression that we’re only hearing about the PayPal donations, since there’s a record, and not the donations sent by mail. Cash donations can easily be hidden for a “rainy” day.

      • Trained Observer says:

        Frankly, I don’t think they have much squirreled away for a rainy day, because they’re too stupid to do so.

        And I agree with Zena that Porterhouse and T-bones via room service add up. Especially when it’s $5 for baked potatoes or onion rings on the side. And don’t forget desserts for their pie holes

        Hey, pancakes for all — including visitors like his whispering sister and security. (Remember, Fogen likes to play the big man on his little campus. Am still laughing about Fogen’s bravado in the jailhouse phone call where he boldly instructs the Missus to buy bulletproof vests for themselves — and O’Mara, too, by cracky. Nothin’ but the best for his lawyeeeer!)

        Before his first bond was revoked, they squandered a ton of money on elaborate phone and Internet service up north where their hideout trailer was located. They have rented and leased assorted vehicles in their nomadic machinations.

        Could be Mrs. Fogen’s lawyer is not working pro bono, so his fees would have been a drain … likely annoying O’Mara no end.

        Actually, it’s easy to see how this grifting couple could breeze through a half mil with no difficulty at all.

      • LeaNder says:

        tony, lady, I think the prof wrote about a sum nearing half a million with the fact in mind that the official O’Mara defense account started off with 132,937,2, but that was not all the money Fogen had raised,

        CNN, April 28, 2012

        Zimmerman collected about $204,000 in donations through the website, …Zimmerman, 28, was released Monday on $150,000 bail, 10% of which was put up to secure his release while he awaits trial on a second-degree murder charge in Martin’s February 26 death.

        I do löve numbers:

        150,000 – 1,500 = 148,500

        Or put another way:
        204,000 – 132,937,2 – 1,500 = 69,562,80, that’s the sum not accounted on the fundraising website. If he told the real number to start with.

        Now you can add this sum to his security and household expenses listed on the O’Mara fund site which then would be: 204.053,11 Fogen’s expenses in 2012, over eight month. (If I may add a fictive number to visualize matters assuming similar monthly expenditures for a whole year not just for 8 month: 306,079,67 a year).

        So this part of the whole cake was for GZ alone. One can now use the numbers given by team O’Mara and add it to the “money that disappeared” from his accounting..

        total money raised 2012: 383.661,87
        money spent (or hidden?) by or for Fogen alone: 204.053,11 or 53 %
        money spent for the bond 95,000 25%.

        What is odd is that the expenditure number is pretty similar to what Fogen raised himself to start with. In other words the numbers suggest that Fogen managed to get pretty much the sum he raised for himself and Shellie and or their security. At least the two numbers we have looked at it this way are pretty similar, aren’t they?

      • LeaNder says:

        ooops no idea how “löve” happened. No German phonetic error I can assure you though.

      • LeaNder says:

        OK, my mistake. I thought he only put up 10 percent of the money for bond, since there was talk about the family paying part of it.

        Any way, I loved the results, but they remain pretty close. From the 204.000 collected by Fogen he manages to spend 190, 553,11 spent on household or security. And the disappeared money is 56, 062,80 only.

        What a pity, I loved the number collected and spent (?) being the same pretty much.

        I am assuming no one is interested in my play with numbers anyway. And the percentage for Fogen’s needs in 2012 only changes slightly anyway. Neither does the general picture it feels..

      • Two sides to a story says:

        That’s a thought, TO – what we think is a high cost of living might just include some monthly payments to SZ’s lawyer included in the monthly living expense so as not to rile the paying supporters.

      • Malisha says:

        I believe he has a lot of cash stashed.

  31. abbyj says:

    Thank you, Professor. You provide very interesting and compelling explanations as to the current disarray of the defense and their few options.

  32. Kelly Payne says:

    Fearful huh. He didn’t care about Trayvon’s fear. He heard the fear in his voice,he killed him anyway. He saw the fear on his face,he killed him anyway. He saw the tears on his face as he panicked and desperately tried to escape,he killed him anyway. Hopefully he’ll have plenty of time to feel nothing but fear for the rest of his useless life. Trayvon had goals ,the year before he was killed. he began researching colleges and the SATs. just months before he was killed. He had visited his brother at his college. The worse thing he ever did was smoke weed,and wrote on a locker which i heard was just a silly prank. He was a typical teenager. Who did not deserve to go to his death screaming. Zimmerpunk,on the other is nothing more than a punk and a bully.

    • The worse thing he ever did was smoke weed,and wrote on a locker which i heard was just a silly prank. He was a typical teenager.

      So true! Speaking of pranks…my son popped fire-crackers in the band hall 2 weeks before graduation. (**faints**) It was just a silly prank.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        LOL, Southern Girl

        The graduating classes at our (former) local high school used to make their folks faint almost every year! I was grateful that my kids didn’t happen to take part in any of that, though it was funny and harmless stuff. The part that was dicey is that they somehow always managed to get inside the school after hours to pull their pranks.

