Featuring: Part III of LLMPapa’s Cardboard and Bullshit

LLMPapa follows his gripping Part II yesterday with Part III of Cardboard and Bullshit regarding the kill shot.

Cain’t hardly wait for Part IV.

This entry was posted on Sunday, March 3rd, 2013 at 7:03 pm and is filed under Featuring, Forensic Science, George Zimmerman, Kill Shot, LLM Papa, Martin's Sweatshirts in Zimmerman Case, Michael Knox, Trayvon Martin, Trayvon's Hoodie. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

157 Responses to Featuring: Part III of LLMPapa’s Cardboard and Bullshit

  1. Malisha says:
    March 4, 2013 at 2:45 pm

    At first it was fairly black and white. A white guy killed a Black guy so the white cops let him walk. But then it got complicated because the white guy was not white and then he was Black and then the guy who looked Black was just a punk instead of a coon. Soon afterwards there were Black racists who were attempting to kill a Black Afro-Peruvian who had so many Black friends he could have made his own march but his token white friend hated him more than anyone of the American race. Then his white friend was fed up and wouldn’t take it any more while Trayvon-like dudes were there with their pants down. But not really Trayvon-like dudes; he had short-term vision. And two lawyers scooted but a terrible, terrible prosecutor showed up and then the homicide detective wrote three more drafts and one of them was wrong. But all that didn’t matter because it was, first of all, God’s plan and second of all, those of us of the American race are protecting our constitutional rights.

    Reply
    • pat deadder says:
      March 4, 2013 at 5:02 pm

      Oh Malisha I just don’t how you do it.You make me laugh till tears come down no matter how many times I read it.I will be first in line to buy a book you’ve written.

      Reply
  2. Crane-Station says:
    March 4, 2013 at 12:02 pm

    Wow. Yet another nut job/Zimm supporter news station, let this one slip, and I honestly don’t think the author even realizes the Freudian nature of the slip:

    “At first, it seemed fairly black and white”:

    Read more: http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/national/george-zimmerman-trayvon-martin-case-update-is-public-opinion-changing-in-zimmerman-case#ixzz2MaifN0iS

    Reply
    • fauxmccoy says:
      March 4, 2013 at 12:31 pm

      i caught that one too – how could anyone be it reporter, editor on up be that dense? stevie wonder could see there’s something wrong here!

      Reply
      • Crane-Station says:
        March 4, 2013 at 1:41 pm

        You know what I’ve decided? I’m not going to call these asinine statements ‘Freudian slips’ anymore. I am going to assume that the author meant to say what he said, and he DID say it.

        Therefore, the author is 100 percent correct: At first it WAS a black and white issue.

        Fuck it. I am tired of giving any credit to nut-job ‘journalists’ who are not capable of writing anything coherent.

        Reply
  3. Frederick Leatherman says:
    March 4, 2013 at 10:26 am

    New Post Up:

    Crime laboratories must be subjected to mandatory blind proficiency testing

    Reply
  4. shannoninmiami says:
    March 4, 2013 at 8:51 am

    Does anyone know how to fix their comment notifications? It’s been since the 27-28 of feb. but I just noticed this weekend. Thanks for any info.

    Reply
  5. Zhickel says:
    March 4, 2013 at 6:11 am

    @Xena – you said:
    “Have you noticed there are three objects that GZ does not mention when they dropped during the altercation? His key chain flashlight, his tactical flashlight, and Trayvon’s cell phone. GZ does not want to bring attention to those objects. That is why my attention is brought to an association with the tactical flashlight and possibility that Trayvon captured it on photo or video.”

    Good observation regarding GZ’s avoidance of mentioning those objects. What we know of his behaviour since then may make this significant by its omission. George is as subtle as a plane crash and anything he tries to skate around, ignore or minimise should be looked at very closely.

    I don’t believe Trayvon took any photos or video, but……at the time of the shooting, George may have THOUGHT he did, thus the hurried frisking of Trayvon’s body. Not looking for a weapon but a phone/camera that he was going to dispose of before police arrived.

    Reply
    • Xena says:
      March 4, 2013 at 7:01 am

      @Zhickel

      I don’t believe Trayvon took any photos or video, but……at the time of the shooting, George may have THOUGHT he did, thus the hurried frisking of Trayvon’s body. Not looking for a weapon but a phone/camera that he was going to dispose of before police arrived.

      I agree that Trayvon would not have used his cell phone to photograph or video after he ran. He was on the phone with DeeDee and she heard a “bump” and the connection was then lost.

      However, before he ran is a different story. Going by GZ’s words “He’s got something in his hands,” it was either a cop set-up to substantiate a good shoot, or he actually saw something in Trayvon’s hands other than the 7-Eleven bag, and it might have been Trayvon’s cell phone. There were a few minutes between the time that Trayvon left the mail shed when his call with DeeDee disconnected, and when she called him again at 7:12 p.m.

      BTW, there is another omission. GZ omits when Jon took the photo of the back of his head. GZ’s story has a sequence of seeing someone with a flashlight and discovering it was Jon, to seeing another flashlight and discovering it was Off. Smith.

      Off. Smith then cuffed GZ, took his gun, and placed him in the back seat of the police car. The photo of GZ that Jon took shows that GZ is kneeling or sitting outside and using his cell phone.

      Reply
  6. Big Willie says:
    March 4, 2013 at 4:52 am

    @yahtc
    What do you think gz saw when he told the NEN dispatcher, “He has something in his hand”?

    It is only by God’s grace that Foggen didn’t shoot and murder Trayvon when he told NEN “he’s got something in his hands. He’s coming to check me out”, otherwise Foggen might have gotten away with murder.

    Reply
    • Rachael says:
      March 4, 2013 at 5:23 am

      He didn’t say in his hand. He said his hand was in his waistband.

      Reply
      • Big Willie says:
        March 4, 2013 at 11:31 am

        @Rachel

        I’m quoting his call at the 1:20 mark, not the 1:03 mark.

        He’s got something in his hands. I don’t know what his deal is. [01:20]

        He’s got his hands in his waist band. And he’s a black male.[1:03]

        Reply
      • Big Willie says:
        March 4, 2013 at 11:38 am

        I placed “He’s coming to check me out”, out of order.

        I hope Foggen does sue me.

        Reply
      • Big Willie says:
        March 4, 2013 at 11:42 am

        I meant to say “doesn’t”. I’m still sleepy.

        Reply
    • Malisha says:
      March 4, 2013 at 10:30 am

      We make a mistake when we try to figure out what Fogen perceived when he said this or that; most of the time he is just making that shit up, and hasn’t perceived (with the senses, that is) ANYTHING to give rise to it. Most of the time he is using only his imagination to describe what he claims to perceive.

      What was in Trayvon’s hands? Who knows? It doesn’t matter. Fogen was lying in his description of Trayvon Martin’s actions from the get-go and he wasn’t going to describe any realities anyway. “He’s got something in his hands” and “he’s got his hands in his waistband” and “he’s a real suspicious guy” are all just Fogen’s lies to try to set up the scene he wanted to play. Puppet-master. Unskilled. Not ready for prime time. Good enough for the SPD.

      Reply
      • Xena says:
        March 4, 2013 at 11:32 am

        @Malisha

        We make a mistake when we try to figure out what Fogen perceived when he said this or that; most of the time he is just making that shit up, and hasn’t perceived (with the senses, that is) ANYTHING to give rise to it.

        It’s easy to figure out actually. GZ uses something he knows or that is true, then he builds lies around it. For instance, that he faced Trayvon when hearing “You got a problem?”

        GZ was face-to-face- to Trayvon when Trayvon asked “What are you following me for?”

        There’s lots of examples I can give along with the Freudian slips.

        Reply
      • towerflower says:
        March 4, 2013 at 12:36 pm

        Exactly Malisha, he was playing it up for the cops to get them out there quicker, what better way then to make it seem like the suspicious person was also armed. He wanted to be the hero again, this one was not getting away.

        Reply
    • looolooo says:
      March 4, 2013 at 2:06 pm

      I believe the Fogster was exaggerating or lying when he said Trayvon was coming to check him out. Not unlike the ridiculous vehicle circling lie. Fogen was simply saying things to convince Sean to send a cruiser.

      Reply
  7. MisterS says:
    March 3, 2013 at 11:18 pm

    There was no Trayvon DNA on the coat or arm of Zimmerman for GZ to have grasped the arm and then pull his gun . This is all of course if you can believe that young Martin could see in the dark to grab at a gun that GZ forgot he had .

    Reply
  8. ladystclaire says:
    March 3, 2013 at 10:46 pm

    Fogen has a court date on Tuesday so, does anyone know what time court will convene? pretty soon, he won’t be able to waddle into anybody’s courtroom.

    Reply
  9. Frederick Leatherman says:
    March 3, 2013 at 10:24 pm

    Thought you all might enjoy this comment to my post on CNN’s puff piece. I fished it out of the spam folder. The person subsequently corrected this Freudian slip:

    Probably the most ill-informed article I’ve read. What is with Trayvon supporters? It’s like you live in this weird bubble where you ignore everything but reality.

    The person shall remain nameless.

    Reply
    • Crane-Station says:
      March 3, 2013 at 10:27 pm

      Love that slip! Person relies on CNN for all his reality needs, LOL.

      #NutFarm
      #Ring-a-Ding-Ding

      Reply
    • Puck says:
      March 3, 2013 at 11:41 pm

      My specialty is the sociology of U.S. right-wing politics. I call the “weird bubble” (often referred to as an alternate reality), “realishness.” It’s the ontological and phenomenological analogue to Colbert’s epistemological truthiness.

      Reply
      • Puck says:
        March 3, 2013 at 11:43 pm

        … and it’s where the Zidiot Nation is located in social spacetime. A big warp called realishness.

        Reply
      • shannoninmiami says:
        March 4, 2013 at 12:20 am

        “It’s the ontological and phenomenological analogue to Colbert’s epistemological truthiness”

        HOW DARE YOU SAY THAT!!

        I couldn’t help myself 😉

        Reply
      • Two sides to a story says:
        March 4, 2013 at 6:22 am

        Realishness. LOL!

        Reply
      • Frederick Leatherman says:
        March 4, 2013 at 8:05 am

        Puck said,

        My specialty is the sociology of U.S. right-wing politics. I call the “weird bubble” (often referred to as an alternate reality), “realishness.” It’s the ontological and phenomenological analogue to Colbert’s epistemological truthiness.

        Wow! What a comment.

        Most excellent, my dear Puck.

        Reply
      • Crane-Station says:
        March 4, 2013 at 8:15 am

        Best sentence I have seen in print today.

        What I find difficult is, one cannot reason with non-reason. Plus, when the side one is debating with makes up facts, non-stop, it’s hard to keep up. Zimmerman has changed his story so many times, I’m seasick. But to cut him a break, he’s not unique in that. And the weird thing is, most of the made-up stuff is unnecessary. I mean, just pick one version, and we’ll go with that: Was he walking leisurely, skipping or running? Were there, or were there not, bushes? Did you say ‘fucking punks’ or did you say ‘fucking coons?’

        Reply
        • PiranhaMom says:
          March 4, 2013 at 10:45 pm

          @Crane –

          You now why Zimmerman sez Trayvon came out of the bushes? Even though they are all – Zimmerman & cops & Osterman – standing in broad daylight and looking at the miniature shrubbery no higher than 18″ that would not even come up to Trayvon’s knees? And Serino lets him babble on because the lies are getting so rich?

          The reason Zimmerman has “bushes” on his miniature brain is that he ran into the bushes as he ran between the condos to ambush Trayvon by the dogwalk, chased him north away from Brandy’s home, grabbed Travon, took him to ground, gained the upper position and shot him.

          As he drew his gun and leaned forward to execute Trayvon, the fresh contusions bled diagonally across Zimmerman’s head. I do think he likely scraped te back of his head on a spribkler head, but he has a number of other dings which could only have come from “those killer bushes.”

          I don’t know what kind of “bushes” are between the buildings but because light is so limited in those areas (the height of the buildings blocking the sun for most daylight hours) that anything trying to grow there woud be tall and scraggly, reaching for the sky. In February, few leaves to shield human skin from running into lower branches.

          Poor, poor Zimmerman – every hand’s against him – even the landscaping!

          Reply
          • Xena says:
            March 4, 2013 at 10:58 pm

            @PiranhaMom. Amazing that GZ would even say that Trayvon was hiding anywhere. He said he couldn’t get his flashlight to work. Based on Dave’s video, it was so dark that GZ would not have been able to see Trayvon anyway — no need to hide.