    • Trained Observer says:

      You’ve put it all in such accurate perspective, Kelly. May Fogen live in fear for the rest of his miserable days.

  33. Two sides to a story says:

    I wonder if it’s all that unusual for a high-profile case whose attorney or attorneys have pledged to work pro bono to be on a shoestring. Does it really matter all that much if Fogen’s team is in the hole? After all, they’ve managed to make it this far.

    • Investigators and experts do not work for free and it’s not reasonable to expect a lawyer working pro bono to pay them.

      The court has to appoint investigators and experts to be paid at public expense when their assistance is reasonably necessary to provide effective assistance of counsel to an indigent defendant.

      • Two sides to a story says:


        So who pays investigators in these high-profile pro bono cases? Are there always fundraisers? Do many end up declaring indigency after an attorney has managed most of the case?

        Is there ever a time when attorneys don’t pay for the necessary experts and the state doesn’t do anything about it? Hypothetically? What happens then? Appeals?

        OM complains about time and money to be able to hire experts, and yet there has been money available in the past, considering 40k was was spent on office improvements that may not have been completely necessary for the case to proceed. He seems out of his depth, yet he has West and the the lady lawyer working with him . . . I realize he must also be working other cases in order to make a living. Must suck being OM.

        • Xena says:

          @Two sides.

          He seems out of his depth, yet he has West and the the lady lawyer working with him . . .

          O’Mara didn’t have a clue as to what type of client he is dealing with. Demanding, paranoid, co-dependent, with parents that won’t allow him to live under their roof.

          When O’Mara took over the defense fund, he said he was earmarking $28,000 for GZ’s living expenses. Had donations stopped right then, and with that amount earmarked, O’Mara would have had enough money for expert witnesses and office improvements.

          The problem seems to have come with GZ living in an extended stay hotel; using AIS for investigations and 24/7 security along with their own hotel room next to that of GZ and ShelLIE’s.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        Xena – seems like they work at cross-purposes to one another. THat office improvement bit on top of the unnecessary security expenses really got me wondering if anyone was really in control of anything!

        • Xena says:

          @Two sides.

          Xena – seems like they work at cross-purposes to one another.

          When Anderson Cooper asked O’Mara about the cost of GZ’s defense, O’Mara only spoke of his fees being around half a million. He did not speak about expert witnesses nor costs of discovery. So yes, O’Mara and GZ have worked against each other when it comes to money. O’Mara wants it for himself, and GZ doesn’t want him to have a penny for anything.

      • ladystclaire says:

        I read somewhere, that O’mara bought an office building and, it undoubtedly was purchased with some of the donated money. like I said, I don’t remember where I read it but, I read it and, maybe that was the office that was upgraded.

        • PiranhaMom says:

          My understanding it was for computers and programs for the interns (the propaganda crew) Some extra desks and file cabinets, likely. Maalox & Excedrin, too. $40,000 only goes so far..

      • ladystclaire says:

        The thing that I don’t understand is, why doesn’t Fogen and the lying Mrs. go hide out with the rest of the Zimmerman trash, in what ever cesspool they are residing in.

        I don’t believe for one minute that this family is in hiding at all. they are only doing this BS in order to bilk IDIOTS out of money. this IMO should amount to extortion.

      • Trained Observer says:

        Some of us have made snide remarks regarding the fact that Gladazz and her whiny hubs have not put Fogen up at their place.

        To be fair, it does occur to me that maybe they can’t.

        Depending on where their residential property is in Lake Mary, it could be they are under an HOA, where rules prevent them from sheltering a guy up on Murder2 … and accused of being a child molester. Just sayin’ …

      • Trained Observer says:

        Oh, and when I say some of us, that definitely includes me!
        Also, I didn’t mean to suggest that any of this trashy clan is currently living at the Lake Mary address homesteaded to Gladazz and Boobles.

        If they are renting that homesteaded property out to others unrelated while they are doing their alleged nomadic hideout thing, that could provide county and state tax issues for them down the road. Such a pity 🙂 .

      • towerflower says:

        I don’t think fogen is in an extended stay hotel anymore. I believe they are renting a home either in a gated community or one that is secluded without any neighbors. When he left Osterman’s it was said he rented a mobile home in Maryland to hide out in.

    • Jun says:

      Reasonable speaking, since the lawyers worked pro bono, that means Fogen did not spend a single dime on his defense

  34. colin black says:

    INDIGNANT is what I meant to say above.

  35. colin black says:

    Im positive foggagge is feeling very indignat at presant fearfull also.
    Right about now time will be passing by for him at relative speed.

    When the chances are that each of the next 55 days count down to your trial.

    And ultimite imprison ment time speeds up three days pass at the rate of one.
    An its all relative to how close the trial is.

    The closer it aproaches the faster time speeds up so in reality.
    Foggagge only has a few days of hideing out before he is exposed in front of the world…

    And then sent to prison were he will get all that speeded up time back because in prison time passes relatively slow.

  36. Trained Observer says:

    Experts? At this juncture, O’Mara needs nothing less than Siegfried and Roy

    • colin black says:

      I thought a Lion eat one of them?