          • PiranhaMom says:
            March 4, 2013 at 11:14 pm

            @Xena,

            Right! It was the dark of night! Pitch black! And Trayvon was .. well … and there was all that black rain! And the buildings were black! And the helicopters couldn’t fly! But even if they could, Zimm couldn’t signal them in because his black (sigh … ) tactical flashlight wouldn’t shine! And he had forgotten that his black (deeper sigh … ) Kel-Tek was faithful and true and stuck on the flab of his ummmm –
            blackside. NO! Backside. So I guess Zimmerman just blacked – er, blocked all that out of his memory. Except for the voodoo bushes sticking pins in him …

            So that’s how he proved to Serino that he was telling the absolute truth: that this 340 lb. linebacker, 6′ 8″ tall, came out of the 10 ft. tall trees, snarked some bad 1970’s TV gang dialog his way, and yup & whupped him.

            Yesssss, ma’am!

            Terrified those trees so much, they shrunk from fright. Yesssssiree, ma’am.

          • Crane-Station says:
            March 4, 2013 at 11:00 pm

            One of my favorite parts of the walk-through is the priceless look on Z’s face when he realizes that the body was located 40 feet away from where Z was claiming he was viciously attacked. I wondered what he was going to do during those extra forty feet and found it quite hilarious when he sort of waved his arms around while walking to the real place where he shot Trayvon.

          • Xena says:
            March 4, 2013 at 11:12 pm

            @Crane-Station

            I wondered what he was going to do during those extra forty feet and found it quite hilarious when he sort of waved his arms around while walking to the real place where he shot Trayvon.

            You mean, like this?

          • Crane-Station says:
            March 4, 2013 at 11:37 pm

            OMG, Yes! Priceless.

          • fauxmccoy says:
            March 5, 2013 at 12:05 am

            @crane — while he was simultaneously batting at the bats in his belfry?

            bats in the belfry, shoo bats, shoo!

          • Crane-Station says:
            March 5, 2013 at 12:09 am

            Exactly. What the actual heck was he doing? For FORTY feet?

          • fauxmccoy says:
            March 5, 2013 at 12:11 am

            dude’s gotta lotta bats … batshit crazy he is 🙂

          • Xena says:
            March 5, 2013 at 12:30 am

            @Crane-Station

            Exactly. What the actual heck was he doing? For FORTY feet?

            Especially since he told Singleton that he was knocked down by the first punch.

            Alert: Strong language

          • Crane-Station says:
            March 5, 2013 at 8:33 am

            LOL, speaking of strong language. Yesterday I was just minding my own business when I stumbled onto the ABC Livestream of the Arias case. I have not followed that case at all. There was a disclaimer that said something like, ‘Caution, viewer discretion advised.’ I thought Yeah Yeah, and I clicked.

            I have to tell ya, I was treated to something like 20 minutes of straight-up dirty sex talk! I swear to God! Even I can’t type what I heard, and I’m never shy with the language, LOL!

            Thanks for the vid, love Trent, because he is so to-the-point.

          • fauxmccoy says:
            March 5, 2013 at 8:44 am

            50 shades of grey legal areas? hmmmmm. could be a new literary genre … now you’ve got me thinking.

          • Crane-Station says:
            March 5, 2013 at 9:08 am

            Wow, me too, come to think of it.

          • fauxmccoy says:
            March 5, 2013 at 9:45 am

            we could consider a collaboratory literary effort – could be fun 🙂

          • Crane-Station says:
            March 5, 2013 at 10:12 am

            We GOT this.

            Lots of crocodile tears over on the OS comment thread on the Livestream this morning. Lots of cryin.’

          • jm says:
            March 5, 2013 at 10:16 am

            “Lots of crocodile tears over on the OS comment thread on the Livestream this morning. Lots of cryin.”

            I can’t get into the OS comment thread without signing up for something. What are they crying about?

          • Crane-Station says:
            March 5, 2013 at 10:27 am

            Cryin’ about how unfair the trial is going to be, because Trayvon was pictured younger someplace, at some time, plus a bunch of usual racist other cryin’ BS.

            Good Lord.

          • Xena says:
            March 5, 2013 at 5:32 pm

            @Crane-Station

            I have to tell ya, I was treated to something like 20 minutes of straight-up dirty sex talk!

            Jodi’s testimony is like her auditioning for porn. She intends to humiliate the victim and his family, but makes herself look like a slut. Re-direct started today but I missed it and have to catch up.

          • Crane-Station says:
            March 5, 2013 at 6:48 pm

            Totally weird, for someone who just tuned in yesterday. I was surprised they put that on mainstream media. Times have changed!

    • Crane-Station says:
      March 4, 2013 at 8:03 am

      “The person shall remain nameless.”

      This morning my eyes saw, “This person shall remain shameless.”

      Lord help us.

      LOL.

      Reply
  10. Opercarla says:
    March 3, 2013 at 10:12 pm

    LLMPapa…you are an absolute warrior!!! Bravo!

    Reply
  11. SupremeVictory says:
    March 3, 2013 at 10:12 pm

    GZ: And someone came an opened the door and I said help me help me
    And they said, I’ll call 911.
    I said no, help me help me, I need help.
    And I don’t know what they did, but uh…

    – GZ during reenactment.

    Will someone please tell me what TM was doing that allowed Zimm to have an UNINTERRUPTED dialogue with someone? TM is bashing, punching and covering GZ’s mouth yet GZ finds X seconds to have a conversation with someone?

    Reply
    • Two sides to a story says:
      March 3, 2013 at 11:18 pm

      SV, I’ve always wondered the same thing. It doesn’t compute.

      Reply
    • Rachael says:
      March 3, 2013 at 11:26 pm

      Are you talking about when trayvon was already shot andGZ was asking for help to “restrain” him so he told the person not to call 911 because he already did or the police were on theor way or something?

      Reply
      • Two sides to a story says:
        March 4, 2013 at 6:21 am

        It was when Jeremy went out, before the shot.

        Reply
      • SupremeVictory says:
        March 4, 2013 at 9:56 am

        No, this was allegedly going on while Martin was pounding away at him. Its like Martin stopped to give GZ a chance to ask someone for help.

        Reply
      • towerflower says:
        March 4, 2013 at 12:31 pm

        It was either Jeremy or John, GZ was asked if he could ID the person who came out and he said his eyes were filled with blood. The disappearing blood, that left no trails down his face.

        Reply
      • KittySP says:
        March 4, 2013 at 5:21 pm

        If it weren’t for the tragic ending to Trayvon’s life…this would be the most ridiculous, unbelievable, sorry excuse, of a lie one could come up with! Just lock this fool up already!

        Reply
    • looolooo says:
      March 4, 2013 at 1:46 pm

      Supreme V………I’ve asked the exact same question……. a few times. How could Z even see or hear someone while being simultaneously beaten and suffocated?! (and how Trayvon managed such a feat…… We’ll never know). Also….. If Trayvon’s sole purpose was to silence then kill GZ, why then would he allow him to converse with anyone? And how long was Trayvon willing to spend killing GZ before fleeing?! What was his end game?!

      Reply
  12. colin black says:
    March 3, 2013 at 9:38 pm

    fauxmccoy says:

    March 3, 2013 at 9:14 pm

    colin, i love you, man! the moobs is priceless and i just love the way your mind works.

    Thanks but I cant take credit for moobs.
    Its an actual word or at least a description of male breasts.
    In the uk we call em moobs.

    As to my mind it works in mysterious ways.
    An often doesnt work at all.
    Thanks for the compliment though you shouldnt encourage me realy.

    Reply
    • fauxmccoy says:
      March 3, 2013 at 9:53 pm

      we use ‘man boobs’ here, i may have heard ‘moobs’ before – but i maintain that i like the way you put it all together. yes, sometimes when i’m reading your posts, i occasionally feel like i am 25 years younger and have ingested a handful of shrooms, but at my age while being clean and sober, i consider that a good thing. that is what i enjoy – my own mind tends to work in surreal mode (my other fake internet name for years ‘sirrealmccoy’) and it’s a wonderful thing when one realizes that you don’t need drugs to go there. as salvador dali said “i don’t do drugs, i AM drugs”

      p.s. — i’ll encourage you all day and all night 🙂

      Reply
      • Frederick Leatherman says:
        March 3, 2013 at 10:12 pm

        I’ll bet you like Steven Wright.

        Reply
        • fauxmccoy says:
          March 3, 2013 at 10:23 pm

          am unfamiliar with his work – like you and crane, i decided to kill my tv long ago, so i can be a bit out of touch. will check out mr wright (and hope my husband doesn’t mind, as i’ve told him that HE was mr right) 😉

          although i am capable of straight, linear thought and practiced it well throughout my days as a student and a professional, disability has taken me on a different path. i have the freedom to let my mind roam in directions that i only did as a child/teen – before the shackles of bondage (i.e. working for a living) seemed to suck the creativity from my soul. i may have lost some, but i have gained much if you know what i mean.

          Reply
        • fauxmccoy says:
          March 3, 2013 at 10:29 pm

          omg – now i’m in love again. am watching videos, this dude says the same things i’ve been saying to my friends for years. i’m in heaven 🙂

          Reply
      • SpecialladyT says:
        March 4, 2013 at 8:18 am

        Thanks, doll!

        Reply
      • looolooo says:
        March 4, 2013 at 11:52 am

        Lol! If he’s not a fan now, he soon will be. Love Mr. Wright. He should’ve been one of the break out stand ups from the 80’s.

        “I’m not afraid of heights, I’m afraid of widths”. – Stephen Wright 🙂

        Reply
        • fauxmccoy says:
          March 4, 2013 at 12:12 pm

          i stayed up all night watching videos of steven wright and should have bought a box of depends first :/ 🙂 i’d be surprised if my husband got any sleep at all with me laughing so hard!

          Reply
      • groans says:
        March 4, 2013 at 3:11 pm

        I first saw Steven Wright on Johnny Carson in late 1984 (yup, I remember exactly where I was … and I should have been studying for exams).

        At first I wasn’t paying attention to the show, but when Steven Wright came on he quickly caught my attention. Line after line, I could NOT stop laughing!! I was exhausted at the end from laughing so hard.

        Ever since then, whenever I hear his name, I think of this:

        I have the world’s largest collection of seashells. I keep it scattered around the beaches of the world…. Perhaps you’ve seen it.

        Reply
        • fauxmccoy says:
          March 4, 2013 at 11:24 pm

          yes, his shell collection is spectacular – in fact, he lets me keep some in a jar in my bathroom. whadda guy!

          Reply
  13. colin black says:
    March 3, 2013 at 8:33 pm

    nocamo33 says:

    March 3, 2013 at 7:46 pm

    I would love to hear Knox’s response. Amazing how an agenda can lead to such sloppy research. I imagine Mr. Knox went in convinced Trayvon was on top and went about trying to prove it. As opposed to going in trying to find out what actually happened, he was trying to prove what he already believed. No doubt he will continue to stand by his “expert” testimony. Great job Papa. Continue to expose their lies. JFT is on it’s way, I pray there will be no delay!

    Mr Knox
    Have you seen a vt on youtube by a gentleman named LLMPapa?

    A…Oh yes Ive seen it chortle .

    Q..Why are you laughing ?

    A…Isnt it obvious everyone has different body shapes an when I gave my clothe sag description.Look back at the vt an my hand movements.
    At that precise momment I was useing myself as an example.

    Q..And

    A..Well when you have enormous moobs like I do .

    Q..Moobs.

    A..Yes moobs manboobs obviously I cause enormous sag when I lean over as all my garments are XXXL.
    An I wear a sports bra not because I do sports but it stops the nipple rash..

    Q Why are you on the defendants wittness list?

    A…Because he now is the proud host of moobs.

    Reply
  14. lsimon3321 says:
    March 3, 2013 at 8:33 pm

    I think the “Experts” demonstration is not helpful to GZ. It seemed to demonstrate IMO that both men may have been standing when the shot was delivered with GZ holding the outer shirt. I’ll keep watching and learning.

    Reply
  15. diaryofasuccessfulloser says:
    March 3, 2013 at 8:33 pm

    You bet this will go to trial. O’Mara never intended to have an immunity hearing. He files these crazy motions fully expecting some to get denied. Then he can announce to GZ’s followers that because no one will allow him the evidence he is entitled to, he has run out of time for an immunity hearing. That will be accepted by supporters enough for them to continue to send money. Keep in mind, the deadline to begin an immunity hearing is officially next month.