      • Xena says:

        @Colin Black

        I thought a Lion eat one of them?

        Your comment reminded me of a picture that circulated of a man dressed in a pink cat suit with the caption “The cat that ate Roy.”

        It was a tiger, and the tiger didn’t eat him. Turns out that Roy was having a stroke, and it is thought that the tiger was trying to get him off his feet. When you have a 500 pound tiger get on you, it’s mauling. I understand they are back entertaining in Vegas, but I could be wrong.

        • PiranhaMom says:

          @ Xena,

          Didn’t the big cat try to carry him to safety by the nape of the neck, like it would for a kitten?

          • Xena says:


            Didn’t the big cat try to carry him to safety by the nape of the neck, like it would for a kitten?

            Long time since I read that story, but that sounds familiar.

      • rayvenwolf says:


        That is the thought. I was still living in vegas at the time(born and raised) and S&R still are big fixtures in the city so the story was all over every news station. I honestly believe if Manticore was actually attacking Roy and/or viewed him as prey Roy, wouldn’t have made it out alive, or would have been a lot more injured.

        • PiranhaMom says:


          MomCats carry their kittens by the skin of their necks – cats’ skin is so flexible and loose on the back of their necks, so the Mom takes a fold of skin gently between her teeth. And it has a calming effect on the kitten.

          But humans are not built that way.

          If Manticore meant any harm he would have snapped Roy’s head quickly, and Roy would have been dead.

          I understand that Manticore is still alive and with them, and they are all doing well. It has been a long recovery for Roy Horn, but it would have been much slower (or impossible) if Manticore had been put down.

          • rayvenwolf says:

            Very true. S&R are bonded with their animals the same way the rest of us are with our pets. it would have been devastating for Roy to have come to to find out that an animal he’d known and worked with since it’s birth had been put down on the assumption it had attacked him.

      • towerflower says:

        That’s what I understood too, that the cat was trying to carry him offstage like a kitten and the grip on his neck caused him more problems.

  37. PiranhaMom says:


    Does O’Mara need his client’s permission to file for indigent status?

    If he were to file, say, on April 23, how long does Judge Nelson have for her response?

    If she approved, but included appointment of a master (In my opinion, the only conclusive way to go) how long would it take them to examine the audit trail of the Zimmerman beg-a-thon? Could they do it in 90 days?

    After the master reports back to the judge, would that be a public document? Would donors’ names have to be redacted?

    How long would it take Judge Nelson to then rule on the request?

    If she rules that GZ may have a court-appointed (court-paid) investigator who could then appoint individual investigators in certain specialties, do thee “sub-investigators” have to be approved by the Court?

    Would all their investigations be concluded within 6 months? Nine months?

    Bottom line: with the prospect of indigent status for GZ, could the trial be delayed MORE THAN A YEAR if he is granted indigent status?

  38. Xena says:

    Professor, do you think that O’Mara hasn’t made a move to motion to find GZ indigent because he has failed to find experts beneficial to GZ?

    Some months ago you wrote about the type of experts the prosecution and defense should hire. What are your thoughts about experts for the defense now?

    • I doubt he is qualified to decide whether he needs experts. I believe he needs a consultant to review the lab reports and recommend qualified experts in the relevant forensic areas.

      With the following exceptions, I’m going to dodge your second question for now because I would have to review the discovery before attempting to answer it.

      Obviously, a pathologist to review the autopsy report, a blood spatter expert, a DNA expert, and firearms expert to compare the holes in the sweatshirts to the entry wound.

      • Xena says:

        @Professor. Thanks for the response. I anxiously await the defense’s expert witness list. They needed an extension to file it, which says “Not prepared for prime time.”

      • Tzar says:

        Xena says:
        April 16, 2013 at 9:45 pm

        @Professor. Thanks for the response. I anxiously await the defense’s expert witness list. They needed an extension to file it, which says “Not prepared for prime time.”

        To be fair they needed time for the doxing adventures and to interview neighbors…ooh not to mention to do interviews and stuff

        • Xena says:


          To be fair they needed time for the doxing adventures and to interview neighbors…ooh not to mention to do interviews and stuff

          (Gulp) LOL!!! Yeah — and Junior’s racial rants that was suppose to bring in $10,000 overnight from White Supremacists.

      • Jun says:

        WHat if hiring experts is pointless?

        No expert is gonna risk losing future business, credibility, and getting indicted on perjury and perversion of justice to say the evidence matches the defendant’s claims

        There’s only one way the shot could have been fired, and that is if the defendant tugged down on the hoodie and undershirt of the victim

        There was zero Trayvon dna on the gun, therefore, there were no blood drops, so Trayvon could not have been hovering over Fogen

        There’s absolutely no dna transfer whatsover on Trayvon’s hands, sleeves, arms, cuffs, which means Fogen’s beating story is a load of crap and only the really stubborn right wing wackos keep preaching it even though the forensics make it scientifically impossible to happen

  39. @ Abbyj!

    Sky says hi! 😉

  40. First again! Woot!

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