    Reply
  16. Jun says:
    March 3, 2013 at 8:32 pm

    Also the alleged weight of the can, does not prove any gravity theory either as the misalignment of the bulletholes with the trajectory is what blows away the whole gravity theory and on the bottom theory

    The only way for the bullet holes to line up is to pull the hoodie down and to the right of the victim’s body, forcefully by grip

    I read the reports and thought about this long ago

    A lot of Zidiots said I was making stuff up

    The forensics put a huge dent in the defendant’s story because by gripping the victim by the shirt and forcefully pulling him towards him and pulling the shirt downward and to the right of the victim’s body while pointing a gun at him, shows he was holding the victim at gunpoint

    The good thing about the forensic evidence is it is based on science, not witnesses, witnesses which could potentially lie

    The forensics also back up or disprove witnesses

    Reply
    • ladystclaire says:
      March 3, 2013 at 9:43 pm

      And again, I’ve ALWAYS said he was holding this child at gunpoint. the thing with that, is his lil neighborhood buddies saw it and yet they chose to lie for him and, keep their mouths shut.

      These people need to do the right thing and tell the truth for once in their lives. I believe they are not only afraid of Fogen but, Taaffe and Osterman as well because, either one or both of them were there that night. the Jackass was in the forefront of this murder but, he also had a little help from his friends.

      Reply
      • looolooo says:
        March 3, 2013 at 11:12 pm

        lsc……. i don’t recall which video, but Trent had one where he states that he believes that GZ (remember the knocking sounds) took a short cut through one of the John’s homes (front to back) in order to sneak up on Trayvon. remember DD saying that Trayvon told her that GZ seemed to suddenly apear “right on my ass”? also, Trent thinks that FT or MO was the ‘old dude’ (staring at him like he’s crazy) that Trayvon told DD about, and was the man wearing the white t-shirt.

        i personaly don’t have a problem with that scenerio. what about you?

        poor Trayvon must’ve been scared out of his mind!

        Reply
      • Two sides to a story says:
        March 3, 2013 at 11:14 pm

        Oh, if someone saw that and isn’t saying anything – grrr, grrr, grrr.

        Reply
      • ay2z says:
        March 3, 2013 at 11:55 pm

        The tapping sounds like tapping of the flashlight to get it to come on. (Serino says that his does it, and he had to tap fogen’s to get it working)

        Trent’s video reminded me of what could be a shot-like /door slam sound in Witness 11’s 911 call. It’s a very loud and sharp sound, like a whip crack and echo report. Thought that might be a screen door or interior door slam that could relate to ‘Jeremy get in here’. Sure sounds like it could be mistaken for some ‘warning’ shot.

        http://trayvon.axiomamnesia.com/trayvon-martin-911-calls-audio/

        Reply
        • Xena says:
          March 4, 2013 at 12:31 am

          @ay2z

          Thought that might be a screen door or interior door slam that could relate to ‘Jeremy get in here’.

          IMO, it was the sound that led Jenna to say “Stop” such as stop running in and out slamming the door.

          Reply
      • ay2z says:
        March 4, 2013 at 12:43 am

        Xena, yeah. The person or persons who opened doors, would have prompted the killer to take action sooner than later, knowing people were calling. He had little time, he said it himself on Hannity, there was no more time.

        Reply
        • Xena says:
          March 4, 2013 at 12:56 am

          @ay2z. Oh yeah. The killer and accused murderer of Trayvon Martin was “out of time.” The cops were coming. The kid would not stop screaming. GZ did not want the cops arriving finding him standing there with his gun, as he told Hannity. GZ had to shut him up, get his gun back in the holster then feel the kid’s dead body up to see if there was anything to help his story.

          Reply
    • PiranhaMom says:
      March 4, 2013 at 12:53 am

      @ Jun –

      Keep in mind, Jun, as the Professor reported last summer, BOTH the hoodie AND the sweatshirt Trayvon wore under the hoodie, had MATCHING bullet holes at the SAME “stretch distance” on each, created by Zimmerman’s grab & grasp of the shirts.

      The “stretchability” of both sirts would be determined by the tighter-knit one.

      Also, keep in mind that with Trayvon under Zimmerman with his back flat to the earth, not all of the “stretch” would be available to the grasp, because a foot or so of the shirt back would be sandwiched between Trayvon’s back and the lawn area. If they were both standing, there would have been a deeper pull, because ALL of the shirts’ stretch capablility would be available.

      Still waiting for the fiber evidence …

      Reply
    • amsterdam1234 says:
      March 4, 2013 at 8:21 am

      Anybody considered the fact that the photobutton on Trayvon’s hoody, was located right over his heart, at the same spot where the bullet penetrated his chest?
      If GZ wanted to kill Trayvon and hit his heart, he may have wanted the button out of the way.

      Reply
      • blushedbrown says:
        March 4, 2013 at 8:39 am

        Weird thing.

        Serino’s report says the photo pin was on the sweatshirt.
        Ayala’s report says he retrieved from his pockets.

        It may be that the photo pin was removed from the sweatshirt during CPR and placed into his pockets for safe keeping for evidence.

        I have often wondered if Trayvon took the pin off and put it in his pocket because it was raining.

        Or did LE remove it?

        Reply
        • Frederick Leatherman says:
          March 4, 2013 at 8:59 am

          Trayvon was wearing it in the 7-11 and I doubt he would have taken it off after he left.

          I suspect it was removed during CPR. It must have been close to the entry wound.

          The fogen may have had to adjust its position by nudging it with the muzzle of the gun so that he could get a clear shot at the heart. Makes me wonder if there may be any soot or blood spatter on the back side.

          If he did nudge it out of the way, that would be evidence of premeditation.

          The marks created by the pin mechanism should still be detectable in the fabric.

          Reply
      • amsterdam1234 says:
        March 4, 2013 at 9:00 am

        @ blushedbrown
        Ayala said the bullet hole was under the photobutton. I have to check if this was in the police report or in later interviews. Be right back.

        Reply
      • amsterdam1234 says:
        March 4, 2013 at 9:05 am

        Page 2 second dump. Memo about interview with Ayala. “Ayala saw a gunshot wound on his torso under a photo button Martin was wearing”.

        Reply
      • amsterdam1234 says:
        March 4, 2013 at 9:17 am

        @prof
        If GZ pulled the shirts down, the button would moved down and to the right of the bullet hole in Trayvon’s chest.
        I do think it is premeditation. Pulling a shirt down 3 inches requires quite some pull. If they were up, standing or on their knees, I can see GZ pulling Trayvon down towards him.
        But if GZ was on top, it doesn’t make sense unless he wanted to move the phot button out of the way.

        Reply
      • LLMPapa says:
        March 4, 2013 at 11:25 am

        Just hang on till “Part Five – The Conclusion”, my friend. I saved the button, and the best, for last.

        Reply
      • amsterdam1234 says:
        March 4, 2013 at 1:59 pm

        @LLMPapa

        I love all your videos, but this serie is the best. You and Dave are doing the work the media is neglecting to do.

        I can’t wait for the next episodes. I should’ve known you wouldn’t have missed a detail like that.

        Reply
    • Tzar says:
      March 4, 2013 at 10:04 am

      you said too much
      how would the can pull down the inner shirt?

      Reply
  17. diaryofasuccessfulloser says:
    March 3, 2013 at 8:25 pm

    Now someone needs to contact a news station, show them the original I-want-to-sell-copies-of-my-book conclusion with the conclusion generated from LLMPapa’s four-part videos. An analyst needs to have Knox respond to this along with another independent analyst (with no dogs in the fight). Now THAT wold be very interesting! How dare Knox conclude that Trayvon was on top!

    Reply
  18. colin black says:
    March 3, 2013 at 8:18 pm

    Brought that over from the other posr.
    Didnt realise the water torture would be litterall.

    Drip drip drip will turn into a tidal wave to wash all fogens bs down the sewer were it belongs

    Reply
  19. colin black says:
    March 3, 2013 at 8:15 pm

    colin black says:

    March 3, 2013 at 4:48 pm

    Searchingmind
    LLMPapa
    Statoftheinternet an all of us in some way are the equivilent.
    Of Chinease water tortute on foggen.

    The victim would be imobilised stapped to a platform .
    Unable to move his head left or right or up or down..
    Remember thease people had absulutely no idea what lay in wait for them..
    Then left alone in complete darkness.
    An ice cold drip of water would land directly on the centre of his or her fore head at totaly random times…

    No one peice of evidence disputes his version of events
    When one person seeks to rewrite history.
    Countles facts of reality start to drip on an wear away the false naritive.

    If this goes to trial of course he will receive a fair trial.
    But a fair trial an a fair an just jury will still convict him.
    Thats because i m o he has telegraphed his guilt from the gett go.
    For some one whos defence is based on his honesty an his verion of what occoured that night.
    He has also telegraphed his willingness to lie .
    If on the night of the murder he was willing an able to lie to LE .
    About his record been arrested charged ect NO Sir
    Sqeakie Clean..
    Lie about his Educatioal qualifications.
    An yet he expects us to beleive him about the Murder.

    Went on to prove he has no qualms lieing to the courts either his excuse?
    Doesnt trust the system.
    Another Ironic twist this case the Martins Trayvons Parents Tracy an Sabrina also didnt trust the system.

    Reply
    • Crane-Station says:
      March 3, 2013 at 8:36 pm

      “He has also telegraphed his willingness to lie .”

      Well, and he also likely telephoned some people. Can’t wait to see those records.

      Reply
      • ladystclaire says:
        March 3, 2013 at 9:28 pm

        @Crane-Station, I myself can’t wait to see those records and, it obvious there is some juicy stuff there because of both sides wanting to keep them sealed until trial. IMO he really let it all hang out as far as his racism is concerned. he can shed his fat tears in court all he wants to, everything he is going through is GOD’S plan for breaking one of the ten commandments. “thou shalt not kill” and since he broke that commandment, let him suffer for what he did. GOD is in control and, Fogen is going to cry many many more days.

        His tears are for no one but himself and, whats going to happen to him. he has no remorse for what he did to a child who was minding his own business. so what ever happens to him, he is very deserving of it.

        Reply
      • Crane-Station says:
        March 3, 2013 at 10:21 pm

        Good point, ladystclaire. Last time I checked that rule about not killing was pretty straight forward.

        Reply
  20. Crane-Station says:
    March 3, 2013 at 8:02 pm

    Well, now that Mr. Fake-Ass Expert has decided to mention weight and gravity as well, perhaps there would also be a way to employ the equations of physics, to further blow this Fake-Ass Expert out of the water, although, this series is about as powerful as it gets. I hope they do this whole demonstration right there in the courtroom.

    Well done.

    Reply
    • Frederick Leatherman says:
      March 3, 2013 at 8:20 pm

      I think this is a fabulous opportunity for a courtroom demonstration.

      Una maravilla fantastica

      Waitin’ fer de rod

      Not A-rod, dummy!

      Dee-Rod.

      Reply
    • shannoninmiami says:
      March 3, 2013 at 11:40 pm

      mine neither! and I deleted my cookies and tried google crome browser earlier but it still didn’t work..
      and it’s not working on my iphone either!!!!!!!!!

      Reply
      • gbrbsb says:
        March 4, 2013 at 9:36 pm

        Hi Shannoninmiami, sorry to go off topic but I’m desperate. I believe since around the time you and “Thats_so_not_racist” started to “follow” my wordpress “blog” (it’s not a real blog just a place I put things I write or like) neither my notification icon on the menu bar nor my notifications page is showing me the replies I get from comments here. The only notifications I get now is that you and TSNR are “following” my blog which I never got before so It occurred to me it could have something to do with it. Could you un-follow my blog and I have asked TSNR if he/she could do the same to see if it starts working again, it may even be why yours are not working too… otherwise I am well and truly stumped! Thanks.

        Reply
        • shannoninmiami says:
          March 4, 2013 at 10:34 pm

          ok, i’m doing it right now. but i just got your notification, but it says 9:36 pm and i just came to the site so i wouldn’t have seen it anyway.

          let me know if you see this comment.. did you talk to wordpress?

          Reply
        • shannoninmiami says:
          March 4, 2013 at 10:34 pm

          ok i just unfollowed, how’s that?

          Reply
          • gbrbsb says:
            March 4, 2013 at 10:57 pm

            You will never guess the coincidence!
            Not 5 mins ago I got a reply from WordPress Support telling loads of users with similar, but not the same malfunction, that the notification problem was at their end and now fixed. Then just as I was about to check, the menu bar icon lit up with a reply from TSNR unfollowing! Then then just as I clicked my thank you to TSNR, the icon lit up again and, et voilà your reply!

            So, yes it’s working but as it was working minutes before you unfollowed I think it was not the following but WP. So as I also replied to TSNR, thank you so much for your help and feel welcome there anytime except there is not much to see as yet but if I post anything of interest I can let you know.

            P.S. problem has had be

          • shannoninmiami says:
            March 4, 2013 at 11:04 pm

            mine too. it’s working now because i just got your notice too!
            thank god, it sure was annoying!!LOL

          • gbrbsb says:
            March 4, 2013 at 11:08 pm

            Annoying, you could say that! It’s had me daily running disk clean ups on my mac, reinstalling chrome, changing and re changing all the WP preferences, etc. etc. Thanks again.

          • shannoninmiami says:
            March 4, 2013 at 11:12 pm

            Oh me too! i got obsessed i tried all kinds of stuff and spent time i’ll never get back on this drama! i was distracted for days.LOL
            so now we’re set for tomorrows hearing. see ya at 9am. i’m gonna watch it online, probably cnn.
            I never realized how important that feature is..

  21. Big Willie says:
    March 3, 2013 at 7:56 pm

    Uhh oh, the poop is about to hit the fan! Looking forward to part 4. Thanks LLMPAPA. You are so on point (literally and figuratively), I almost called you “Big Poppa”!

    Reply
  22. Two sides to a story says:
    March 3, 2013 at 7:55 pm

    Kewl. Thank you.

    No one mentions the AZ drink in his hoody pocket. I doubt that causes a 4″ sag either, but would change things depending on Trayvon’s position. I would think it would make the most difference in a freestanding position – I hope this is what gets really interesting.

    Reply
    • You all have thoughtful comments says:
      March 3, 2013 at 8:19 pm

      I am not sure about the can. Could George have put the can in Trayvon’s pocket after he shot Trayvon.

      Remember, Trayvon chose to carry it in the 7-11 bag out of the store. At the store, he only put the Skittles in his pocket.

      We also know that the 7-11 bag was found on the ground at the crime scene.

      To see Trayvon putting the Skittles in his pocket, go to timestamp 3:38 of this video.

      [By the way, the ending of this video is in slow motion and helps you see that Trayvon’s sweatshirt was not baggy on him and did not hang out from his body when he lean over as he got money out of his left, front pant pocket.]
      .

      Reply
      • You all have thoughtful comments says:
        March 3, 2013 at 8:31 pm

        What do you think gz saw when he told the NEN dispatcher, “He has something in his hand”?

        I, myself, think that he saw the 7-11 bag in Trayvon’s hand.

        Reply
        • Xena says:
          March 3, 2013 at 9:07 pm

          @yahtc

          What do you think gz saw when he told the NEN dispatcher, “He has something in his hand”?

          IMO, it was Trayvon’s cell phone that he removed from inside where it was clipped to his clothing, and took a photo of GZ during the time when his call with DeeDee disconnected before he ran.

          Look at BDLR’s expressions in court. At the hearing when O’Mara talked about Trayvon’s phone data for 2/26/12, I could see confidence as well as “Gotcha” all over BDLR’s face.

          Reply
      • towerflower says:
        March 3, 2013 at 8:54 pm

        I don’t believe TM hit him with the can, the can did not appear to be damaged from hitting someone with it no does it appear to have lost it’s seal.

        But I think that LLMPapa should put a can of the drink in the pocket and measure it again just to be on the safe side. The skittles were also in the hoodie pocket.

        Reply
      • lsimon3321 says:
        March 3, 2013 at 8:59 pm

        I think he saw the cellphone in TM’s hands IF he saw his hands at all. TM may have been holding his wet sweatpants (?) up through his top to keep his hands as warm as possible.

        Reply
      • You all have thoughtful comments says:
        March 3, 2013 at 9:46 pm

        Yes, Xena and Isimom,

        There is a VERY good chance that Trayvon did take out his cellphone.

        Perhaps, if he did, Trayvon at that time put his bagged drink in the front pocket of his sweatshirt.

        Reply
        • Xena says:
          March 3, 2013 at 10:00 pm

          @yahtc. “He’s coming to check me out. He’s got something in his hands. I don’t know what his deal is.” Translate, Trayvon was taking a photo or video.

          Then think …
          “Shit. He’s running.” And subsequently, “I don’t want to give it all out. I don’t know where this kid is.”

          Those words encapsulate GZ’s knowledge that Trayvon made a record of what GZ looked like giving GZ more reason to pursue Trayvon and retain him. And I still believe that GZ had and used that tactical flashlight in a threatening way because he booked out of his truck without any hesitation with that flashlight.

          Did Trayvon get that in a photo or video?

          It’s one thing to be the person sounding all cop-like reporting a suspicious person. It’s another to have a kid call the cops and have a photo or video of the creep following them.

          Reply
      • Cercando Luce says:
        March 3, 2013 at 10:12 pm

        Xena,
        Oh my– that would be like that 2004 photo of the tsunami approaching. It offers additional motive for defendant to give chase (“You can’t take a picture of ME!”).

        Reply
        • Xena says:
          March 3, 2013 at 10:29 pm

          @Cercando Luce

          Xena,
          Oh my– that would be like that 2004 photo of the tsunami approaching. It offers additional motive for defendant to give chase (“You can’t take a picture of ME!”).

          Have you noticed there are three objects that GZ does not mention when they dropped during the altercation? His key chain flashlight, his tactical flashlight, and Trayvon’s cell phone. GZ does not want to bring attention to those objects. That is why my attention is brought to an association with the tactical flashlight and possibility that Trayvon captured it on photo or video.

          Reply
      • Donna Flores says:
        March 3, 2013 at 11:20 pm

        Could explain how the blood got on the shirt underneath.

        Reply
      • groans says:
        March 4, 2013 at 12:24 am

        @ Xena, re:

        IMO, [Trayvon] … took a photo of GZ.

        OMG, that would be way too good to be true. I don’t dare even hold my breath on that one – BUT if it turns out to be true, I will be thinking: “Dang, Xena … you saw that one coming miles ahead of time!” And I’ll be sending major kudos your way!

        Reply
        • Xena says:
          March 4, 2013 at 12:48 am

          @groans

          BUT if it turns out to be true, I will be thinking: “Dang, Xena … you saw that one coming miles ahead of time!” And I’ll be sending major kudos your way!

          Nah. I don’t need credit.

          Just watch BDLR when O’Mara and West are giving oral argument. No worries. No concerns. Let the defense have whatever they want. Then listen to O’Mara and Junior afterwards. They got what they wanted, but it wasn’t what they wanted to see or know.

          Most people can’t wait for the immunity hearing and/or trial, while O’Mara doesn’t want to proceed to either. Wonder why? Because he has the damning evidence against GZ. It wasn’t self-defense. GZ is guilty of 2nd degree murder.

          Something else to think about too — GZ knew Trayvon was talking on his phone because it was in doing that, that GZ heard and located Trayvon. Those who think they hear Trayvon saying “I don’t know” might have been his answer to GZ assuming Trayvon was on the phone with the cops and asking him the name of the person he was talking to. Does that make sense when combined with the thought that GZ saw Trayvon using his phone to photograph or video?

          Reply
      • KittySP says:
        March 4, 2013 at 4:56 pm

        Hmmm…lets say for arguments sake he did happen to snap a pic of GZ thinking he would show to Tracy and Brandi the creepy man stalking him, in hopes she could ID creepy GZ! Oh, what a gift that would be!

        Reply
    • SpecialladyT says:
      March 4, 2013 at 6:11 am

      Hey Xena, which hearing are you speaking of when you see BDLR give O’Mara the look of confidence. I want to look at that again, but I don’t recall which hearing since O’Mara has been so repetitive with his frivolous motions. lol

      Reply
      • Xena says:
        March 4, 2013 at 7:06 am

        @Speciallady T. It was the last 2 hearings. More specifically, check out BDLR just before and during his presentation of the material given to him by Baez; when he mentions the 2 voices captured on the 911 call; and when he explains about Trayvon’s cell phone analysis for 2/26/12;

        Reply
      • Tzar says:
        March 4, 2013 at 9:12 am

        @xena
        I am pretty confident that BLDR has proof of who is screaming
        it’s all in his cross of the killer’s father regarding the screams
        he tried to give the defense a hint
        they refuse to take it

        Reply
        • Xena says:
          March 4, 2013 at 9:57 am

          @Tzar Good morning!

          I am pretty confident that BLDR has proof of who is screaming it’s all in his cross of the killer’s father regarding the screams
          he tried to give the defense a hint
          they refuse to take it

          Oh, I think O’Mara got the hint and the evidence. GZ knows about it too, which is why he wants to delay trial long enough to get more donations so he will have money to run and hide.

          Reply
  23. nocamo33 says:
    March 3, 2013 at 7:46 pm

    I would love to hear Knox’s response. Amazing how an agenda can lead to such sloppy research. I imagine Mr. Knox went in convinced Trayvon was on top and went about trying to prove it. As opposed to going in trying to find out what actually happened, he was trying to prove what he already believed. No doubt he will continue to stand by his “expert” testimony. Great job Papa. Continue to expose their lies. JFT is on it’s way, I pray there will be no delay!

    Reply
    • Malisha says:
      March 3, 2013 at 10:43 pm

      Tell me how THIS physical thing happens:

      Trayvon is “mounted” [Fogen’s word, which he uses a LOT] on top of Fogen, smashing his head and punching him and smothering him;

      Fogen is underneath Trayvon, shimmying, and his jacket rides up;

      Trayvon changes his posture and his angle of combat in order to look down and check out the new situation that has arisen since the shimmy and the jacket rising. I mean, wouldn’t any murderous thug do the same?

      Fogen “feels like” Trayvon sees his gun so he does two things: (a) he remembers that he has “the” gun; and (b) he simultaneously “pinches” Trayvon’s hand and reaches for, gets, and pulls out of the holster “the” gun, which he then aims at Trayvon’s chest in the small amount of room formed in the “crevice” between Trayvon’s chest and Fogen’s prone, tortured body.

      And shoots one time. (shrug, smirk)

      Excuse me. Physically now, using the laws of physics. HOW?

      The short answer is: NOT.

      The long answer is: Fogen cannot get the gun to aim a bullet directly into Trayvon’s chest while Trayvon stays mounted on Fogen and Fogen lies pinned beneath him. If he was able to do that he would have been able to throw Trayvon off him long before the shimmy-jacket-pinch ever happened.

      Which brings us right back to the short answer: NOT.

      No expert in the world can change that. Knox can get the pox, others can’t have their druthers, it cannot be done and it won’t be happenin’ — O’Mara better get his PTSD motion filed, pronto.

      Reply
      • PiranhaMom says:
        March 4, 2013 at 12:17 am

        @Malisha –

        You have to wonder why Serino and the rest of the cops out at the kill site interviewing Zimmerputz didn’t bust a gut with Zim re-enacting(with emphasis on “act”) his PINCHING strategy of grasping Trayvon’s wandering hand between Zim’s manboob and bicep – then immediately lifting the very same arm (thus immediately releasing Trayvon’s hand/arm) to get his gun out from under his – Zimmerman’s – ass.

        That’s gotta be the world’s shortest pinch! What — three seconds or less?

        And BTW – from Zim’s story, that is the ONLY pro-active DEFENSIVE move Zim made with his hands & arms all the time Trayvon was supposedly beating the holy crud out of Zimputz’s brains.

        Maybe he was busy practicing his “c’mon a my house” roundie hand gestures for his big performance later with the cops …

        Reply
    • pat deadder says:
      March 4, 2013 at 8:05 am

      Yea but the so called expert shot from a standing position.

      Reply
      • SpecialladyT says:
        March 4, 2013 at 8:27 am

        Exactly! The so-called “expert” did NOT recreate what what fogen told the PD. He used two T-shirts, cardboard and didn’t perform the reenactments lying down as fogen states.

        This Knox is a joke and all he is interested in is hawking his book!

        Reply
  24. Xena says:
    March 3, 2013 at 7:42 pm

    LLMPapa, I so appreciate your patience, ability to work to show, and I love your attitude. Get him, LLMPapa. Gethimgethimgethim. Get “Mr. Expert.”

    Reply
  25. looneydoone says:
    March 3, 2013 at 7:32 pm

    Am on pins and needles awaiting Part IV

    LLMPapa, you are the best !!
    Hacks like Knox need to be exposed. Thank you.

    Reply
    • groans says:
      March 4, 2013 at 12:05 am

      It’s amazing (not) how different things appear when you more closely replicate the actual conditions of an event. Are you a rocket scientist, LLMPapa, or just plain logical?

      Reply

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